Fisher (james) & Sons Share Discussion Threads

[illiswilgig] 17/8/2020 08:16

Apologies,

Interims are expected on the 25th August (not the 22nd as I mistyped)

Just testing!

cheers

Illis

[illiswilgig] 11/8/2020 13:33

Hello Roddie,

Well thanks, as well as can be expected. Likewise Roddie - hope you are well?

Interims expected on 22nd August?

I don't expect them to reveal a lot as Q2 of this year has been such an upheaval around the globe and the return to 'normal' whatever that turns out to be will not be as quick as many had hoped or assumed.

Indeed - in the old economy markets of energy and transport there may be no return to the old normal? The pandemic may have accelerated some changes that were already in progress?

The current shareprice is certainly disappointing - but I agree with Roddie, not that surprising.

Though I don't want to over-rationalise it. There is a lot about shareprices at the moment that is far from rational. Renishaw share price at around 94x profits in the year just ended, and 56x for the year to Jun21? (Yes, I've reluctantly been a seller.) Whereas Fisher is on 17x the year to Dec20 and around 13x for the year to Dec21. Which you may consider as fairly valued?

I still think Fisher is well positioned in emerging marine technologies and markets and has the potential for good future growth.

One thing I have learned about Fisher is that the shares rarely, if ever seem to be a bargain. So the current fair value - may - in time prove to be a good buying opportunity as Roddie suggests. Accordingly I've been adding more, most recently at around 1200. But I admit I started buying too soon, and don't see adding more unless the price falls signficantly further for no particular reason.

In the short term there will be a lot to do to sort out the bits of the business where the market has imploded and focus upon the bits for future growth. Much depends upon whether you think the management has the ability to do this - something that Fisher has done very well on previous occasion.

I might suggest that buying is for the brave or foolish - to soon to know which of those I am yet?

I wish everyone well and look forward to reading the tea-leaves on the interims soon.

cheers

Illis

[bouleversee] 11/8/2020 11:12

Pleased to see the share price up a little bit today. A helluva long way to go, however.

[roddiemac2] 11/8/2020 09:20

Hello debs,

I hope you are keeping well.

You are correct when you say" it could get worse again before it gets better" In general terms , the future is unclear. Almost anything could happen. We have not been confronted with a situation like this before. Yes there will be bargains, but I am not inclined to look at new investment ideas until things be come clearer. I have a fairly simple , and therefore sustainable , life style. I will content myself with what I have for the time being.

email when you have the time.

[debsdowner] 08/8/2020 17:09

Hi Rod,

I remember when these were in the pennies and this was one of the shares you held I looked at them at the time and regretted not following your advice, I have to confess I didn't really understand the company, I specialized in retailers at the time. When retailer ran out of steam I ploughed into electronics. We both know where that ended up !

Things are quite grim now with both the coronavirus and a world meltdown but there will be bargains to be gained.

You are a canny investor Rod hope you are keeping well.

Lot on at the moment but hope to chat sometime in the future off bulletin boards in respect of various matters which I don't want to post online.

Although the general marker has bounced back it could get worse again before it gets better I don't know what your view is of the world economy ?

[bouleversee] 08/8/2020 15:52

OK, Roddie. I'll keep my fingers crossed. I just can't understand why they couldn't pay even a small amount of dividend. What are pensioners supposed to live on?

[roddiemac2] 08/8/2020 14:14

boule,

I see no reason to suspect a change in management`s attitude to their shareholders. It remains to be seen how much the current crisis is affecting the business. Results at the end of this month should inform.

Take care.

[bouleversee] 07/8/2020 14:11

I can't bear to sell when the price is so low though no doubt I shall regret not doing so. Like most women, once I fall in love I find it difficult to admit that the object of my affection is not worth it.

[suetballs] 07/8/2020 13:55

boule sold out today. Disappointed with recent performance. Tried something new in d4t4.
My holding was fairly small - good luck with yours.
Suet

[bouleversee] 07/8/2020 10:52

Thanks, Roddie. Pretty well, all things considered, but exhausted by having to do all my own housework and gardening, not to mention trying to keep track of the financial situation and the continuing domestic dramas, the latest being some of the roof falling off in a place difficult to get at. I finally got the exploded conservatory roof panel replaced yesterday but still have the blind damage to sort.

FSJ is a real bummer in view of the large holding spread round the family, not picked up at particularly cheap prices but mostly held for a long time. I really don't understand why it has dropped so much unless it is that it was overvalued in the first place. I must say I thought their p/e ratio was too high to make it attractive.
The directors don't seem to have tightened their belts though IIRC and I get the impression that the company's ethos may have changed under the new directorship and may be more interested in their own advancement and rewards than the interests of their shareholders, unlike the family. In other words, I have lost faith in them. How about you?

