Lloyds Banking Share Discussion Threads

[willoicc] 23/3/2019 19:58

Not evidence. Project fear speculation.

RogerRail23 Mar '19 - 08:51 - 251888 of 252003
0 5 1
If Redwood and all the hard Brexiteers believe that a no deal is what the country not only voted for but actually want even though all the evidence points to the fact it is the most damaging outcome , and if they were truly democratic rather than perpetuating all the lies they freely spread as fact during the referendum, then surely they should be supporting a second peoples vote to reaffirm this is actually the peoples view?

[k38] 23/3/2019 19:42

I have slightly used palets, free of charge.. ;))

[grahamite2] 23/3/2019 19:40

Pawsche, some excellent posts from you but I think you're wasting your time. Remoaners like My Retirement Fund and RogerRail are ignorant and bigoted and quite unresponsive to any argument involving fact or logic.

[excell1] 23/3/2019 19:34

Minerve,Bob,careful Alp etc. I have booked you all on the next Euro Tunnel express out of the UK. (Sorry Alp you already reside over there). It is obvious you favour Europe over the UK and wish to remove democracy from our countries of this union.
Bon Voyage from me.Please don't return.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 19:23

Why we voted leave
By JOHNREDWOOD | Published: MARCH 23, 2018
On 23rd June 2016 17.4 million voters told Parliament we should leave the EU.

Leave voters voted to take back control.

We voted to take back control of our money, our laws and our borders.

We voted to be a sovereign people again.

The overarching aim is to restore our freedoms

To become self governing as we used to be

We wish our Parliaments to frame our laws

To levy and spend out taxes

To make our borders safe

To award the precious gift of citizenship to those we choose to invite

We did not vote in the belief that future Parliaments will always be wise

Nor that they will always get it right

We voted to restore powers to Parliament because it is our Parliament

We can lobby and influence it

We can dismiss it and replace the MPs when they no longer please.

I find it surprising that some find it difficult to understand this overriding wish

For it is based on our long standing pursuit of freedom

It springs from our history

The history of the UK is the story of the long march of every man and every woman to the vote

The story of asserting the rule of law against all, however mighty.

We prize the gift of freedom under the law for all on an equal basis

We share an aversion to slavery

A dislike of military rule

A resistance to arbitrary government

A rejection of the patronising errors of elites

A distaste for overmighty bureaucracies cramping our freedoms

A belief that we should be free to do whatever we please unless the laws prevents it

The signposts to democracy run through Magna Carta to the first Parliaments

From the 1660 settlement to the Glorious Revolution

From the Great Reform Act to the triumph of the suffragettes

We carelessly lost some of these freedoms,

casting away much of the power of our vote and voice

by passing powers to the European Union

We allowed the EU to impose laws we did not want

To levy taxes we disagreed with

And to spend our money as they saw fit

Brexit is designed to recall those lost powers

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 19:06

eeyore
Posted March 23, 2019 at 12:15 pm | Permalink

Having formally delegated the decision to the people and promised to implement their verdict, it’s a bit rich for MPs to award themselves the final say after all.

Poor Merlin keeps trying to find a way to square the circle. He might consider that a promise is a promise, but to break your word is dishonour. He might reflect too that the responsibility lies with the people, whose shoulders are broader than any politician’s, however eminent or wise, and who will pay the full price for their folly, if folly it be.

Churchill’s motto throughout life was “Trust the people”. Any use to you, Merlin?

[minerve 2] 23/3/2019 19:05

Time for a new referendum. Hard-Brexiters probably don't number more than a few million.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 19:05

EUSSR = EVIL EMPIRE

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 19:04

MAY is FAECES



EUSSR is FAECES



Con and Labour Party is QUISLINGS covered in FAECES

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:59

Dominic
Posted March 23, 2019 at 12:00 pm | Permalink

Brexit is the way out. That’s why Parliament offered us a referendum to made this final choice. 52% voted for Brexit. Why is that so difficult to understand

The problem is simple. The pro-EU political and business establishment refuse to implement the will of the people. To them, democracy is an irrelevance

You either believe in the sanctity of democracy or you don’t . I do. If Remain had won I would have accepted the democratic decision of the majority

We have people in power that despise democratic intervention. That can only lead one way

[diku] 23/3/2019 18:56

Talking of EU If the EU was so great why have we got so many EU migrants here in higher proportion to UK migrants in the EU?...it is all about better lifestyle, education, healthcare, democracy and above all money...earn money in UK and send it back home...

