Share Name Share Symbol Market Type Share ISIN Share Description
Versarien LSE:VRS London Ordinary Share GB00B8YZTJ80 ORD 1P
  Price Change % Change Share Price Shares Traded Last Trade
  +13.00p +17.69% 86.50p 2,517,655 15:16:26
Bid Price Offer Price High Price Low Price Open Price
85.00p 88.00p 89.50p 73.50p 73.50p
Industry Sector Turnover (m) Profit (m) EPS - Basic PE Ratio Market Cap (m)
Industrial Engineering 5.9 -2.2 -1.9 - 128.60

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Versarien (VRS) Top Chat Posts

DateSubject
23/5/2018
09:20
Versarien Daily Update: Versarien is listed in the Industrial Engineering sector of the London Stock Exchange with ticker VRS. The last closing price for Versarien was 73.50p.
Versarien has a 4 week average price of 58.50p and a 12 week average price of 58.50p.
The 1 year high share price is 120p while the 1 year low share price is currently 12.25p.
There are currently 148,665,029 shares in issue and the average daily traded volume is 681,851 shares. The market capitalisation of Versarien is £130,081,900.38.
03/5/2018
11:46
anley: It looks to me that VRS and NR have brought together as much information on a proposed JV with 3 Chinese partners. I am pleased PWC (VRS auditors) are involved to give advice and I presume all the positives and negitives are included in the paper work.................. BUT VRS now have to pick and choose with partners who take their time and I go back to what I said a week ago that we shareholders will be lucky if we hear or see and news until the end of our summer. What is helpful is that in the event of a no deal what has been learn't will be helpful if this is a policy route to be taken by VRS..............we shall have to wait and see and in the meantime the team can get on with developing the business. I was speaking to a friend of mine engaged in financing Biotech in Cambridge and he felt as a shareholder in VRS that the market was re-rating VRS share price and perhaps the 60's level is about right for the time being until the market saw sales starting to flow. Who knows but a thought from another shareholder.
30/4/2018
16:57
ridicule: China has never been a given. We need to focus on what, apart from China, takes the VRS share price north of £1. I suggest achieving sales from today's announcements at good margins will get us there. The current shares in issue are 148.67m. Lets assume a modest p/e of 15; this requires an eps of 7p to get us just over £1. A £50m turnover with a profit margin of 30% produces a profit of £15m that equates to an eps of 10p = £1.50 per share on a p/e of 15. Today's announcement alone could get us there quite quickly. Why do I produce these illusrative numbers? First, as I have said many times before, it enables objectivity. Second, today's RNS for the first time, articulates a clear and plausible path to commercial exploitation of Nanene at scale, a massive plus. Third, Neill wobbled on China in the podcast to a point where it does not take much to deduce it may not happen. Today's announcement though makes it less critical that China does happen in terms of underpinning a share price north of £1, particularly if the Chinese valuation of VRS gives us a bad deal. That is why today's announcement is so great, it articualtes an undersatandable route to commercialisation that can be believed and takes away the 'all or nothing' scenario. Against this logic, selling in the mid 70s today on China doubts is not the smartest strategy if you are looking for the really big gains investing in VRS are likely to bring. I topped up some more, but I retain my Tern offset risk management holding and that rose another 17.6% today. I still want China to happen along with everyone else, as long its a good deal, but it should not become a sword of Damocles.