[roddiemac2] 07/8/2020 10:00

TDay,

When this crisis started I thought that the shares might half from their highs of around 2200p in March 2019. Why did I think this? ------In the financial crisis the shares dropped to just over 300p briefly in November 2008. They were hovering around 680p in May 2008, and before that, in November 2007, had been just over 700p briefly.---So,in the financial crisis they roughly halved. My logic is that the current crisis is arguably much worse . It therefore should be no surprise to see the share price drop to current levels.

It is worth bearing in mind that the shares are fairly tightly held , and that much of the daily trading consists of very small trades. I have not checked daily, but there is little sign of large sellers: more a buyers strike.

During the financial crisis , I started adding at 340p. This time round , I have been adding at higher prices than we now see. I don`t always get it right. Interim results at the end of this month should be revealing.


PS ----Illis and Boule , I hope you are both well.

[tday] 06/8/2020 07:53

The share price is now back to where it was seven years ago.

[phillis] 07/7/2020 11:59

?
I know we certainly disagreed about the Stooge poster on RPC

[bouleversee] 07/7/2020 11:16

Curious to know why Phillis has been filtered.

[phillis] 07/7/2020 10:33

Hmm!

Still seems overvalued despite the fall from grace

[our haven] 24/6/2020 11:24

Interesting going's on this morning and now a price extension.Something afoot?

[florenceorbis] 09/6/2020 06:20

FSJ Peel Hunt Buy - 1,800.00 Initiates/Starts

[tday] 12/5/2020 08:49

Years ago I was a fan of FSJ, but IMHO the shares have been overvalued for a long time. The PEG isn't great, so unless and until the p/e drops further, I will remain on the side-lines.

[garth] 05/5/2020 06:39

bouleversee,

Take care of yourself. Worries press in. But life is more precious than any of those other things that tend to weigh on us. I find it so easy to worry and strive - but what good does it do me? Sometimes sitting and reading, enjoying the fresh air of the garden and listening to the birds is exactly what body and soul need. Maybe this is a time to make a truce with some of the bits of the garden you can't manage? Long grass and wild flowers have a beauty of their own if we can find the grace to make peace with them.

Best wishes.

G.

[roddiemac2] 04/5/2020 18:30

boule,

hxxps://sirjohnfisherfoundation.org.uk/

Worth a read: note his involvement in the evacuation of Dunkirk and the D day landings.

They give grants of about two million a year to very good causes.

Don`t let all the bad news get to you. We don`t have a TV. I prefer to read a newspaper. I have spent a little more than two years clearing the land here ,and planting trees. I would turn my attention to the house again( I fitted a kitchen last summer and installed partial central heating) but I can`t get the materials now. I see this as a blessing in disguise . I was a part time builder for many years :part time being the operative words. My aim was always to do just enough to finance my interests.I am working harder on this place than I did before I retired , over twenty years ago.I have been effectively self isolating since I bought the place!

[bouleversee] 04/5/2020 13:50

What does the JF Foundation do? Perhaps it could help us elderly pensioners who have invested in FSJ all their adult life, encouraged sprogs to do the same, gifted FSJ shares to grandsprogs, sung FSJ's praises to all and sundry and now find ourselves losing half of our life-savings, and (in my case, anyway)almost all, literally, of dividend income, and not enough time left to make it back again, in my case at any rate. Hope the rest of you are luckier.

I keep thinking it's a bad dream from which I will wake up; so many bizarre experiences (inc. burglary, conservatory roof exploding) so difficult to deal with when self-isolating in solitary confinement and nobody to have a laugh with about it all, with no help in garden or house so absolutely no time even to finish reading the newspapers let alone watch anything on TV. Where and when will it end? A long, long sleep is beginning to sound very appealing.

[roddiemac2] 04/5/2020 12:58

The Regent Trust Co was the dealing arm of the Sir John Fisher Foundation.

To have the Sir John Fisher Foundation as a holder of nearly 23% of the shares must be a stabilising force in the market for the shares.

[roddiemac2] 01/5/2020 12:48

illis,

I too rely on dividends and capital gains ( remember them ? ) to supplement a very small government pension. " foolhardy or brilliant " ----my position exactly. Is this beginning to sound like:- might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb ?

Thanks for your comments about the Regent Trust Co. It has been three years since I had a copy of the printed annual accounts. As you know , they always showed a list of notifiable holders, and I remembered Mr Jackson ( trustee of the Sir John Fisher foundation )showing as about 16%: now 22.975%.I have spoken with someone at the Sir John Fisher Foundation, and was told that The Regent Trust Co. has merged with The Sir John Fisher Trust. The regent Trust Co.was also set up by Sir John Fisher and always held FSJ shares. I am guessing that the regular payments made from the Regent Trust Co to the Sir John Fisher Foundation were the dividend payments from their FSJ shares. Perhaps the Regent trust Co. was included in the list of major holders in the printed annual accounts. I don`t remember. I hope I have not caused too much confusion on this subject. I got the wrong end of the stick initially.