Concepta Share Discussion Threads

[rbcrbc] 06/5/2011 17:29

graham - I also am not sure if one of the previous distributions make up part of the management target ???

Either way the next payment should be more than the current share price ;-)

1.5m for VAT recovery
0.6m in escrow for Promenada
2.6m in Court, hopefully get a bit back
0.9m in escrow for Osawa sale
2.1m in escrow for Babilonas sale.

That adds up to 7.7m or 3.3c per share.
I think also there are some more properties to be disposed of.

As you say a complete set of figures (probably in June, after the distribution announcement) would be very useful.

Praipus - I made a few pennies out of PEJR in the past put they are now in the hands of the liquidator, with a final payment (of less than 1p per share) to come.

The only other one I know of is TRC - I have made some cash out of them as well, and still hold, but havent really looked at them recently, I may use some of the proceeds here to top-up there. I think there is one legal action outstanding.

[praipus] 06/5/2011 16:13

Weiss selling some direct shares and using a CFD to increase the holding to over 29%.

To track the rest of Weiss's holdings take a look at post 3 on the following BB

[praipus] 06/5/2011 14:38

grahamg8 "dispose of the rump for some extra cash" very good point easily overlooked. I know to my cost.

The quality of posts here is excellent. Do any of you trade liquidations as a theme?

If so can you recommend any other companies to target?

[grahamg8] 06/5/2011 14:34

RBCRBC as I indicated in my #1018 the management peformance bonus is based on the net distributed not on the gross available. So using your 45c gross per share the amount to deduct is slightly lower:
0-17.25c all goes to shareholders, 17.25-34.5c add cost of fee @10% 1.725c.
Total cost to distribute 34.5c is 36.225c, which leaves 8.775c.
This is divided as 80% to shareholders and 20% to management co. ie divide by 1.25. Final tranche is 7.02c
Thus the shareholders get 41.02c
The manager gets 3.48c

Still quite a lot of cash to come in a second/final distribution:
1.5m for VAT recovery
0.6m in escrow for Promenada
2.6m in Court, hopefully get a bit back
0.9m in escrow for Osawa sale
2.1m in escrow for Babilonas sale.

Final results last year were out on 7 May, so hopefully we will get an all singing all dancing set of figures this month which updates and summarises everything for us and gives us the distribution timetable as well.

I also had the thought last night that once all the assets had been sold and funds distributed we would be left with a shell company carrying some juicy tax losses. Thus there should be an opportunity to dispose of the rump for some extra cash by getting a profitable co. to buy up the remains and reduce their future corporation tax bill.

[rbcrbc] 06/5/2011 14:06

There has still been income coming in from the properties we own, I have assumed that this income more than covers the day-to-day running costs, but I might be wrong. As for the wind-up costs I am guessing at 2m but since the wind-up was announced this ought to have been accounted for in the NAV and probably ought to be part of the difference between the total cash and the uncommitted cash, whether it has or not I don't know but at 2m that would be .86c per share.

There are also other properties that will remain in the core portoflio, so there will be residual value from these and the various escrow amounts after the main divi. I suspect many small holders might sell out of their residual holdings once the major divi is paid and there 'could' be a significant second bite at the cherry once they have done so, although it may take 12 months or so before the next payout.

We have a long way to go before the close and many more pennies might be available to be made for the patient ;-)

[praipus] 06/5/2011 13:49

Thanks RBCRBC

I've been getting the NAV I use from



interesting for comparison;)

[maiken] 06/5/2011 13:33

RBCRBC,
Since this episode is now drawing to a close it's time for me to say thanks for your periodic comments which I have found interesting and useful.

The only costs I think you may have missed are the various day-to-day running and wind-up costs to be extracted by mgmt, as opposed to the specified incentivisations you have correctly totalled up.

Maybe 2c to allow for this ?

[rbcrbc] 06/5/2011 12:16

If you click on 'news' at the top of the page it is from 'half yearly report' 14th Sept onwards. Except the management fee which was

[praipus] 06/5/2011 11:57

RBCRBC interesting analysis which documents/RNS are you using for your figures?

[rbcrbc] 06/5/2011 10:22

26c per share from this sale alone, Blue Knight/Osowa is due to complete at the end of May I think that is the last significant cash flow until all the escrows etc trickle in, so I would guess we will have a divi declaration then.
Osowa should bring in approx 18m Eur or 7.75c per share.
The other part of Blue Knight raised 7.6m or 3.25c per share.
The 6 crotian supermarkets sold for 3.5m or 1.5c per share.
The half-yearly report showed uncommited cash of 15.1m or or 6.5c per share.

26 + 7.75 + 3.25 + 1.5 + 6.5 = 45c per share of which (45-7.75) = 37.25 should be available now.

With the management co getting 10% of any return above a distribution available to shareholders in excess of a EUR17.25 cents per share hurdle and 25% of any returns available to shareholders above a EUR34.5 cents per share hurdle.

thats 25% of 45-34.5 or 2.5c plus 10% of 34.5 - 17.25 or 1.725.

45 - 2.5 - 1.725 = 40.775

Am I missing anything significant ?

[flying pig] 06/5/2011 08:33

More money to be distributed following asset sale.

[praipus] 05/5/2011 13:43

RBCRBC do you still have an ATPT holding? I've left a question for you on the ATPT BB.

[loganair] 05/5/2011 11:34

And it's a Direct holding.

