Concepta Share Discussion Threads

[papy02] 23/9/2011 11:50

Praipus, I spreadbet it. (a short position on EURGBP Dec 11 contract via Selftrade spreadbetting). The spread is excellent - under 0.1%, the financing cost I always put in the "too hard to calculate" box, but for a short position I think it is not too material. With Selftrade spreadbetting the min position is £1/point which is an implied position value of £8700 or so. Margin they require is tiny, but I've funded the account to allow for a 10% move against me, as they auto-close the position if you dip below the required margin)

[papy02] 23/9/2011 11:41

I've asked CPT what net shareholder payout per share is assumed in the 9.451m perf fee accrual - will post here if/when I get anything.

To add to that there is any additional payout relating to property sales after 30 June 2011.

[praipus] 23/9/2011 11:39

Hi Pap02, re: your post 1080: "EUR/GBP" how have you hedged? (i.e. spreadbet, CFD, traded options, futures etc)

[loganair] 23/9/2011 11:32

RR - 1000 shares would be worth €250 worth of 'B' shares what ever happens to the price of the standard shares.

[loganair] 23/9/2011 11:30

I've decided to sell out as CPT is slightly up over the past few weeks, while many good safe, dividend paying shares are well down over the past couple of weeks.

Staying with CPT the most I was likely to get was a further 20% to 25%, while over this same period these good safe, dividend paying shares are likely to rise by at least the same amount, plus dividends paying around 7% per year. If I wait then the chances are there may be little difference between the rises in price, but I would be buying at 25% less dividend rate.

[roberts_rich] 23/9/2011 11:10

so if u say you had 1000 shares how much would the b shares value?

[rbcrbc] 23/9/2011 10:57

So if you are correct and if the 35c quote remaims (relatively) contstant then after the 25c payment we will have 11.45c to come for a price of 10c a 14.5% return - makes reinvesting the payout very tempting.

It'd be nice if they added a low cost dealing service option to the upcoming paperwork to allow small holders to sell their remaining shares in the market at little or no commission and drag the share price down a little further ;-)

[papy02] 23/9/2011 10:19

OK, many thanks. I think the correct "payout" number to use from my post above is 40.95c/share (which assumes the performance fee is *included* in the amount CPT accrued for). If so, and deducting the 4.5c paid in Jan 10, that means they are accruing for a payout from here of 36.45c on sales completed as at 30 June 2011 (incl the current 25c payout).

I've topped up, as the downside seems limited. Had to pay 30.86pence/share.

(I also hedged EUR/GBP to hedge a total payout amount of 38c/share = a compromise guess between the above and the 41.9c NAV. If it turns out I'm under-hedged I'll be delighted by the payout anyway ;-).

[rbcrbc] 23/9/2011 10:01

I think that the last distribution we received is included,

From 5/2/10 RNS:
The calculation of the capital performance payment shall include
any dividends paid on or after 1 July 2009.

We got 4.5c in Jan 2010 - I dont think there were any others.

[papy02] 22/9/2011 22:14

The half-year report states: "Based on the sales completed as at 30 June 2011, the Company has made an accrual for a capital performance payment of EUR9.5 million". Though the amount is stated elsewhere in the same report as 9.4m and (the figure I have used) 9.451m.

This performance payment is:

10% on excess distribution available to shareholders above 17.25 Euros/share

25% on excess distribution available to shareholders above 34.5 Euros/share, with an effective hurdle set at 36.4 to allow for the performance payment

If my maths is correct, this implies distribution "available to" shareholders (on sales completed as at 30 June 2011) of 40.95c/share or 43.11c/share, depending whether the 25% rate is on the amount net of perf fee or incl perf fee.

Both numbers look attractive to me - even optimistic compared to the stated NAV of 41.9c. Are any previous distributions /dividends be included in the performance targets? If yes, how much are these?

I'd very much welcome any comments/ corrections/ advances on the above understanding.

[papy02] 22/9/2011 16:47

Many thanks RBCRBC and Horndean Eagle

[horndean eagle] 22/9/2011 15:07

The NAV makes provision for the performance fee. Have a look in the balance sheet.

[rbcrbc] 22/9/2011 14:52

The Net Asset Value ought to include an estimate of liquidation costs and a provision for fees and expenses expected to be incurred in realising the assets. A quick mental arithmetic on the results makes me think this is the case.

It might be worth confirming with the co. that that is the case - If true the 41.9c is probably pretty close to the eventual total payout - which would make it a stonking buy and probably an excellent reinvestment when the first payout comes.

NAV at 41.9c = 97m EUR

Current Mkt cap at 34c and 232m shares in issue = 79m EUR.

As at 31 August 2011, total cash at holding company level was approximately EUR89.1 million

[fugwit] 22/9/2011 11:43

Many thanks for the info, that makes sense to me. My concerns were that the B shares may fluctuate in value in a secondary market. Pleased those concerns were unfounded. Thanks again all.

[papy02] 21/9/2011 20:20

The 25 cents "ex" date is Weds 28th next week.

No payout date given - though "Further particulars and a form of election will be circulated in the next few weeks" implies at least a month from today (?)

Given the possibility of a Euro meltdown in that period, is anyone else inclined to hedge the payout amount in £ at the current EUR/GBP ex-rate?

Has anyone done an updated estimate of what the eventual total payout from this point will be - ie the likely total of the "later this year" and "windup" distributions? I see the updated NAV of 41.9 euro cents, but the report makes my head hurt in terms of what adjustments need to be made to that, after deduction of the current 25c distribution.

[crowthers2] 21/9/2011 18:44

Hi fugwit.
If you go back to post 1002 there's some stuff about B shares and how treated - hope it gets clear in the next week or so.

[praipus] 21/9/2011 18:36

Tax regime/domicile of the largest shareholders I suspect. Capital gain rather than income tax. Have you utilised your CGT allowance this year?

[fugwit] 21/9/2011 18:22

What are the benefits to shareholders of issuing a B share, wouldn't a cash dividend be alot easier for all concerned and keep costs lower? Can someone enlighten me? TIA.

[loganair] 21/9/2011 17:43

At some time after 31 December 2011, the Company intends to effect a further distribution to shareholders of any residual surplus cash balance and to seek shareholders' approval to de-list the Company from the Alternative Investment Market of the London Stock Exchange and in due course thereafter to commence and implement an orderly members voluntary liquidation, of itself and its then remaining subsidiaries.

The Board expects that this process will be initiated within the next 12 months.

[gunter guil] 21/9/2011 14:39

half yearly report out. 25 cents a share distribution by way of a b share bonus issue. record date 30 sept. and more intended by the end of the year.

[loganair] 20/9/2011 09:14

Interims are due out this Thursday 22nd September and End of Year 31 December.

[gunter guil] 20/9/2011 07:20

Surely we should get news any day now

[rbcrbc] 09/9/2011 14:27

Half-yearly report was out on 14th Sept last year - Next week could be interesting with:
A revised NAV
An Interim Sept payment announcement
An update on the more substantial Q4 payment

Last published NAV was 39.1c vs current share price of 33c = 15% discount

[rbcrbc] 15/8/2011 16:59

Assuming the above transactions proceed as contemplated, the Board intends that the Company should distribute at least 5 euro cents per share by 30 September 2011. In addition, a further and more substantial distribution is intended to be made towards the end of the fourth quarter of this year.

If this is paid as a divi we should get an announcement sometime by mid Sept, if it is a full choice between Capital return and divi then more time will be needed to send out and return the paperwork, for the amount due I suspect it will just be a divi, but the announcement ought to contain an update on the 'more substantial distribution'.