Versarien Share Discussion Threads

[grabster] 11/7/2018 07:43

rafboy - the "imminent" ISO certification has been described as such for longer than the word "imminent" would normally imply! Imminent means "about to happen". I hope it is. It cannot happen until trained certifiers and their facilties are in place, and at the moment, as far as I know, they still aren't. We were told that Versarien are at the front of the queue - but that must be quite a queue by now, as it will surely include the many makers who know that they won't get an 'A' but will want to boast their 'B' or 'C' grades to help distance themselves from the out-and-out 'fails', of which there will be many.

Among those who know that their product is not actually graphene at all (ie, doesn't comply with the specification detailed by ISO last September - ISO/TS 80004-13:2017 - Nanotechnologies -- Vocabulary -- Part 13 ... ), I'm guessing there will be many who won't submit to testing for certification and will merely change their own labelling.

[superg1] 11/7/2018 07:34

1crack

To balance it up. Some seem to pay attention to what those with an agenda say, EG Kempster has been going on for weeks about investors expecting big sales of graphene to justify the share price and big numbers for revenue on that basis.

He is the only one saying it as far as I can see and it's complete BS.

My target mentioned many times over the last 12 months has been about 3kg for the while period. With the bits of sales they have done and the CPI tender they may just have done it.

The market won't be aware of the revenue increase. Mr market just reads news as it arrives.

EG News on some shares weeks before results says revenue down, poor trading etc and the market canes the share price Then weeks later when they release the results the market canes it again.

I did point out that re D4T4. The facts suggested good results on the way but the market didn't pay attention. It went up something like 30-50% following the results which were easy to forecast

The headline for VRS which the market doesn't know about will be something like 35%-50% increases in revenue v the previous year.

Don't write off news before then though.

[lovat scout] 11/7/2018 07:28

I don’t follow IQE closely but if VRS are to learn anything from the IQE and other companies’ experiences - keep the accounting straightforward!

Once JVs and other commercial deals are set up, VRS are good enough that they don’t need to squeeze the last few pennies by stretching the audit rules. Mud tends to stick when Gotham, Muddy Waters etc get involved.

[able11] 11/7/2018 07:23

Potsol

IQE have problems with NDAs and disclosures which I fail to fully comprehend.

An even larger and more pertinent problem would be their PR, or lack of, to be more precise. They should learn some lessons from NR, he's only 30 miles north.

Couple that with the shorters and what looked so promising 12 months ago now looks like a lengthy slow climb for the share price Dave Sweeney has bet £1.50 by Christmas, an incredible lowering of expectations compared to 12 months ago.

I bailed completely at a very fortuitous price 9 months ago,I'm all in here and happily await and fully expect this to change my life.

[rafboy] 11/7/2018 07:22

NR says in that tweet “the imminent ISO”. So it could come soon?

[ayl30] 11/7/2018 07:22

Agree, have held both for some time

[potsol] 11/7/2018 06:55

runthejoules regarding you comment about IQE I see the differentiator with VRS being the regular news flow.

IQE were and still are restrained by several NDA's as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure if you were to compare the RNS's between the two, regarding collaborations and agreements you would see a vast difference.

I still see IQE as a great British company worth investing in (world leader in compound semiconductor manufacture for those who aren't aware) but it is going to be a slog with the amount of shorts open. Once they have the new Newport facility running at 100% capacity there will be no stopping them.

[chimpandy1] 11/7/2018 00:27

Dreamy, you previously stated you currently hold no positions and are waiting for the results before shorting. If that was true then surely you would want the price to go higher before you short as to try to make more profit.......... you wouldn't be trying trash a share before you short. That would be rather idiotic wouldn't you agree? I can smell the strong scent of farm manure coming from your direction. Your posts are nothing but laughable and a cry of despiration. I will buy you a "shorting for dummies" book with my profits.