[rbcrbc] 05/5/2011 10:40

Well it proves that they are as interested as we are ;-)

I dont see anything like that volume going through the market so I guess we will see an RNS for a reduction soon. It'll be fascinating to see who sold and what they bought instead as they obviously see something else as even better value than CPT. 21m shares = approx £6m.

Only a few weeks until the end of May when I expect the divi/buyback announcement. I would expect the issueance of the paperwork and the payment to be quick as they have had plenty of preparation time and just need to slot in the correct figure (which will depend on whether Blue Knight and Promenada both complete).

I still expect a distribution in the region of 40c.

[papy02] 05/5/2011 10:12

Blimey

ING Groep N.V. just acquired 9% of CPT.
Wonder who from.
Comments anyone?

[gunter guil] 04/5/2011 13:39

volume picked up today

[porketh] 04/5/2011 13:15

I've taken my eye off the ball with CPT over the last few months, but share price seems to be going in the right direction and it seems that holding might just pay off.

I'll watch with greater interest going forward.

[rbcrbc] 08/4/2011 14:04

WOW - thats a nasty little pile of AT trades, does somebody know something or is somebody playing games? My gut is that this is a good buying opportunity, but I am overweight here already.

[kramch] 02/4/2011 14:11

g-8 many thanks for your calcs, I was going to do the same exercise but been a bit busy.

It would be great to get an upto date breakdown in the 12/10 accounts, but guess they will be playing their cards close to their chest at the moment. K.

[grahamg8] 02/4/2011 08:39

Papy02 as the intention is to wind up the Co then the new shares would then be deemed worthless. At that point you could claim the tax loss.

Kramch yes I did allow for the performance fee. My gross was 61.0cps with 8.35cps deducted. This is slightly more than they would be entitled to because the % was based on the gross estimated value, whereas they earn the fee on the net distributed to shareholders. But the difference is pretty small.

To give a bit more detail the cash element then was 29m Euros but we now have to add rental income, interest earned, and deduct fees and running costs.

Quoted values @31/12/09 less quoted loans, all Euro x millions
Agrocor 5.526
Antana 1.889 but dev now cancelled
Gdansk 10.386
Other Blue Knight: Lodz, Sosmowiec, Torun
15.003
Slupsk 0.800
Promenada 54.100 the most valuable by far and so I can see why the
reluctance to make a payment to us unless it includes
these receipts.
Macromall 4.750 'severe difficulties'
Riga Centre 15.400
Baia/Satu Mare 4.050

Other properties had negative net values totalling ~84m or 36.3cps so successfully removing these from the balance sheet has nearly as much effect as selling those properties with value. But it looks like Babilonas at gross 22.500 less debt 23.500m might eventually make a small return in any case.

All these 2009 YE values need to be adjusted for the actual debt now/at time of sale which I have noticed aren't quite the same as the previous figures and the actual selling price less any selling costs rather than the valuation.

So anyway you can appreciate why the figures now are only a guide, and also why my distribution figure is so much higher than the quoted NAV because the banks get left with non recourse loans. Nice to get our own back on the blighters for once.

[papy02] 01/4/2011 19:26

Thanks, Steve36

unfortunately reading Section 5 of the Circular that covered this:


it seems unlikely that the capital loss can be recognised, as per following edited extracts (for the Dividend option):



... the Shareholder's original base cost ... will be apportioned between the Ordinary and New shares

... after payment of the Dividend the New shares will be converted into Deferred shares (which have negligible value, are not listed, and cannot be transferred except when company buys them all back for 0.01 Euros in aggregate)

The proportion of base cost will continue to be attributed to the New Shares following their conversion into Deferred Shares.

Consequently only a proportion of the base cost of the original holding of Ordinary shares will be available on a subsequent disposal of Ordinary shares.



It sounds like the only potential capital loss is on the New shares and they cannot be disposed of.

But would be delighted to be contradicted!

[rbcrbc] 01/4/2011 19:12

5th Feb 2010

The Agreement provides for a capital performance payment to LLP, based upon
actual cash available for return to shareholders. LLP will receive 10% of any
return above a distribution available to shareholders in excess of a EUR17.25
cents per share hurdle and 25% of any returns available to shareholders above a EUR34.5 cents per share hurdle



It does get very complicated....

[kramch] 01/4/2011 18:31

grahamg8 - have you deducted the Management's incentive costs, I remember it is quite significant? K.

[steve36] 01/4/2011 17:49

Papy, I haven't considered this closely so I could be wrong but I think a B/C type split should give you the option to either receive a 'normal' dividend and claim a capital loss for the original cost or receive a return of capital giving rise to a capital gain or loss depending on original cost.

[grahamg8] 01/4/2011 15:25

RBCRBC, I was thinking along the same lines. The problem is that the last comprehensive values we have date back to 31 Dec 09 in the Results as issued 7 May 2010. I put together a table dated 31/08/10 including all the changes that I could trawl in the period between. It's all a bit of a scrawl but seems to show that at that time the payout we could get in total would be 52.65cps. If we could be a bit patient then we should get a revised table of assets and debts in the new FY results which I suppose should be out early May.

This is rather more than the quoted 32.6cps NAV partly because we have to add in 6.6cps for the Plaza Portfolio which was taken over by the financing bank with a negative net value; plus the plan seems to have been that so called 'non core' assets would simply be abandoned and the banks left to repossess. It all got very complex and although I always promised myself to go back and do a thorough job I never got round to it. I can't quite tell but I think the 4.5pps we received on 26/01/10 formed part of this, so we would then have 48.15cps to look forward to. But these figures are now so out of date that they could at best be classed as a general guide.