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[mikebrenner] 23/3/2019 09:55

Just purchased and read ISO doc this am ... clear that graphene is single layer, 2D graphene material is less than 10 layer and anything above is bulk material (graphite). Lots of definition about quality, flake properties and measurement techniques which seems to align with previous NPL docs. Now need to understand process for bodies like the NPL to be accredited by the ISO for testing "graphene and 2D materials" ... bet that takes some time ... and then you need standards for testing its performance as its mixed with other materials ... lots of work to come and progress to be made but IMO we are on the right track.

[ellissj] 23/3/2019 09:27

Sams comments borne out by this research paper imo ! Conclusions below. "As such, the samples we characterized appeared to consist of 3–4 monolayers of graphene. This may suggest that other such commercial graphene samples are not of monolayer character." Dyor. Best ellis

4. Concluding remarks

"The physical properties of graphene are intimately dependent on its thickness and surface structure. Understanding the surface structure of graphene is also important to its integration in composite materials and its bioanalytic applications. In this study, XRR was used to study the thickness of commercially sourced graphene prepared using the CVD method on Si/SiO2 in air at different temperatures for the first time. Such graphene samples have been widely used in research and applications on monolayer graphene. Complementary techniques as AFM, XPS, and PEEM have been used to provide information on topography and chemical compositions of the graphene layer. Our XRR and AFM results show that the thickness of the graphene layer was ∼13.0 ± 1.0 ;Å and 13.9 ± 0.7 Å, respectively, corresponding to 3–4 graphene monolayers. As such, the samples we characterized appeared to consist of 3–4 monolayers of graphene. This may suggest that other such commercial graphene samples are not of monolayer character. Given that XRR has not been previously widely used for studying the graphene structure, we hope to stimulate further investigations rather than regarding our conclusions as certainty and applicable to all commercial graphene samples. The XPS and PEEM results suggest the presence of PMMA residues from the transfer process of graphene fabrication. In addition, isolated islands of multilayer graphene were also present atop the FLG layer. We also observed a slight but detectable increase of 0.5–0.9 Å in the graphene layer thickness as it was heated from room temperature to 60 °C. This thermal expansion was irreversible, with the graphene thickness increasing a further 0.5 Å upon cooling back to room temperature. Such temperature dependent graphene thickness could be attributed to the out of plane rippling behaviour of graphene upon heating as previously reported. We should acknowledge that our conclusions on the temperature dependence of the graphene sample thickness are tentative at this stage, and more measurements are needed to further verify these interesting and important observations. These results on the FLG surface structure and chemistry are valuable to its potential bioanalytical applications where its interactions with biomolecules are an important consideration."

[clint fleecewood] 23/3/2019 09:15

Big news on ISO. Expecting a flying start on Monday.

[grabster] 23/3/2019 09:13

Yes. Lots of work going on in medical applications of graphene.

[bobsworth] 23/3/2019 08:40

Good to see this iso standards paper is finally published!

That's going to put the cat amongst the pigeons!

[superg1] 23/3/2019 08:35

Menicus

A quick example, there are plenty

[superg1] 23/3/2019 08:33

Meniscus.

All sorts of such trials are in play including possibly the regrowth of the spinal cord by putting microscopic carbon fibres covered in graphene into nerves then joining them. The belief is the nerve will then regrow along the fibres.

[spid81] 23/3/2019 08:33

Graham Wood - Superg1,


This would have to be the most stupid thing I have ever read
I am lost for words at how stupid this is, I am really embarrassed for you.
Single layer has a surface area of 2630m3 per Gram,
Nanene has a surface are of 45m2 per gram.

My advice, please read up on BET surface area, this is how Nanene is measured and all other graphene. the method uses gas to determine the surface area. you do not stack the graphene on its edge,



according Quantachrome equipment, nanene having a surface area of 45m2 would suggest it is much thicker that the reported FLG, it would be approximately 25-100 layers = Graphite as per ISO.

Wow and your giving people research advice on graphene,






onone2

I can explain that as I asked the question long ago and once again it has been covered many times here.

If you saw recent posts, a few grams contain trillions of platelets.