28/4/2018
10:41
ridicule: You just can’t let it go can you lucky! Let me try one more time and I am speaking here as an investor, not as ‘Groupie’; to a particular share. A share five bags between November and January, creating significant wealth, particularly for large holders, but for everyone who holds. This is a very rare event and top slicing 25% to secure some of those gains, retaining 75% is just common sense in terms of risk management. This is particularly true when the share in question has left its trading fundamentals behind. If one has no idea what to do with the realised money - reinvest in momentum shares with more defined trading prospects; buy a new car; pay off some of the mortgage etc etc, then there is a case to do what you are doing and sell no shares at all until the big news arrives and everything you ever invested in that share takes off with it. I am not castigating you for your view, I cannot understand why you insist on castigating me for my view. The fact, as you posit, that indiviual PIs have more influence over a share price than market makers or institutions that are selling like Miton is fanciful. As it happens, I am tens of thousands better off having top sliced and reinvested in momentum shares that had announced firm trading prospects, as opposed to collaborations that may, probably will, come good. I still have a very substantial holding here to cover that event and I am delighted at the firmness shown to the VRS share price last week, now that Miton have stopped selling and I did top up with more VRS during last week’s dip. I could of course cash in all my recent offset investments profits on Monday and reinvest in VRS, and on a rough calculation increase my pre-Christmas VRS holding by 30% through the profit realised since January. I do not think I will do that, however, because the sales model for, dare I mention Tern, has every tech major from Microsoft to Amazon delivering real sales for them every time new IoT device is rolled out or upgraded and there are billions of them. Whereas, we still need to see more sale delivery definition in the case of VRS. If that changes, I can change at the click of a mouse, I may miss out a bit, but I used covered T20, despite SGs assertion that all T20s are uncovered on margin, to offset that risk. For example, let’s say I have 100k VRS on T20 due settlement on 29 May right now. If China breaks on Monday, those shares will benefit just as much as yours. If nothing happens up until 29 May, I can close that T20 and take out another one (if the share has fallen, I will realise a loss, but the new T20 benefits from the lower entry price). If China happened on Monday, I can also trigger another another 300k VRS purchase on T20 @ one minute past 8am on Monday, even if the price is £1 because it will still go significantly higher over the coming months. I can then use the ensuing 20 trading days to work out how best to reallocate any other investments back into VRS. I accept I have very good trading limits with my brokers, but I didn’t when I started using these techniques 30 years ago, neither did I have large stakes. The model also worked for me then, but in a more modest way that progressively got me to my current position. Each to their own, but please stop telling lies about me and attributing unprincipled motives to me. Let’s hope next week is another great week for the VRS share price.
24/4/2018
22:22
ridicule: Luckyorange I will not respond to you again, since you are a lost cause and very rude. No one can be locked in at any price higher or lower. They just have to click on their buy or sell button. The fact you then feel I alone, by selling my shares cause the share price to move against others shows just how little you understand the market. Or you cannot grasp the reason the VRS share price has drifted since January. You again make a completely false statement. I have sold no Tern shares. But guess what! I might do one day!
24/4/2018
19:03
ridicule: Lucky orange Your post 10307. You are deranged. I have made no comment about feeling sorry for anyone locked in to anything, although it is unclear what scenario you are referring to. I was trying to offer some friendly open advice to fellow board members on what is a well proven investing strategy. I am heavily committed to VRS, yet you outrageously stated without a shred of proof that I had sold all my VRS shares and was trying to talk VRS down. I informed you this morning I had over 800k of VRS, a point you studiously ignored in your latest rant. I also said quite openly some time ago that I topped sliced some of my VRS holding to invest in some other companies that I thought had near term share price momentum, I named Tern as only one of them. I do differ from some on here who are taking the view that they should sell not one single VRS share because at some time a big order will drop and then VRS will take off. As an investor, as opposed to being miopicaly wedded to VRS, I recognise the benefit to me of VRS having 5 bagged since November due to all hard work, vision astuteness of NR and his team. Having got £1+ in January, the VRS share price had outstripped it’s technical fundamentals and inherited a significant element of hope and anticipation. My investment exposure at that time as it happens was £10k a penny movement in the share price either up or down. At the same time none of the Collaboration announcements contained any broad objectives: joint KPIs; milestone targets; etc. When I queried NR on this, his response was that he was relying on the Catapults to manage the collaborators and VRS would benefit when something broke because the use of Nanene or, in some cases, the VRS ink was nominated for use under the Collaboration Agreement. With only 100 employees I can see why it would be difficult for NR to engage in greater depth. That said it told me that predicting when a collaboration would come good was quite uncertain. We could be talking several months or a year plus. It then became clear that a number of Institutional presentations were not highlighting the VRS USP, neither were VRS promoting themselves in the technical or