Finance Ireland Share Discussion Threads

[globaltraderix2] 13/11/2002 10:13

All I can comment on is a mate who when he manages to get a job in the fire service was on cloud 9 for months.His comments were that his pay almost doubled and his work apart from being very satisfying almost halfed.And yes he did get some very good nights sleep while being paid for it.Which is alot more than he got while working for the ambulance service.

[jaxaxe] 13/11/2002 09:55

I dont think that the firemen have clicked yet that they wont be getting paid for striking,wait till they start getting repossesion orders and the banks start returning their cheques.The fbu wont have told them that they cant help them out them out of the financial mess that they will find themselves in.The strikes doomed before its started,its just a ego trip for that pillock steward Gilchrist and the rest of his union officials - they will get paid!
....The firemen actually believed that the country would back them for 40% - if thats not an indication of how conceited the majority of them are then I dont know what is...and then theres the slogon:Because were worth it:talk about ego - its too silly for words.The government have made it clear they wont give in and quite frankly if they did they would lose all credibility.
I rather suspect that Gilchrist is already wishing that hed taken the 11%....because hes worth it!

[maxheadroom] 13/11/2002 09:20

I though it was the miners that tried to undermine us ;-)

[thegreatgeraldo] 13/11/2002 09:18

On the plus side,with all these firemen idle during most of December , should be plenty of opportunity to get that spare room decorated in time for xmas.... & finding a cab home from the xmas party should be easier :-))

Every (smoke) cloud has a silver lining :-))

[bomfin] 13/11/2002 08:19

I think the majority of people would support sacking the lot of them. Blair won't do it though because he's a wimp and they've been paying subs to The Labour Party.
If they were sacked and the army were used to man the stations with the right equipment and people newly recruited it would be supported if it's the only way to ensure lives arn't put at risk and that the public don't have to pay for a ridiculous wage demand.
bomfin

[maxheadroom] 13/11/2002 06:33

Very strong editorial in the Financial Times.

...The (Bain) paper rightly calls for root-and-branch changes to working practices and concludes that without such changes there is no case for any pay increase. New employment conditions are considered normal by employees in the private sector and by large swaths of the public sector. Firefighters should be no different. It is shocking that the service lacks adequate requirements for more flexible shift patterns, for the firefighters to have opportunities to follow different career paths within the service, for risk-based assessments to govern the deployment of fire service resources at different times of the day and for the abolition of the second-class status of part-time firefighters.....

...Indeed, as most employees do not get extra pay for ending absurd restrictive practices, the firefighters should consider themselves fortunate that the review is offering any pay improvements. As the Bain paper makes clear, there is no shortage of firefighters: "Even allowing for the risks and dangers of the service, firefighters compare well with similar jobs in the public and private sectors." As far as the FBU's bid for a 40 per cent pay increase is concerned, the paper makes clear that they are not worth it......

....the employers and the government must have a plan up their sleeve other than having the army fight fires. This should be an ultimatum: accept new terms and conditions or think about alternative careers.

Under the Employment Relations Act 1999, employers have a right to dismiss striking employees after eight weeks as long as they have taken reasonable steps to resolve the dispute. Just last week, Strathclyde Passenger Transport Authority settled a wildcat strike on Glasgow's subway system in two days by dismissing all striking employees.

The possibility of dismissal helps to concentrate minds wonderfully.


This is the Financial Times talking, not your 'Reds under beds' Mail or Express but perhaps the worlds most respected newspaper. They do not make comments like this lightly!

[divina] 13/11/2002 06:26

What do I think about the Firefighters.

I think they should get on with there Job
that there paid to do and what they were employed to do
and the wage they were given to do that Job.

They sums up what's wrong with this country
I hope the government give them NOTHING

I DO NOT SUPPORT THE FIREFIGHTERS STRIKE

[patsy] 13/11/2002 04:54

drewz

Right on but they wont listen.

With umpteen potential recruits for each of their jobs, they will have to resort to the usual violence intimidation of their 'fellow' workers and their families to keep them off 'their' patch and to hijack equipment which does not belong to them.

