Surface Transforms Share Discussion Threads

[spookies] 03/10/2023 13:08

Got way too many of these in my portfolio, still could not resist a small topup at these prices.

[bdaonion] 03/10/2023 12:32

Today's price (looking through half shut eyes) is a great opportunity for our new CFO and COO to show they have confidence in the company.

[supernumerary] 03/10/2023 12:01

knownowt - skipping the infantile intro, having a website is no substitute for a properly organised and continuous media campaign. The only people who will look at the website are those who have found ST by some other means - they're not going to happen on it by chance. It's making damn sure they know of its existence and its achievements that I'm asking for.

Maybe there is a bear raid, but if so it's been going on for nearly 3 years, so I think it unlikely - the length and depth of the fall point not only to bad luck - covid, non-working furnaces etc - but to something more systemic. I think the lack of visibility is one cause of the poor share price and have tried to suggest low-cost ways in which that could be tackled; your solution seems to be to admire the past then sit on your hands and wait and hope. Good luck with that.

Geko - I do agree about the cash call - investors worry about it, but I think the company would be mad to do one now. Not only because of the dilution, but because it would destroy any belief any of us might have in the probity of management, so I'm prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume there won't be one in the immediate future.

And I should say I'm not against cash calls in principle - all AIM investors know that's why the companies are here after all - but against raises we've been told (or at least pinkfoot has!) won't happen, and at prices that are punitive.

[fevertreeman] 03/10/2023 11:36

One wonders whether anything gets through to our chums in the north west about how to run a successful listed company: get the basics right!

Website: needs to be refreshed or updated.

finally, after over a month since CFO and COO joined the website management page has been updated BUT as usual with this lot, it is only partially updated!!! Isabelle Maddock the CFO finally up on Board page, but new COO is still absent from managment page, (& mysterious blank photo for s/o called Mark Strutz still there)

Where is the page about our clients? having finally reluctantly it seems actually bothered to put logos on the presentation giving us the names we knew about, have they populated the website withe the details OR rewritten the copy to make it sound like we actually want customers? No, of course they havent.....

Cant work out whether its arrogance ignorance or stupidity, but guys you are running a listed company with global customers. And yet you seem unaware of the need to market the business properly to investors.

[fevertreeman] 03/10/2023 09:51

It's not just that; the performance of the junior market has been atrocious (as has the wider UK market) as negative investor sentiment even among UK institutions means UK equities continue to be ignored with result, UK is one of the cheapest markets globally.

But there are also severe structural issues that need sorting to revive the UK stockmarket.
- Since 2015 the total number of London-listed companies has gone from 2400 (2015)to c1900 (2022). Its halved in last 20 years. Mean time IPOs fallen off a cliff, and tech companies are heading to US as ratings are higher (Arm)or in the case of CRH switching from London.

Government needs to get rid of transaction tax (Stamp duty) and at the same time allow pension funds back into equities now the era of zero interest rates is behind us...

1. Stamp Duty: a real drag for UK stock market. It's a transaction tax and that 0.5% goes to HMG and it hurts liquidity esp in small caps...as it's embedded in the spread

2. Pension fund liability matching: by forcing pension funds to match assets with liabilities the UK government has benefitted as pension funds have been funding the deficit as they bought bonds. However they have effectively got out of equities, and now the UK govt is waking up to the consequences -no funding for UK plc and growing companies like ST

[amt] 03/10/2023 08:52

Yes the market doesn't believe reassurances about cash.

[bagpuss67] 03/10/2023 08:04

Happy to pick up a few more at 26.4.

[geko5trade] 03/10/2023 07:36

All very well but the discussion was not about how much progress the company has made, most holders believe in that, the issue we were discussing (I believe) was why is the share price in a relentless downward trend now some 30% below the last, rather dismal discounted, raising. Supernumerary is highlighting lack of visibility, not to the cognoscenti in the industry, but the wider investment community. My belief is it’s actually the spectre of a cash call. You say you ‘would like to think’ dilution is behind us. But the market tends not to ‘like to think’ it can be brutal and if there’s a sniff of weakness, of a forced cash call or credit line, it punishes in times like these when cash is expensive. The market doesn’t think or hand out merit badges for how well a company has done in the past it just weighs the odds. I’m not saying investors are wrong to think the potential upside from this level isn’t worth the risk I’m speculating on why that chart is so bloody miserable.

[supernumerary] 02/10/2023 19:52

bdaonion - that's great to see, so thanks for pointing it out, but it couldn't be more hidden away if they'd tried :¬( Anyway, it's out there, which is something - real progress.

Now maybe someone will contact one of the car mags - CAR or Road & Track seem to be the most respected? - about a feature article? And The Economist for its Science and Technology section - reach the movers and shakers. There are many others to talk to. Who in the ESG space?