[alphorn] 23/3/2019 18:50

I have just checked in on some of the media tonight.

The Express is reporting that five people marched today whereas the Telegraph has it as eight.

No doubt many of the inane posters will be quoting these numbers as they believe everything that they read in those papers.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:47

Boris for PM

[pawsche] 23/3/2019 18:45

@RogerRail - 23 Mar '19 - 18:00 - 251983

It's laughable how a statement of the truth creates so much hot air. Can one of you so called brexiteers please point out where in the definition of democracy does it say that a decision cannot be reconsidered in the light of experience?

We haven't had any experience of brexit... We have yet to exit the EU. Once that has been done and a few years, 41 maybe, have been allowed to elapse, then is the time to reconsider in the light of experience.


Secondanly the level of denial from these people is incredible. Far from being project fear, this country has already suffered badly because of brexit and there will be even greater harm under a no deal.

Suffered how? We have a better GDP growth than the other major countries in the EU, employment is at record levels, there have been major investment plans announced by external companies, etc.

Unfortunately all you hear from these people is the same regurgitated nonsense spouted by the likes of Mogg, Boris and Redwood as if what they are saying is a statement of fact, as if they have greater knowledge of business than the subject matter experts from the CBI &TUC, as if it's better to take advice from Trump when his motives are to remove the competion than the governor of the bank if england.

The CBI, apart from only being representative of multi-national "crony captalist" companies who use their power to lobby governments and the EU in order to stifle competetion, has been consistently 100% wrong with its predictions and choices, ditto Mark Carney... As for the TUC??? Are you delusional?

[fatnacker] 23/3/2019 18:44

that's a very good point xxxxxy.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:37

And why should the government listen to a million? people when they have ignored 17.4 million.

[k38] 23/3/2019 18:31

Just to say, ...putting the same "meaningfull vote" to parliament three times.She personally, but conservatives and labour, broke all the rules of democracy and promise on delivering Br-exit .If they had kept their promises today will have been a different story.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:29

How joining the EU led to a big decline in UK industry
By JOHNREDWOOD | Published: JUNE 16, 2016
There are also crucial issues to understand about how the asymmetric single market did damage to Uk industry. When we joined the EEC, now the EU, in 1973, more barriers to trade had been pulled down in manufacturing than in services. EU rules were often such that UK industry was badly damaged by the shock of joining and the continued shock of staying in as the rules increased and tightened.
When the UK joined the EU we had a 45 million tonnes a year steel industry. Today we are battling to save an 11 million tonnes industry.
When we joined the EU we had a 400,000 tonnes a year aluminium industry. Today we have just 43,000 tonnes of capacity left.
When we joined the EU we had 20 million tonnes of cement capacity. Today we have 12 million tonnes.
Just before we joined the EEC in 1971 we had a 1 million tonnes a year fishing industry. Today we have 600,000 tonnes.
The October 2013 government “Future of Manufacturing” Report shows that between 1951 and 1973 metals output rose 3% a year. Since joining the EEC/EU it has declined by more than 6%
Between 1951 and 1973 food and drink output rose by 5.6% per year. Since joining the EEC/EU it has fallen by 1% a year.
Between 1951 and 1973 textiles output expanded at 2.6% a year. Since joining the EEC/EU it has fallen by more than 6% a year.
Whilst it may not be fair to blame all this decline on membership of the EU, as there are other factors, it nonetheless shows categorically that joining the EU and helping create the so called single market has not helped us grow and has not saved many of our industries from decline.
In some cases EU policies are the main driver of the disaster. The Common Fishing Policy is clearly the main reason for the dreadful decline of our fishing industry, as many foreign vessels were licenced to take our fish. Our energy intensive businesses were often damaged by the high energy prices required by the EU common energy policy.
The EU has prevented UK subsidy of industry under its state aids rules, but has often provided subsidised loans and grants to businesses to set up elsewhere in the EU. The UK has seen a spate of factory closures balanced by new and expanded facilities in poorer EU countries. The UK lost van production to Turkey, car capacity to Slovakia, chocolate to Poland, domestic appliances to the Netherlands and the Czech Republic and metal containers to Poland amongst others in recent years. In various cases there was an EU grant or loan involved in the new capacity.
Looking at our huge balance of payments deficit today in goods with the rest of the EU, we can see the long term impact of the EU’s damage to our manufacturing capacity.
This April’s balance of payments figures show us in heavy deficit in machinery, vehicles, electrical machinery, mineral fuels, plastics, iron and steel, wood and clothing. Last year our total goods trade deficit hit £85 billion with the rest of the EU. Between 2008 and 2015 our exports grew at 5% with the rest of the world, whilst falling with the EU.
Perhaps remain might like to answer the following questions:
Why have we suffered industrial decline and closures with production shifting elsewhere in Europe since joining the EEC?
Why do trade in surplus with the rest of the world but have such a huge deficit with the EU?
Why have we ended up importing fish, electricity, steel and much else when we used to self sufficient?