If they dont like the job why not quit and find a better one as the rest of us have to?

If the present firemen are so wonderful then the present pay and conditions must be enough to recruit the right sort of skills.

[drewz] 13/11/2002 04:34

It's going to be a pyrrhic victory or defeat I'm afraid for our brave lads.

There is no way that HMG can make a "special case" with a big inflation-busting payrise.

If they did there would be a tidal wave of other public sector special cases which would totally wreck the tax/spend equilibrium - result either big tax rises, big interest rate rises or both = everyone worse off and back to square one of the bad old Tory days - strike chaos, growing dole queues, house repossessions etc etc.

Do you think Brown/Blair would risk going back to all that just to keep the FBU happy? NOT A CAT IN HELL'S CHANCE.

The firefighters will lose thousands in lost wages before they are forced to accept a deal around the figure Bain has indicated i.e. approx £23k. Will it be worth it? NO WAY.

Striking is only damaging their own interests. It will never get them what they want.

Time to get back to work and serious negotiations on modernisation and higher efficiency in return for better pay, lads. Restrictive practices and bully-boy striking went out with the Ark.

[yf23_1] 13/11/2002 02:45

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear
IC 20 Sep bottom of p45

[bradwell] 13/11/2002 01:22

Esmer

So you don't appreciate the service the firemen/women give us???

[esmerelda] 13/11/2002 01:12

Yes, because of what everyone else has already said about the consequentials. We all appreciate the work two other services give us, ie the doctors/nurses and policemen. If the government gives way then I would expect their leaders to ask for inflation plus rises because of 'special circumstances' ie the firemen's rise. Where would it end? Well for this government IMHO it will end here.

[brainclamp] 13/11/2002 01:06

I second Bradwell.
The Firemen will win 40%, Gilchrist will not lose face and Tony Blair will be down tomorrow at the picket line to sign a huge check and flash his grin.

Working practices will be kept as before and the public open a fund to donate
from thier pay packets even more money for all the hard hours the firemen work in addition to thier extra taxes.

After receiving a 40% rise to £30K pa basic our great british firemen will morph into a single entity embodying goodness and spread light throughout the land.

[bradwell] 13/11/2002 01:03

What you reckon that tony and his cronies won't capitulate!!!!!

[esmerelda] 13/11/2002 01:01

Please forgive me if I merely remind you of the last line of my previous post. You know what happened to the miners when it ceased to be an employer dispute and became a political one. They might have shut (a bit of) the country down had things been a little different, the firemen can never do that. In any negotiation it is important to understand what your opposite number's bottom line is and I think the firemen have just overstepped it. Anyway that's only my opinion.

[billy3] 13/11/2002 00:59

Go on guys...strike.....do your worst.

Just one death as a result of the strike and your claim and any sympathy is history.
The press are champing at the bit to get the first story.
Hope you sleep well in your beds...even at work .

[jaxaxe] 13/11/2002 00:46

Techno,
thank you for your kind comments - you may replace your hat now...lol.
Jax.

[dobcroft] 13/11/2002 00:04

Bradwell, you should have noticed that this was simply a cut and paste from the FT article. Complain to the editor if you think this is rubbish.

You are right, I do know nothing about what really happened in Glasgow, so feel free to enlighten me.

However, the practice of forcing new terms and conditions on employees is happening all too frequently these days. Rightly or wrongly this is now normal, so why should the fireservice be different?

[gypsy king] 12/11/2002 23:55

Bring in the Army !

The REAL men !

[fast piayer] 12/11/2002 23:54

ADEK iam the one you dont get on with

[adek] 12/11/2002 23:53

Brad - you have a point..but is striking the answer?

I think that the fire service are losing public face...next will come the paramedics, and the teachers etc, etc.......this country is on the abyss..of .........................

...losing control..........

[wageslave] 12/11/2002 23:52

You are right esmerelda. But you can't blame them for trying!