Get a media studies graduate on board to spread the word and correct all misapprehensions on social media. Snag an influencer - Mark Presley? he seems to put himself about these days - and start some conversations with the fans.

Then send an email to someone in each of the customers saying you're about to start a media campaign: their name will be mentioned, so can they say if there's anything they'd like to avoid? Remember it's better to ask forgiveness after than permission before!

Following that, a round of investor presentations, using all the stuff that's already been put out (see previous para) to generate a bit of excitement.

It's not rocket science...

[swiss paul] 02/10/2023 17:08

Cheers - job jobbed

[bdaonion] 02/10/2023 17:05

swiss paul. Everyone can get free access. Go to ST's website and click on Media.

[swiss paul] 02/10/2023 16:59

Well that's a bummer - I ain't rich enough. Anyone able to get free access?

[pinkfoot2] 02/10/2023 16:37

That’s the one-see page 21 which stopped me putting it out

[fevertreeman] 02/10/2023 16:25

Finally, we get a presentation from them with actual customer names, including the great and the electric good !!!!!

[bdaonion] 02/10/2023 15:35

pf2 can you confirm that the HY 2023 Presentation, 21 pages, posted today on ST's website (under Media) is the one from last week? If so your request must have been listened to! Thanks.

[geko5trade] 02/10/2023 14:33

supernumerary,
I agree about publicity and it does seem a bit ridiculous that the names of the OEM's are in the public domain via detective work, slips of the tongue and names on boxes etc and yet this kudos can't be officially used. I can't really see what/who is being protected. Put it this way is one only allowed to have the commercial advantage that would be gained through this visibility when the company gets to the size of Brembo? This kind of hegemony is in danger of turning me into a marxist!
You say that the biggest concern for you isn't cash but you do list it in point 4 'targets for production and cash flow'. I think the market might put point 4 at the top and visibility of the company lower. But that's just MO.

[davealders] 02/10/2023 13:48

Spot on Supernumerary.
Remember this been brought up at an open day a couple of years ago and they didn't think it mattered.
Brand is everything and would certainly attract new buyers for sure.
But if companies want surface to not talk about it then it's them what else can they do?
Everyone here knows who they supply too, it was literally there as you walked in the factory. It's the new investors that haven't a clue.
Shame this has dropped so far :(
Thanks

[supernumerary] 02/10/2023 12:58

That presentation won't have reached anyone who wasn't already convinced so no reason to think new buyers would emerge. The biggest concern for me isn't cash, which I hope they've learned their lesson about, but visibility. Even a new contract will attract little attention if it's along the lines of "OEM 99, production starting in 2026, $100M revenue spread over 5 years" like others:¬(

I think they have to:

1 make a splash of some sort which attracts lots of media interest;

2 have a clear story to tell them (and sorry to harp on about this, but in my opinion that will require customer names, and preferably car models);

3 provide a continuing news flow - it's no good making a splash then walking away and letting the ripples die - these days people expect companies to be active on social media, feeding them stuff to their phone every few days.

4 hit the targets for production and cash flow.

That should do it :¬)

[bdaonion] 02/10/2023 12:46

amt. Agree and possibly because the meeting which was looking forward with positives, is not public but should be, whereas the interim results were mostly looking back at the problems earlier this year. Frustrating that SCE has a product that is best in the world and has hundreds of millions of sales with most of the major OEMs seems to lack the PR.

[geko5trade] 02/10/2023 12:43

Yep relentless vote of no confidence from the market. From a charting perspective deeply oversold, long term falling trend, broke support at 28 (that I stupidly didn't think would happen) and now looking for next support at 26.
Appreciate Pinkfoot's contributions and others but broader market yet to see the positives. I'm sure there are many routes to finance should they need it but maybe it is the cash position that is trumping the potential. The old cash is king in a bear market?

[amt] 02/10/2023 12:21

Seems the meeting didn't convince everyone by the share price reaction.

[swiss paul] 01/10/2023 22:02

Pinkfoot thanks for answering my queries honestly, And also thanks for posting the information.
Keep Safe
Swiss

[fft] 01/10/2023 10:49

Amt . I asked mgmt about the ramp up in April or may after a previous meeting because the expected H1 looked very poor. To make sure that the furnaces were ok after the fixes in Jan/Feb they were increasing production more slowly than I had expected to make sure any issues were caught before causing another major setback. They had had no problems but they were still not at full production capacity and reading between the lines it was going to be July before that happened. Looking at the estimates for H2 I don't think they were at 100% in July/august either. Taking it cautiously seems to have worked and the new furnaces that have been installed dont seem to have the same problems that the originals did.The hardman note that was listed below is a good summary of where SCE are and the outlook.