[1crackupboom] 11/7/2018 00:18

Why are people dribbling on about earnings?We will have either broken even, made a tiny loss or made up to 1 million profit as an outside bet. Market knows this already. All of these scenarios will have next to no impact on share price apart from 1 million profit obviously. We are not valued on earnings and wont be for a while yet.

[superg1] 10/7/2018 22:54

Oh, the current buying has been nowt to do with anyone Arden know.

[superg1] 10/7/2018 22:31

run

The types of fund holders needed are not around, which is something I've mentioned for a while.
I've never heard of the chief suspects that I think are buying and if they were not buying we'd probably be in the 60-70p range.

Churning the old small micro cap and trust funds into larger funds is good imo.

They have soaked up loose shares where some hoped to exit and re-enter lower.

[lovat scout] 10/7/2018 22:21

RTJ

Not all funds have short term investment horizons, although the majority do as they are rubbish and need any outperformance and stock loan interest they can get!

On the plus side, the chances of these sub-mediocre fund managers having the vision to be invested in VRS is zero.

A lot of fund managers don’t lend stock as they were given nasty shocks in 2008 when Lehman went into administration and assets were tied up for ages. Most stock lenders are the index trackers which doesn’t apply to VRS - yet!!

If I were NR I would be leaning on Arden to make sure that they focus on the quality of IIs rather than the quantity they are selling the VRS story to. VRS needs investors with a 5 year+ time horizon on the register as there’s nothing worse than a short term II badgering management every 3 months to make the figures look good at the expenses of long term decision making.

[ashehzi] 10/7/2018 22:10

Sg1, I've been reading so I'm sure results will be good. I'm talking in general that LTHs have nothing to lose.

[runthejoules] 10/7/2018 22:05

I think I may be the only one to be disappointed that big funds are buying, rather than it staying largely big PIs. I saw big funds buy big into IQE at a 140p placing, and what have they done since then? Loaned to shorters, and the price (for other reasons as well such as the CFO being killed, admittedly) has been in the doldrums since then. I am worried that that's what they're going to do with VRS. They know it will be big in the long run but maybe it will take a while for profits to come that will justify the share price on traditional metrics, so they'll take advantage knowing that, as superg1 says, every shorter has to buy back, and they make exorbitant interest on loaning the stock. Win-win frankly.

I'm hoping superg1 or lovat scout will tell me why I'm completely wrong though!

[superg1] 10/7/2018 22:05

ash

There isn't a negative really as earnings are going to be materially up.

AGM £100k revenue with near £4 mill
of costs on graphene. VRS £8 mill plus with the graphene business a fraction of AGMs costs.

Also don't write off news prior to that.

[ashehzi] 10/7/2018 21:56

Most are LTHs, and sitting on profit, so can take the risk of going into earnings without selling and probably add upon weakness if cash is available.

[superg1] 10/7/2018 21:52

Sonsonny

The gullible traders bet on resitance points through 80p 90p £1, old high of £1.20 and so on. Charts are pretty much useless when a fund or two are buying.

[sonsonnyjim] 10/7/2018 20:45

Richard unfortunately gullible traders might be put off by weak earnings

[shammytime] 10/7/2018 20:10

Setting up nicely for Battle of Brexit. Come on you Frogs

[woodpeckers] 10/7/2018 19:59

By the way, I'm no chartist but isn't that graph a thing of beauty!

[richardc77] 10/7/2018 19:58

SG re Kempster that is the very basic ploy of these clever shorters, pick a stock they think has risen too quickly, hope it is at the max on earnings day short it at that point and make a noise about how dissapointing earnings are, then close short after their margin is met. Clever huh? ;)

[woodpeckers] 10/7/2018 19:56

Super, "As discussed before the market is sitting on a large cash position and imo graphene is going to be big." - I think I mentioned that our FSA confirmed that, (large cash position),and called me for a reminder of the name of the graphene company I had told him about. It may well just have been for personal investment but I can't see him keeping it to himself....

[luckykids] 10/7/2018 19:20

Chadli is useless at crossing or set pieces