investment press. It was clear to me, as has happened many times in the past with any share in a similar scenario,that these factors together would erode the hope and anticipation value of the VRS share price. Indeed, this has proved to be the case since January. Because I stood to lose or gain £10k per penny VRS share movement, I decided to secure some of my VRS investment gains by top slicing and laying the profit off into my stable of investment opportunities that had potential share price momentum. My mistake was to open up a discussion on this as one way to risk manage a difficult period for the VRS share value and preserve accrued wealth in that share, while still keeping a large stake in what is very likely to prove an excellent long term investment. I did this to try and be helpful! A lot of people have noted my input for what it is without comment, but then comes along someone like you, full of suspicion and venom. Had I held all my VRS shares and not sold 25% to lay off, I would still only be carrying a paper loss, while patiently waiting for a big VRS RNS to get the share taking off. Given I actually sold 25% of my VRS, and given the recent Tern performance, a share you ludicrously lampooned, I have realised a profit of £134,065 in Tern since January. I have also saved on the losses from my top sliced 25%, given the VRS share price today. I accept Tern has performed spectacularly, but then if you did the research, it was always going to once it resolved a very unsatisfactory funding arrangement. That is why I shared my thoughts with what I thought were fellow investors on this Thread. As a final point, the fact that my selling 250k VRS shares over a period of a few weeks when Miton were offloading, seems to convince you that I have screwed the VRS share price singlehandedly and in an underhand manner defines you as a person a lot more than it does me. You then go on to say that I will do the same thing to Tern and try for whatever sick reason you have in mind to screw all of them as well. Just look at the Tern trading deals today! Are all those selling, and there are a lot, affecting those still holding. Of course their not, most informed Tern holders think they are selling too soon.
20/4/2018
10:59
ridicule: SuperG Re your IMM comments. One punts before news day on a binary bet then reaps the benefit or covers the drop! Standard punting practice. I punted lost, covered the drop, buying sufficient shares to get me back into profit on a 50% retrace. I am now in profit. However, I am still holding on. Another punt, because the drug had absolutely no adverse affects, allowing room for increased dosage and there remains a crying need for an effective Lupus drug. Coming back to VRS you have posted in the last few days. "There is no need for PR Newspaper articles, such as the Times article, because the industry that matters are lining up with NDAs and Collaborations are beginning to flow." You also say most of the general public do not understand or know about VRS." First the PR should not be aimed at the Industry, it should be aimed at unaware investors, given the conviction of many on this Board that VRS are a hidden gem with the greatest potential of any Graphene based Company. This should be shouted from the roof tops as it isn't BS! Second, most of us who raise some observations on VRS share price management and get vilified, are bright enough to read your excellent research and understand it, even if we are described in a quite disparaging way, (not by you) of being too old. You seem to think many of us do not understand the VRS unique position? My post 7300 gave my thoughts on the investment day, and I remain concerned at the lack of information on how the collaborations were set up. NR advised the big players were using the Catapult Agencies and they would pick up the Nanene orders from that process. When I ran my Company, every collaboration had an agreed set of KPIs that each partner was committed to meet; a timescale for commercial action (predicted sales and an order of magnitude of those sales). This set the priority that the collaboration plan had in the two company's business plans and helped with the financial forecasting and cashflow predictions. NR could have outlined these factors covering all of the collaborations without breaching any detailed confidentiality and giving us a much better idea of how things were likely to unfold. The fact that he didn't, indicates he has left the whole process with the Catapults and will react if something emerges. This is underlined by NR's statement that he does not know which Collaboration will produce first (no defined funnel) and that the last one is always the most exciting (he may be right on the Tyres). VRS may well be too small to do otherwise, but as an investor with the share price in the mid to high 80s at the time, it was a cause for concern. Investing is about using time as a commodity, (your money should be working all the time); value preservation (the 5 bagging VRS experience since November) should be preserved as far as possible and those that were late to the party £1 plus should not be hit unecessarily; trading a good share (VRS) is always undesireable and the NOMAD and management should do what they can, (PR, trading statements) to ensure investors are not put in that position to manage such risk. Having said all this, the probability of something falling out for VRS is rising as each week passes the China news becomes more likely (pray for no Black Swan)so the share price shoud stabilise. I have traded; IMM, TERN and N4 Pharma using 15% of my VRS holdings, selling in the low 80s; mid 70s and some at 67p. I am now covered for the time being on IMM, I have made very big profits on Tern (£40k) and I have sold half of N4 Pharma at a 35% profit and this is sitting as cash. I would have preferred not to have done the trading, but VRS have not taken any steps to manage their share price. Any company director is correct when they say the market determines the share price, not them, but I think it is amajor shortcoming not to have written the VRS story in a number of investment magazines and newspapers.
