International Consolidat... Share Discussion Threads

[qantas] 31/3/2020 08:15

Please do your own research as always.

[flyingadventure] 31/3/2020 07:58

British Airways suspends flights in and out of Gatwick.

[buywell3] 31/3/2020 04:00

Well said sir

[arteespresso] 31/3/2020 00:58

Oh did not realise British Airways flew postal flights. Perhaps you think Loganair is British Airways as well. Just because it was in British Airways colours does not mean it was British Airways.

[m1k3y1] 31/3/2020 00:20

Update
BA Cabin crew now being asked to operate repatriation flights on a voluntary basis.
They are to be supplied with Masks (non N95) and gloves but up to them if they wear them or not.

[milliecusto] 30/3/2020 23:31

Another 17k cases in America in one day, think that Dow Rally will be short lived

[loganair] 30/3/2020 23:22

It seems to me that British Airways crews on sort haul European routes find it far too tiring to fly any more then 2 sectors or often just managing to fly one single sector in a day then must get of for an overnight rest whereas I'm use to flying 4 sectors on the A320 such as Manchester-Malaga-Gatwick-Malaga-Manchester or Exeter-Bournemouth-Amsterdam-Bournemouth-Exeter or Exeter-Bournemouth-Amsterdam-Bournemouth-Paris CDG-Bournemouth-Exeter.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 23:09

tt - If the CAA gives dispensation to the airline to fly these flights then they are perfectly and 100% legal. Strictly speaking to fly outside of CAA rules with dispensation the crew are supposed to be asked, however the crews almost always say yes as they are scared for being fired by the airline they work for.

Personally I always say yes and these types of flights are usually the most interesting and unusual to fly.

Many pilots like to just fly the same old routes as they get use to them and therefore are easy and simple for them to fly, on the other hand personally I prefer to fly to as many different destinations as I can as I find flying on the same route day in and day out very quickly becomes very boring.

[take_that] 30/3/2020 22:56

M1k3y1 would you care to substantiate your claim with your area of operation within BA? I don't mean your actual position but are you a past/current crew member or are you ground based. I get the impression that you aren't sold on the concept of this recovery flights. If you are crew, then I presume you would know whether these flights are legal or not under FTLs. I can't imagine that BA would knowingly circumvent rules, as they are certainly very public at this time and a little bad press would not help their profile one bit and cost more far more than any savings being made.From what I know, WW cabin crew are the more senior (age and experience, together with being more Union centric) crews. Why would Unite allow this to happen, even if it were as you say legal?

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:54

jail - this is not a freebe for the passengers, they still have to buy a ticket for the flight back from Lima, Peru.

The crews who are doing these repatriation flights are doing so because they remain on full pay and full flight pay instead of being furloughed on reduced pay.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:50

m1 - why do you keep posting about 'agreement' has nothing really to do with CAA laws.

What one UK airline has in its contract for its crews is different from another UK airline, this has absolutely nothing to do with the CAA flight time limitations.

Normally a 2 pilot aircraft pilots can be on duty for 12 hours, with their consent this can be increased to 14 hours and in an emergency may be increased to 16 hours.

If 12 to 14 hours the Captain must write a flight report to the airline as to why. If between 14 hours and 1 minute and 16 hours the Captain must write a report to the CAA and the airline must tell the CAA why the pilots were on duty for this time.

[m1k3y1] 30/3/2020 22:47

jailbird......good on them and the crews who are doing it.

[jailbird] 30/3/2020 22:46

You might have seen something in the news about tourists stuck in Lima Peru? BA sent 4 777s out empty - two came back this morning, and the other two will be on their way back soon, arriving tomorrow morning. About 1200 passengers in all.BA is repatriating passengers

[m1k3y1] 30/3/2020 22:43

logan......They don't call it the British Airways Flying Club for nothing !!!!

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:42

As a pilot who has flown for British Airways and other UK airlines and other European airlines I am fully conversed with the flight restrictions of the various different european countries.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:38

One thing I've noticed about 'birdseed - Nigel - British Airways by shoes are so shinny I can see my face in them' they seem to operate to a law unto themselves and that they seem to think how British Airways operates is how all other UK airlines operate.