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:28

17+ MILLION VOTED TO LEAVE

17 million is a big political movement and has significant purchasing power. Time to start to think about using this.

And there are Dutch bulbs to think about. Dutch Tulips
REALLY THINK HARD BEFORE BUYING ANYTHING from EUSSR
Spanish holiday. Irish holiday. French wine. Belgian chocolate. Think. Etc

The People, at least 17 million can act as well as Parliament.

People. Gloves off. Time to BOYCOTT the EU. The Elite have crushed and twisted and swindled our Democracy. But the People have teeth too and it is time to bare them,

This 'Withdrawal Agreement' cobbled together by May and a two-faced Conservative Party is trying to fob off the The Referendum Result and sell this 'agreement' with Fear.

But in effect it is REMAIN all dressed up in new clothing and method. This will never be harmonious, and now may be the time to consider various campaigns such as whether to buy German cars for example. 17 million voted against staying in the EU. That is a lot of buying power. Think before buy now.

Campaign. The politicians have not listened. The Economic War. THE PEOPLE RULE OK!

German cars and apes


German cars unfinished business


And there is the consideration of Continental European wine. Many fine and exciting wines found outside Europe.

The EUSSR has stated publicly it wants to HURT the UK. We too can HURT the EUSSR too, particularly Germany and Vichy France. Spanish holiday. Irish holiday. French wine. Belgian chocolate. Think.


The People can vote and not be listened to. BUT THE PEOPLE CAN ACT . Think before buying from the EUSSR

Pass it on. BOYCOTT the EUSSR. Tusck wants us to go to Hell – the very Gestapo and Mafia thinking that still lies at the heart of the EUSSR

Pass it on.

[xxxxxy] 23/3/2019 18:24

Let me remind Mrs May of the Conservative Manifesto in 2017 – I want her to implement it

By JOHNREDWOOD | Published: MARCH 23, 2019

On the EU the Manifesto made a lot of sense. It said“As we leave the EU we will no longer be members of the single market or customs union
“We believe it is necessary to agree the terms of our future partnership alongside our withdrawal, reaching agreement on both within the 2 years allowed by Article 50 of the Treaty of European Union.
“We will not bring the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights into UK law.
“We continue to believe that No deal is better than a bad deal for the UK.”

It also confirmed that we will take back “control of our laws” and “We will control immigration”. “We will pursue free trade with European markets, and secure new free trade agreements with other countries”

It is difficult to see how an MP who supported this Manifesto can support the current Withdrawal Agreement.

All MPs should remember the words of the government leaflet to all households before the referendum:

“This is your decision. We will implement what you decide”