17/4/2018
08:18
rogerbridge: I know someone who was inpatient with the VRS share price and thought he could make a few pounds on IMM and then plough it back into VRS. I guess that he has not a lot of funds to play with now. I feel for him, but a poor decision can cost you dearly. VRS are not a one trick pony with multiple applications with our products. The share price May not be doing very much at the moment, but I am happy to wait. I will not be chasing the next certainty.
11/4/2018
13:46
ridicule: Super most people do not sell VRs because the grass looks greener, they sell because the current share price is not supported by fundamentals and, if a decent order does not arrive in the near term, the VRS share price will fall. I agree in part with your IMM comments, no one should load up on them big time at this stage, but a small punt makes sense on the binary bet (that will be lost on failure of the trial) given the odds gleaned from circumstantial comments on the trial. This can still be followed up by a bigger investment if the outcome is positive, but at a very much higher price than the shares were got for when it was a punt.
07/4/2018
14:00
ridicule: Hi Shavion. Thank you for your perceptive post (7937) of a few days ago. I’m sorry I did not respond, but I have been pretty tied up. I think a number of people on here tend to assess any observations on the VRS Company performance has being a criticism of Neill. There are two dominant factors at work. First, Neill and the way he runs a company. Second, the market and the way it responds to what he has to offer them. I think Neil has positioned VRS extremely well and is an excellent CEO. I am somewhat concerned at the lukewarm VRS public support from the two universities where the Nanene and ink were spun out from. VRS have achieved great things in trying to commercialise this academic partnership and as it is a continuance of the technology introduction process, the universities would not be favouring VRS over others by acknowledging VRS’s achievements. I say this because, as SG regularly points out, VRS is the only company in the world it would seem that have delivered high quality, few layer GNPs and scalable ink. The Universities should be proud of this and singing about success from the rooftops. They could not be accused of doing down the competiton because there isn’t any. You make some very good points as to why they may not be doing this and, while Neill rightly points out he has £1 billion of research investment sitting behind him from the Uk Graphene initiative, that same investment, where government funding is involved, must be made available to all who wish to utilise it in the UK. To date, while Neill has done everything to position VRS, the market has not responded with a significant commercial order since December 2016. This has produced a level of risk to the current share price, given it has five bagged since last November. A single good order or the China deal will remove this risk at a stroke. This is not a criticism of Neill or VRS, it is an observation on the market, particularly as large scale commercial deployment of high-quality graphene has so far not yet occurred anywhere in the world according to all the information on this Board. Neill’s investor day presentation was constrained to describing (eliciting from us)the competition, or lack of, and the perceived opportunities from the collaborations and China. He did not expand on the broader manufacturing value chain VRS needs to achieve to become the type of company that justifies a multi hundred pounds share price. He was right not to do this because he doesn’t have the firepower or bandwidth behind him until he gets some good order flow. Club has stated we may not see an order for two years. I don’t think any of us believe this will be the case but, were it to be, the current share price would not hold and investor wealth destruction would follow. That is why it is not impatience calling for an early order, it is investment risk management that calls for it. While an order could fall any day, I have implemented my own risk management programme by reducing my holdings in VRS by 10% in the 80p range. I have reinvested the money in N4 Pharma, IMM and Tern. Tern has doubled in the last few days, providing me with a £15K profit war chest against any fall in the VRS share price. That said, the VRS share price has held up well given the Miton selling and let’s hope a decent order arrives very soon. I am glad I am not invested in micro funds where arbitary decisions depend on factors outside my control.
