Versarien Share Discussion Threads

[ellissj] 31/8/2018 09:25

Indeed ash, i had a 'binary bet' that went wrong. 96% down at worst. Only 69% down now ! Luckily only a small punt. I keep it as a reminder. I have confidence in vrs management and neills'derisking'focus is music to my ears. Ie latest from matt this week i believe is that we are seeking a zero risk deal with chinese interests ! Atm happy to be all in here bar 1 ! Aimo. Gla. Best ellis

[spike_1] 31/8/2018 09:22

ash - Thanks for the background.
Q: what did they say to you about covering their clients bets?

Cheers - Spike

[1teepee] 31/8/2018 09:13

This is helpful . Thanks

[pshevlin] 31/8/2018 09:12

Looks like a big sell order may have just hit the share price

[luckyorange] 31/8/2018 09:12

What nationality are you ash?

Thanks for sharing that, you need to lose on one or two to learn the hard way.

[superg1] 31/8/2018 09:09

BTW

The tick back is just the sells Singer picked up, they took them and flipped them onto the offer.

Level 2 for those that have never had it is great learning curve for how MMs work and offers up better timing on when to buy.

Some may have noticed in recent weeks that some posters suggest it's about to tick up. That's because we can see MMs moving of the offer and the actual buy price rising.

Typically the moment the buy prices starts to move within the existing spread towards the actual offer price then more often than not the MM lies off the current offer to a higher offer.

Sometimes they will go up a penny but are still the lead offer. To me that means they are on the last few and are trying to get a bit more for them. Other times they go right off the offer and go higher on the bid than the current best bid and so the Sp goes up etc.

Just trying to help newbies or non level 2 thought spilling re personal experience.

If you are blind and don't have level 2 watch for the slight variations in the buy price when the spread is static.

If you don't have level 1 or live price access then you have no chance of seeing those.

[ashehzi] 31/8/2018 09:06

Thanks luckyorange. I'm techie and have around 7 research publications till my MSc especially in smart pervasive environments. I didn't pursue for PhD while all my fellows from that period are PhDs now. So reading and learning is engraved and that is what i say. Superg always mentions about research and that applies to every aspect. I mentioned earlier books to ChimpAndy and somebody said they are advanced. Yes they may be but in this field, we are up against smart people so knowledge is key even your operative principles are based on simple indicators.

Also, it is important to attend various webinars (not silly ones though). Other day i visited IG office ij London and they showed their trading desks and how they operate and cover themselves against spreadbets opened by their customers. No doubt 79% lose as noted on their website.

Last year i got bit greedy on IMM and even though bought at 90p level and went upto 170p but didn't sell and kept all, so lost alot. Still got 10k shares there but don't look at them at all and have no expectations as i consider them lost money. But i learned big lesson and i guess in stocks even though books tell you everything, until you lose you don't understand the pain, a lesson for life.

[spike_1] 31/8/2018 09:03

SG: I've had lunch with the guys at IG (at their expense), and I can tell you, they don't always hedge each bet, and when they do it is very often through CFD's.

Now that may have changed of late, I don't know.

Edit: at least - that's what they told me, obviously can't verify it as being correct, and as I say - it may have changed.

[grabster] 31/8/2018 09:02

Dr Tina Bass tweeted last night in reply to Tim Kempster (who I presume rated XG better than VRS - I don't get to see his tweets since he blocked me ;-)

"Looked at XG.Their financials make me feel insecure.$50m burn & burning nearly $2m per 1/4. DOW bailout but only 12mths left IF they can secure the rest of the bailout-not guaranteed. Public offer has poor take up. Who would buy at $8 per share? Is it you? #vrs way better imho"

[superg1] 31/8/2018 09:01

On the IG bit. You make the trade IG buys the shares and the shares held by them, hence when the dividend gets paid to them they pay you.

On IG with shorts the way it works is that IG loan out stock that you have bought. There is no way of stopping that I have had a long talk with them about not being happy with that.

That's why the IG loaned route for shorts isn't necessarily a good route. Loaned stock by a fund carries fees and an interest rate and is unlikely to be recalled suddenly.

With SB loaned stock it's at the risk of the holder sells their stock.

Simplying that If one person was the only holder of Stock X in IG and that stock was loaned out then anyone short would be forced to close if that holder sold his stock.

The funny side which I doubt ever happens is that the dividend fee that shorts would have to pay is effectively going straight to the holder.

So I image shorts in stocks which start announcing maiden dividends close sharpish. One because dividends attract investors and 2 because they would be paying the holder their dividend.

DYOR I'm just trying to recall what was said when I asked a while back.

[superg1] 31/8/2018 08:44

Spike

I saw the SB comments re shares held.

I read up on it some time back re dividends.

As understand it the likes of IG are just a middle man. EG you buy they make their money on the spread and flip your order into the market, and the sell or buy can be seen straight away.

I mentioned it for another reason recently.

On bad news dip shares SBs can often be the first to get hit. I trade some bad news shares for the bounce through IG. There is a reason for that besides the tax side. First of all it's usually very swift but I have noticed on many occasions it's instant and doesn't appear on the market until later.

I put that down to IG and their experience of knowing while sells will come, so will buys. So rather than in those active circs put the sells straight to market they delay slightly and make more by sticking them out the buyers. Effectively acting like an MM briefly but with wider margin than the MMs get. Then when it calms down stick what's left to the market.

Hence I use it as at times while some struggle to buy or sell via the normal route it goes straight through on the IG pot.

What I do know is you hold via an SB and dividends come you do get the dividends. IG would simply deduct the tax side and add the relevant amount to your account.

If you were short and dividends came then you have to pay the amount of the dividend, IG would deduct the amount from your account.

[anotherdrink] 31/8/2018 08:42

My take: clone Bruno and obtain a USA work visa :)

[spike_1] 31/8/2018 08:42

1teepee:
If it opens this year and they don’t postpone completion again.

That's not a delay, this is:

[woodpeckers] 31/8/2018 08:36

May be wrong but I don't think he actually works for us as in salaried. Think we just employ his services, ie he's self employed working for a number of companies.

[luckyorange] 31/8/2018 08:35

He is very happy though dgd 😊

[dgduncan] 31/8/2018 08:32

Seems a strange situation. I have not seen Marko do any VRS promotion - only his own business.

[grabster] 31/8/2018 08:26

With what we've heard about the USA being the focus this autumn - what part will Marko Ruusinen play? Does he still work for Versarien?

[1teepee] 31/8/2018 08:26

If it opens this year and they don't postpone completion again. Hope it does open though

[luckyorange] 31/8/2018 08:18

Just in case

"The name Gareth is an Arthurian Legend baby name. In Arthurian Legend the meaning of the name Gareth is: Gentle. Gareth was a knight of the Round Table portrayed in both Sir Thomas Malory's and Tennyson's versions of the Arthurian legend. Also a son of Lot."

Not a smidgeon of Welsh in those names 😉

[runthejoules] 31/8/2018 08:13

Don't worry guys I was just troll-trolling Snoopy69!

We all know Neill Ricketts is just his punk name yeah, like Rat Scabies, Ritchie Scurvey, Scabby Burns and Nick Beri-beri?

[alchemy] 31/8/2018 08:12

Another .5 p please, just for the record. I like puns.

[woodpeckers] 31/8/2018 08:12

bootie, I think he is covering all international work apart from China which he has handed over to Peter.