Now when we see a gram a pile it isn't 1,315 m2 laid out on a table, as that is what it would need if they were laid out edge to edge

What some do, which apparently do which isn't the scientific correct way, is simply to take the surface area of graphene then divide it by then number of platelet layers to give a per m2 number.

That's not how it works in reality. In their raw form and mixed into something they overlap.

So the m2 figures are based on the point.

The info is there for all to read and has been covered repeatedly.

[ellissj] 23/3/2019 08:23

Here's the proposed standards paper. Have to wait and see if this is mirrored in final standards. Does anybody know what's likely ? Anyway, the proposal says : Gnp's. = Layers of gaphene defined by lateral and thickness measurements. Standards formalise the market so buyers know they are buying 2D materials versus 3D materials. Brings order to the chaos, and helps the industry emerge from the darkness of 'what actually is graphene/2D materials' and how do we measure, define and record them as such, bringing confidence to the marketplace. Looking fwd to further news from vrs. Dyor. Best ellis

"3.1.2.11

graphene nanoplate

graphene nanoplatelet

GNP

nanoplate (3.1.1.2) consisting of graphene layers (3.1.2.1)

Note 1 to entry: GNPs typically have thickness of between 1 nm to 3 nm and lateral dimensions ranging from approximately 100 nm to 100 µm..."

[wuzy] 23/3/2019 08:14

Super, in all your research is there anyone out there that actually produces graphene apart from us,cheers

[f3rdinand] 23/3/2019 08:10

Who's buying it then?

[superg1] 23/3/2019 08:09

Just double checked and imo Direct don't do anything at all that will qualify as graphene nano platelets.

Now I steer well clear well clear of anyone that claims to do graphene and doesn't. They know they are lying, they are in the sector.

I steer well clear as I have read countless science pares on the topic along with an engineer and a scientists, we all reviewed them.

The conclusion was taken from the conclusions in the various science papers. That is why the ISO is coming in to end the fraud claims about graphene production.

[ellissj] 23/3/2019 08:06

Great news iso is here. Breaks a log jam to my mind :) glalth. Best ellis

[dgduncan] 23/3/2019 08:04

ISO standard now on sale for CHF 88.

[rafboy] 23/3/2019 08:02

superg1 ISO published, what next?

[rafboy] 23/3/2019 07:46

Ewads is that the ISO published?

[superg1] 23/3/2019 07:44

As for Directa, that too has been covered many times.

There has been nothing I have seen to date to suggest they produce graphene. They do produce a lot of graphite platelets but no evidence any material production of graphene.

Their limited detail data sheets showed graphite.

As potential customer I emailed them to get the data, I approached about 6 different email routes in a friendly way. I got one reply on the best person to contact, no reply from them so I tried various others. Not one reply.

Here you go have a look at their data sheet page re products. No, your computer hasn't gone wrong. I didn't realise they have now removed any little data that could be viewed.

[ewads] 23/3/2019 07:42

Did you hear it here first?

[superg1] 23/3/2019 07:34

onone2

I can explain that as I asked the question long ago and once again it has been covered many times here.

If you saw recent posts, a few grams contain trillions of platelets.

Now when we see a gram a pile it isn't 1,315 m2 laid out on a table, as that is what it would need if they were laid out edge to edge

What some do, which apparently do which isn't the scientific correct way, is simply to take the surface area of graphene then divide it by then number of platelet layers to give a per m2 number.

That's not how it works in reality. In their raw form and mixed into something they overlap.

So the m2 figures are based on the point.

The info is there for all to read and has been covered repeatedly.

[spid81] 22/3/2019 21:50

Good Evening all,

According to Patrick's Abbott marketing companies website 'Global marketing Solutions', you will also be tied up with his firm.

Coming Soon : New parent Tech company Versarien (about 1/3 down on the page)



This might be nothing, But I am very surprised when SuperG1 was looking on Patrick's Abbott's LinkedIn page he didn;t say anything about Patrick's own 'Graphene Nano Technology' business.





I guess there isn't much of a conflict of interest there, it is not like his is looking to sell graphene or trying to meet with companies to push his own product. oh wait he is....

[ellissj] 22/3/2019 21:45

Thx aintree, I enjoy it too much tbh, it's taking me away from other things i should be doing lol. 2D world is fascinating and their potential staggering ! Pleased to be invested in vrs on many levels. Atb. ellis.