15/3/2018
18:14
ridicule: I fear the quality of discussion is degenerating on this Board, particularly post 5976 that got 5 thumbs up, underlining my point!! I will try one more time to explain why forecasting is important and why, in the case of VRS, it should be possible. It is unlikely that VRS will move from an NDA to a collaboration agreement without reaching some agreement on the pricing structure for: proof of concept, protoype products and VRS consultancy day rates etc. There may well also be some agreement in principle for Nanene/ink off-take prices should the collaboration move into a fuller production partnership. Why would a large major spend money on a devolpment programme without some idea of future production costs based on quantity of off-take involved? In the case of China, a number of people, including SG have separately defined the Chinese factory set up and equipment costs as a distinct phase where VRS could make pass-through money on buying and installing, or assisting to install, the equipment. Significant revenue could be involved here and this is before Nanene production and distribution across the yet to be developed Graphene Valley occurs. A further point I would like to make is that SG has consistently advised through his excellent research and closeness to VRS that, unlike every other graphene company out there, Nanene has been shown to work abd this has been independantly verified. Not only that, but VRS have shown they can produce it in large quantity to high quality. So, contrary to some of the rather excited posts against the concept of forecasting, we are not investing or talking about a blue sky company when it comes to Nanene. SG regularly points out that this is why VRS have a 100+, some even say it could be heading to 200, NDAs. Neill and his team have managed to convert a small number (circa 10) to collaborative status. This is a great achievement, given the potential volume of business that could eventually flow from just 1 of them. This is why many of us have very significant investments here. I made the point in earlier post that business forecasting is about probability weighting and the associated percentages for success that should be derived from these calculations. It then takes likely revenue amounts that could flow, usually with a minimum and maximum estimate applied. My Company used to produce 3 year forecasts to inform our business investment budget, with less weight given to years 2 and 3 unless they contained secured multi-year contract revenues. People on here have been stating that it is impossible to obtain revenue figures for the Nanene side of VRS until contracts are actually delivered. I agree. The whole point of forecasting, however, is not to rely on absolute figures because they are never available until contracts are let. The only forecast that can have 100% applied is a secured and signed contract; even that can be reduced from 100% if the contract contains penalty clauses. Forecasting using a weighted percentage probability approach is perfectly feasible now for VRS unless the technology is unproven and is blue sky. We are told this is not the case with VRS and the amount of deals and NDA attention they are securing would back this up. Finally why is forecasting so important. Well when the share price was 12 -15p, quite frankly it wasn't. Now, however, the share price has traded between 60p and 130p with millions of shares being purchased in the 80s and the 90s pence range. Investors buying at these levels, a number of whom are under water today, need some metrics other than hope to stay invested. A high tech company PE could reasonably be considered as fair value at 20. Lets take a VRS share price of 80p. 4p earnings per share would be required to produce a pe of 20. There are 148.67m VRS shares in issue so a profit of £5,946,800 would be required to achieve a eps of 4p and a pe of 20. We await the year end results in July, but last year most of us saw the company about breaking even on their 2017 trading. We do not know, because we have no financial information, how much Nanene and ink has been sold over the last several months or how much improvement in business performance has taken place. Lets take a worst case scenario and assume none. To make £5,946,800 profit on a modest 20% margin the company would need to secure an extra £29,734,000 of revenue. If one reasonably argued the need to recover R&D costs lets go for a 30% margin; that would require revenue of £19,822,666; a 40% margin would require revenue of £14,867,000. The way the forecasts are derived are not the way they are published and no individual customer would be able to tell how much VRS were making from their particular deal unless an open book accounting system was agreed. To me, it should be possible for VRS to produce a factored forecast that could produce a pe of 20 as a reasonable target. This would bring much greater stability to the share price.
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