Woodford Patient Capital Share Discussion Threads

[pediment] 03/5/2018 17:19

The DJI, the great bellwether of stock market health may have one more pop up in it until the actual correction starts imo

The thick black line is an approximation of the growth trend from 2016

I can't envisage a scenario where a death cross is avoided given the current price movements (slightly dubious of the concept though)

If anyone can find a bullish interpretation of that chart I would genuinely be delighted to hear it.

[ltcm1] 03/5/2018 16:17

solonic is this the low???!!!

[pediment] 03/5/2018 14:04

Au contraire, my enlightened progressive friend. However, I commend you on a retort more worthy of the sporting spirit and congratulate your bravery following your recent humbling although I'm sure you can improve on pallid. I was aiming for mediocre so, to my satisfaction, there is a possible equivalence there.

I have the honour to remain, Sir, your most humble and obedient servant.

[essentialinvestor] 03/5/2018 11:43

The vast vast majority of people holding WPCT will not read this BB,
of those that do, very few would take any notice of anonymous postings on
a free site.

[pediment] 03/5/2018 10:46

Good on you and jolly good Itcm1, counter trollwatchfail's disturbing posts with self deprecation and gentle irony, the British way :-)

[ltcm1] 03/5/2018 10:34

I think the true picture is when you strip out the Benelovent AI and Purplebricks fluff stocks and focus on the meat of the portfolio, Woodford has at this point stacked off half his dough. WPCT's true value today is 50 pence.

Ofcourse some fantastic discovery could change all that and I wish all holders well but it is my personal subjective opinion that this is where WPCT is right now, with 25p representing 'hope value'.

[careful] 03/5/2018 09:48

WPCT is currently trading at a huge discount to net assets.
It is just that this crazy ignorant market has the asset prices wrong.
About 4 years to wait, all will come good.

'how did granddad make the family fortune Mummy?'
..way back in 2018 he invested in WPCT.
he had a gift for seeing the future before it happened.

[jonwig] 03/5/2018 08:45

@ Toffee - yes, thanks. So no hedge funds busy here! BlackRock is a big holder, and they are never reluctant to lend out stock.

Agree about VCT/EIS. I take out a VCT every tax year and sticking to established names has been pretty profitable. Seneca are floating a new VCT next week in partnership with Hygea IT - pharma sector, I believe.

[saltraider] 03/5/2018 08:40

My assumption is that the short sellers are many but small. They won't have a lot of financial muscle but they can bad-mouth Woodford to try to talk the price down.

Anyway, it doesn't matter much if you've decided you'll hold for the long-term.

[toffeeman] 03/5/2018 08:16

Jon

only shorts above 0.5% must report - so there could be lots of little ones out there and of course they would rather not reveal themselves to Woody in case they need him sometime :)

I bought WPCT at the ipo sold at a profit, rebought lower down and then sold at a loss.

In reality WPCT is similar to an EIS or VCT investment - but without the tax breaks - so I have gone down the EIS route instead!

[careful] 03/5/2018 08:08

Yes, same thinking here.
The recent trial for a Parkinson's disease treatment disappointed .
But can you imagine how much a successful treatment of that nasty disease would be worth?

[orinocor] 03/5/2018 07:47

Saltraider
You are a complete idiot and I mean that in a kind, caring sort of way. I'm building a portfolio of investment trusts of which WPCT is effectively one. WPCT passes none of my tests on value or income. What's the attraction? if it's on the off chance one of the portfolio stocks will suddenly multi-bag then I'd be as well going down to Aintree with my money. With the risk involved and the lack of income I want a 30% discount to the net asset value which I think is appropriate for something like this. Best wishes.

[jonwig] 03/5/2018 06:39

I wrongly believed that open-ended funds could not employ gearing. It seems they can (up to 10%) and can effectively gear up more heavily by using derivatives. So Woodford's use of this in his open-ended funds would appear legitimate ... though not necessarily prudent!



[If the EU has revised these rules, I'm unaware of it.]

WPCT's borrowing limit is, I believe, 20% of gross assets.

@ saltraider - the short interest in WPCT is zero, according to both the FCA list and the Short Interest Tracker website.

[saltraider] 02/5/2018 23:06

Hands up ... I am really not a 'harsh' sort of a person. Apologies to @orinocor for being excessively terse.

The trouble is that there are a fair few people around and about who are trying to manipulate the WPCT share price ... and using some pretty dubious means to do it. They are shorting WPCT and trying to use other 'communications' avenues to add to the pressure on the price at the same time. That includes pushing blatantly fake news.

When you step in (@orinocor) and make negative statements based on apparently zero knowledge of the basic WPCT concept, you are just accidentally (and ignorantly ... sorry!) aiding and abetting the manipulators.

[chucko1] 02/5/2018 22:48

@saltraider, not totally unfair if a little harsh.

@orinocor, this was not designed to be a dividend play. Quite the opposite as most of the constituent companies will be capital sinks, not sources (I.e. dividend payers).

[saltraider] 02/5/2018 22:15

@orinocor Have you done ANY research at all? I really mean this. Do you know the first thing about WPCT? If you had/did, you would know that everything you have just posted was totally vacuous nonsense.

Get with the programme, for heaven's sake!

[orinocor] 02/5/2018 22:09

One thing I don't understand about this is why this stock, that has performed so poorly, and does not pay a dividend is valued at such a small discount to its net asset value.

Like today the NAV is 82p and the share price is 75p. That's a discount of only 8.5%. For that small discount I'd be hoping for a 5% covered yield.

[saltraider] 02/5/2018 21:39

@topvest On a point of detail, I understood WPCT to be a closed fund, i.e. an investment trust. I'll do some research but that's certainly my current understanding.

EDIT: Stockopedia "Woodford Patient Capital Trust plc is a closed-ended investment company." It is allowed to borrow.

[topvest] 02/5/2018 21:14

LOL. If you see what other threads I post on, you will see that I am not TW...Thankfully! I am sticking to Woodford blowing up in 2018. 8 months to go. Of course, it may be sooner or later, but that's my best guess. Depends partly on market movements.

He must be one of the few investors to be running an overdraft on an open ended fund. Call me stupid, but I thought investment trusts could borrow, but open ended funds can't employ gearing? One rule for the world, another for a reckless Woodford.