I remember being in Luton at 01.00 in the morning to see a British Airways aircraft land on the night postal flight from Edinburgh. The rest of us could not believe it when the Captain walked down the steps with a female cabin crew holding an umbrella over his head because of a little light drizzle - can't the Captain hold his own umbrella? British Airways is the only airline I've seen flying the nightly post around the UK that carried one member of cabin crew as apparently British Airways pilots are totally and completely incapable of getting their own drinks and food while onboard.

[m1k3y1] 30/3/2020 22:33

NPP ......I am not sure 'local office' is the correct term LOL but the passenger / operating flights the LH cabin crew are doing, are outside of their agreements.

In addition, they have been told that PHE requirements cannot be complied with.

I am not going to get into FTL restrictions on this BB.

Logan, if you choose not to believe me .....that's ok.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:29

BA crew can only be operating flights outside of CAA rules with CAA authorisation, if they did not the Captain would lose his pilots license and the airline would be heavily fined.

Just for interest, most Commonwealth countries operate to UK CAA rules including New Zealand, Australia and Canada.

[npp62] 30/3/2020 22:21

The CAA is a kind of 'local office' for EASA... I'd be surprised if BA crew are operating flights outside of their FTL without CAA approval.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 22:20

Each country within Europe has its own number of flight hours and crew rest and number of days off.

As for Italy, it is the only country that I know that under its aviation rules counts the INS as a 3rd pilot for heavy crew and therefore 2 pilots and the INS may be on duty for a staggering 24 hours.

Also in Italy, off duty police officers may carry their firearms on board a domestic Italian flight.

I know as I have flown in Belgium for a Belgium airline flying Belgium registered aircraft and in Italy for an Italian airline flying Italian registered aircraft and in the UK for UK airlines flying UK registered aircraft.

In the UK number of hours that can be flown at night are different for normal commercial passenger operations and cargo airlines that fly cargo and the post around the UK at night. I flew for an airline that only flew between 06.00 and 21.00 while we had one aircraft flying the nightly post around the UK. The CAA gave our airline special dispensation to fly this aircraft on night cargo hours as long as the pilots flew a minimum of 3 days in a row which the airline gave the pilots a special night allowance for.

[m1k3y1] 30/3/2020 22:04

Logan.....each airline has it's own agreements BUT they also have to comply with EASA rules. Within eurpoe.BA has it's own cabin crew / pilot agreements BUT they also have to comply with EASA. Pilots as well.

[loganair] 30/3/2020 21:54

For a UK registered aircraft, this dispensation can ONLY be issued by the UK CAA and no body else as it is only the CAA who has authority to issue such dispensations.

No union can issue such a dispensation as the pilot/crews are operating outside of CAA rules.

This also has nothing to do with EASA as each European country has different rules to other European countries when it comes to number of hours or sectors that a crew may fly. I know this as well as flying for UK airlines, I have operated for airlines in other European countries and each European country I flew for airlines in had completely different rules.

For example in Belgium once reach 14 hours on duty must get the number of hours on duty off plus 50%. If on duty for exactly 14 hours, must get 21 hours off.

In Italy the minimum number of days off for crew is just 4 in any 30 days and one can fly up to 130 hours in any 30 day rolling period which flying on domestic Italian routes is extremely tiring, I can tell you. Also in Italy a heavy crew, the INS can be counted as the 3rd pilot.

[m1k3y1] 30/3/2020 21:36

logan.....maybe but not with BA. Dispensation usually comes from the crew Union and has to comply with agreements.

Of course there are exceptional circumstances.
However, currently they have to comply with EASA as UK GOV has not yet left EASA.

In any event, the crews are being asked to operate outside of agreements in order for the repatriation flights to operate, as the crews cannot slip in the countries they are being asked to fly to.

Well done to all the crews from all airlines who are operating the flights.

Let's not forget , they have no PPE either.