Ilika Share Discussion Threads

[a.fewbob] 06/12/2019 01:25

If IKAs battery was so far off the mark, I doubt they’d be going on about having a marketable battery in two years.

I’ll wait for an official RNS.

[supernumerary] 06/12/2019 01:10

hb - thanks for that - interesting. I've just measured a little lipo I have lying around - it's 29*17*6.5 mm = about 3.2Kmm3 for a claimed 1Wh. The Goliath figure you give is about 105Kmm3 for 1.5Wh.

I think there must be something wrong with either my numbers or yours, or of course both, but not being an expert have no idea what :) If they're all correct, then IKA still has a very long way to go.

Any thoughts?

[a.fewbob] 05/12/2019 23:47

Thanks horn blower, very kind of you to post the detail.

Things sound really positive to me!

The most interesting thing I’ve heard so far was the point they made about current lithium ion batteries not getting any cheaper due to material constraints and the fact that they state IKAs tech will be competitive with mass production.

To my mind this implies that IKA are not relying on expensive exotic materials.

Anyone else know anything more about the batteries ingredients?

I’m pleased that they have a working prototype. I bet that accounts for the recent share price perkiness!!

So they’ve frozen all other projects and put all their eggs in one basket.

They are obviously very confident that what they have will work!

[horneblower] 05/12/2019 23:20

The Goliath cell is a thin, flat pouch with a cathode, solid electrolyte and anode screen-printed on metal foil. It is approx 100 by 150 by 7 mms.

The lab/manufacturing facility is all brand new and squeaky clean.

The main equipment for the actual manufacture is basically a hand operated screen printing system.

The money has mostly gone into testing equipment and moisture-free clean-rooms.

The materials for making the anode, cathode and electrolyte are high quality powdered elements that first have to be tested, graded and, if necessary milled then mixed with special thixotropic materials to turn them into inks for printing.

The finished cell currently has an output of about 1.5 watt-hours (if I understood correctly).

It charges fast, manages large numbers of discharge cycles and holds its charge well.

The current objective seems to be to vary all aspects of the cell parameters to optimise the electrical qualities. This takes time as the production is only 10 cells per day (again, I might have got that wrong but it was a small number).

It was difficult to ask questions as there were about 25 of us and limited access to management. Also, a lot of duff questions were being asked and answered at length. Also the acoustics were pretty poor so hearing the answers was a problem.

Overall, impressed by the facility. Not so impressed by the chance of making any money...but need many more answers to be satisfied.

Why all this wasn't done two years ago and is taking so long to progress are questions I didn't get to ask.

Hope this is useful.

[gnnmartin] 05/12/2019 23:09

The talks were very good, but not enough time for questions. From the foils, they reckon to start Goliath pilot construction in late 2020, and operation in 2022. They reckon that consumer cells will be profitable first (mid 2022?) with Auto starting from 2024. The graphics are very sketchy though, so my guessed dates may be misleading.

I get the impression from the foils that they hope to be at break even by somewhere in 2023.

[a.fewbob] 05/12/2019 21:13

Any idea on time scales?

[a.fewbob] 05/12/2019 21:13

Did they go into any detail on the Goliath battery?

What materials does it use?

[duwendag] 05/12/2019 21:10

sorry for the double post

[duwendag] 05/12/2019 21:02

Just got back from the site visit, to answer Swiss Paul, they have stopped all other work apart from batteries. Everything and everyone was very positive, Graham gave a good talk, but most interesting was a talk by Asad Farid, his talk was on battery cost and technology which boiled down to existing batteries for EVs cannot get much cheaper due to the rising cost of materials and the limited increase in conventional battery development, whereas Goliath will become competative once in mass production and eventually cheaper and with greater power density.
The manufacturing facility at the moment is a very hands-on and hand made affair, their explanation for this is that they want to perfect each aspect of manufacture before mass production.

[duwendag] 05/12/2019 21:01

Just got back from the site visit, to answer Swiss Paul, they have stopped all other work apart from batteries. Everything and everyone was very positive, Graham gave a good talk, but most interesting was a talk by Asad Farid, his talk was on battery cost and technology which boiled down to existing batteries for EVs cannot get much cheaper due to the rising cost of materials and the limited increase in conventional battery development, whereas Goliath will become competative once in mass production and eventually cheaper and with greater power density.
The manufacturing facility at the moment is a very hands-on and hand made affair, their explanation for this is that they want to perfect each aspect of manufacture before mass production.

[horneblower] 04/12/2019 22:44

Deluded, moi?

[supernumerary] 04/12/2019 20:29

paul - spot on. Nor did they give an earnings/grants breakdown. My guess is that most, if not all, revenue came from grants, which would mean they're not selling the products they already have. Still an awful lot to prove here.

[swiss paul] 04/12/2019 19:58

We seem to becoming a one trick pony as I saw no other mention of any other technologies in the RNS. If that is the case then we seem to be betting the farm on the batteris which is not good. What has happened to
* Lead-free piezoelectric materials.

* High capacity hydrogen storage materials.

* Cheaper fuel cells electrodes.

* Thin-film photovoltaic solar cells.

* Polymers to filter stem cells from blood.

* Phase change high capacity memory chips.

* Superalloys for gas turbine engines.

* Cell-specific functional coatings for multiple medical devices.

No grants avaialble boys?

[jammydodger1] 04/12/2019 18:43

Tonight you people need to research ALGWBIG PLANS 100,000,000 million. Credit facility about to be approved and signed by a leading UK asset managerMcap of this company is only 5m nowWill be multiples And way past 20pDnt be left out in the cold

[a.fewbob] 04/12/2019 18:40

ROGK,

Hydrogen and batteries both have their pros and cons.

To say hydrogen will win the battle is idiotic and shows how little you know.

Solid state batteries would be a massive game changer.

Hydrogen I believe will be used in larger vehicles and trucks.

[kooba] 04/12/2019 15:10

Believe there was a consolidation if it makes you feel better!

[nw99] 04/12/2019 08:06

Swedish electric truck start-up @TrucksVolta has picked the UK to build its prototype vehicle, tapping the UK's #automotive skills and expertise to produce the first of its battery-powered urban delivery vehicles

[global nomad] 04/12/2019 08:00

Think we will end up replacing petrol/diesel ICE engines with battery/hydrogen electric fuel cell vehicles....

keeping a balance of options makes sense for different contexts and situations. one solution doesn't fit all.

Long term holding in CERES, AFC, ITM and IKA

also have some CPX to cover the supercapacitor aspect, though that is in the doldrums currently as many of the others were before their rerate

[kooba] 04/12/2019 07:55

Worth watching Ceres Power in the Hydrogen fuel cell space ..share price indicating progress.

[gary38] 04/12/2019 07:55

Great results

[nw99] 04/12/2019 07:37

Toyota the only manufacturer that has really embraced it and been doing it for many years I spent a lot time in Japan watching this development.

[nw99] 04/12/2019 07:17

Tesla CEO Elon Musk has said of hydrogen fuel cell vehicles, 'Success is simply not possible.'