Celsius Resources Share Discussion Threads

[davydoo] 15/12/2010 14:09

DNA got me thinking about Special Purpose Vehicles. Thats esentially what CLA was setup as initially, it then has two subsidiaries. Capital Lease Malta and Capital Lease Australian Portfolio

Interesting to note that the refinancing announced this week was to repay mezzanine finance secured to buy the A320 and A321's which are in the malta subsidiary .....but.... the new finance is secured against the australian subsidiary, which owns the 3 Fokker 100s on lease to Skywest

[gosgos] 15/12/2010 13:32

No - what's its EPIC?

[davydoo] 15/12/2010 13:06

I've just started looking at Doric Nimrod Air One, an aircraft leasing co. that floated this week. Anyone seen it?

I'll post some comments later.

[gosgos] 14/12/2010 14:23

I am also thinking that it bodes well for raising additional debt to buy more planes which could really get the price moving up again.

[davydoo] 14/12/2010 13:17

Yes, good news, and it will drop straight to the bottomline so should increase annual profits by 5% or so, regardless of other factors.

I just placed a dummy trade for 10,000 and was quoted 15.9p to buy, thats the highest its been to buy for a while.

[gosgos] 14/12/2010 11:52

A little +ve news let's hope there is more to come ;-)

[gosgos] 06/12/2010 17:01

I wish! You would think they should know the difference between discovering oil and water!! Oh well basically lost all my profits but no worse thankfully.

[davydoo] 06/12/2010 16:32

Trading DES? and you thought I was a risky investor!

I hope you were out before today's news Gosgos.

[gosgos] 03/12/2010 10:29

It is a concern, but to expand further they should want to keep the institutions reasonably happy and that means giving them a route out above 24p at some point.

[davydoo] 03/12/2010 10:13

Harrogate I think your concern about 'risk diversification' is a very valid one. As you say AVAP already own 51% of CLA, and also CLA has 3 planes leased to Skywest (the original leases it had before the step up to the Thomas Cook A321s)

My single biggest concern for CLA is that it becomes an unused backwater. So that if Skywest's operating needs drive this collection of companies, e.g purchasing more A320s, which is their stated aim (and with 1 already they can leverage their initial costs)then once found those planes will be purcashed and leased through Avation.

[gosgos] 03/12/2010 09:33

Yes it is a good BB ;-)

I have been trading DES a bit in the last few months and those BBs are insane!

[harrogate] 03/12/2010 09:10

Hi

I never meant to suggest your questions at the AGM weren't the right ones ...It is tough at AGMs since it is never a really chatty environment and when most are on the phone even worse. I guess I am frustrated since I expected the move to main market by AVAP to be followed very closely by a new lease or some corporate tidying up. I call myself a long term investor ...maybe I need to behave like one!!! I appreciate the comments and the background as always. This is a good BB

[gosgos] 02/12/2010 19:32

Harrogate: I understand your issues and I have to say I think Jeff has devised a fantastic earner for himself and his close colleagues. However, as far as I can see Jeff has done a good job developing SkyWest and the leasing business is also very sound financially. I struggle to see the upside for Jeff in peeing on institutions and along side that PIs. That said, there is no particular urgency for Jeff or the institutions in driving the share price higher in the short term given that the underlying value is clearly there.

If I had plenty of spare cash I would continue to invest in CLA and to a lesser extent AVAP (based on current valuations). But you need a 2-5 year time horizon!

[gosgos] 02/12/2010 19:25

[e-mail]

[davydoo] 02/12/2010 18:56

I can understand your sense of vagueness from my post. I guess I am a little too, but I havent been left with any major concerns, it just seems to be a continuation of the current status quo. The people with the answers were on a conf call from Singapore, so it made it difficult to see the body language of the response, or at times to even know who was responding, and i felt a little awkward in knowing how far to press, especially as I was unable to gather my thoughts with no other shareholders there to ask thier own questions.

[harrogate] 02/12/2010 18:37

Thanks for the update. I regard myself as a CLA shareholder and I have to say I am pretty underwhelmed with what I think they are saying ..The logic of splitting the non Skywest business is bonkers given 51% of CLA is owned by AVAP. And in fact I may be wrong but I think they did some non Skwest business in AVAP anyway. Just doesn't make sense to me. I am off to think about AVAP ..I may be thinking it is time to move on. Roadshow ...more likley trying to get it tipped by the t1ps lot I would think. Who can buy any shares in CLA ..what is the free float? The price from my knowledge hasn't been caused by the large holders selling. It all sounds really vague and doesn't quite smell right but I don't know why

[gosgos] 02/12/2010 18:22

Thanks very much for the feedback DD. I too am happy to hold but hopeful of some activity in the New Year ;-)

[davydoo] 02/12/2010 17:55

I attended the agm today. I was the only external shareholder there, but there was a full representation (split across London and Singapore) of all directors, co. sec, nomad, auditor etc.

All resolutions were passed including the option to buy back up to 10% of shares. I got the impression this was more of a procedural thing to have the option rather than any immediate plans.

I asked about AVAP plans for CLA, but understandably that question was considered one for an AVAP agm not for CLA board to answer. (The AVAP agm was also held today in Singapore, but i didnt get involved in it) However the intention is to continue operating CLA as a stand alone business, along the original lines of continued diversifcation of risk away from sole reliance on Skywest. The board recognise the undervalution and are planning to market the company with some kind of roadshow, but i dont have details of what that entails or when.

I asked about the previous finance facility, which they confirmed had lapsed, and the suggestion was it could have continued but would have cost to do so, they felt confident they still had good banking relationships that could enable the finance of additional aircraft.

I also got the impression a fund raising may be needed to provide the extra equity to go with any additional borrowing. It was recognised that this might be difficult with original investors currently underwater, perhaps therefore the intention to promote the company through a roadshow, and perhaps a reason for AVAP to raise equity which was approved at its agm today, to allow it to increase or at least maintain its controlling stake in CLA.

With very few shares available, any positive attention should move the price quickly i think, especially if that number is reduced by CLA buying back its own shares.

There was a general discussion about the arbitrage opportunity with CLA now undervalued compared to AVAP.

Im happy to keep holding. I may not see the quick exit i had hoped was possible, but i believe this is very low risk though at this price, with the underlying assets and rapidly improving balance sheet.

[timanglin] 02/12/2010 09:15

I normally buy dividend producing shares, in the sense that I think that the discipline of a company paying a dividend makes the management at least think about the shareholders. However the cash generation of CLA, pick up in the airline industry, meant that I took a very small position. My anxiety is that i will only ever be a minority shareholder, and I dont really understand depreciation of airplanes, if you compare an airplane to a piece of industrial property, then recently the industrial property is appreciating in value. At some stage the market will appreciate the value in CLA, the question is how long?

[davydoo] 01/12/2010 20:46

timanglin do you hold either CLA or AVAP?

[gosgos] 01/12/2010 09:49

Hi DD
Not sure if I'll go, it depends on other commitments. The question I would ask is what benefit does Jeff see to the CLA listing now that AVAP has a main market listing.

[davydoo] 30/11/2010 20:22

Probably because very few of the shareholders in CLA would want one.

It wouldnt serve AVAP any purpose to receive a dividend from CLA considering it already controls the company.