Ceres Power Share Discussion Threads

[bmel] 24/1/2024 10:43

It is possible that Bosch have had second thoughts.

They have just announced that they are to start manufacturing hydrogen combustion engines for trucks and commercial vehicles.

[colsmith] 24/1/2024 10:32

If the CERES FC is superior to others for transport/Busses then commercial considerations will mean Weichel will sign a deal. 3 way deal is less clear.

[xxnjr] 24/1/2024 09:21

Although of different scale, isn't this 'tit for tat' in response to UK.gov ejecting the Chinese from a UK nuclear power plant construction project? Plus the "anti-china" position that UK seems to have adopted.

[book5] 24/1/2024 09:17

Yellow
China consumes high amounts of Taiwan semiconductors regardless of the political differences
Cwr products are required in China ASAP, and a deal to supply China will be done with or without Weichai.

[edgar40] 24/1/2024 09:16

I recall it was at an article in The Times which wrongly stated it was regulatory approval that was holding things up.

[mcmather] 24/1/2024 09:15

FWIW - Berenberg cuts Ceres Power price target to 800 (925) pence - 'buy'

[nivison] 24/1/2024 09:12

I’ve checked my recollection powers and they have indeed failed me. It was the structure of the deal that was agreed, subject to some commercial points. Regulatory approval would then be sought. So it’s the commercial aspects that remain unresolved not the political ones. My mistake.

[yellowf123] 24/1/2024 09:12

Seems clear the Weichai deal has been replaced by the Taiwan deal.
That will anger the CCP, I can't see much happening in China from here on.
They would have only copied the technology anyway.
Its best for Ceres to focus on USA market and India imo.

[book5] 24/1/2024 08:58

nvision

I disagree, the regulators want a deal asap

IMHO This is Bosh defending its interests.
Weichai may not be a suitable candidate to go to China unless it adquieres new capabilities. Preassure is in Weichai.

Regards

[edgar40] 24/1/2024 08:54

Not so sure. Regulatory approval would follow the signing of the deal.
The problem, I suspect, is that when the JV agreement was announced, only the Bosch SOFC was in existence and they, understandably, wanted to muscle in on the Chinese market. Then the Weichai stack appeared to huge fanfare in Feb 2023. It has always intrigued me as to how there could be a JV involving 2 companies with competing systems.
As noted, Weichai will be very keen to get on with things otherwise they will lose commercial/ strategic advantage with their system already 1 year old and mothballed whilst JV agreement under discussion. Either, this will serve as a wake-up call to Bosch, and they will get something signed so they have at least some play in Chinese SOFC market: alternatively, new Ceres / Weichai deal will be agreed pronto.
Disappointing news, nonetheless ….

[nivison] 24/1/2024 08:43

I seem to recall in the past being told that the terms of the jv had been agreed and that the delay was ‘regulatory approval’. So perhaps not a lack of desire on the part of Weichai and Bosch but an insurmountable hurdle in the form of the Chinese regulator? Whatever that is.Hence reference to the possibility of a deal but in a different form? Obviously not the done thing to go slagging off the Chinese regulator if you need them to play ball and agree a deal. Politics at play here is my take.

[ch1ck] 24/1/2024 08:36

I agree this will fall below 200 for a while as the move up was on expected deal with Bosche and ChinaI might buy in below this level

[cerrito] 24/1/2024 08:30

Despite the working relationship between Bosch and Weichai,given all the delays I have increasingly gone on the basis that the JV would not happen.
In some ways good that CWR have acknowledged this.

[seball] 24/1/2024 07:47

I was hoping for the China JV. Can see this back under 200p until further news. I will be adding if it does. Good luck,

[mcmather] 24/1/2024 07:13

Maybe Folderboy; "...it is now our belief that the proposed JV is unlikely to be completed in its current form".

[skinny] 24/1/2024 07:05

Trading update

Horsham, UK: Ceres Power Holdings plc (CWR.L), a leading developer of clean energy technology, today provides a post period end trading update ahead of the announcement of its full year results for the year ended 31 December 2023, which will be released on Wednesday 20 March 2024.

Financial

-- Revenue for the year ended 31 December 2023 is in line with previous guidance at approximately GBP21-22 million (2022: GBP22 million)

-- Gross margin for the year is expected to be around 60% (2022: 59%)
-- Cash and short-term investments were approximately GBP140 million as at 31 December 2023
Current trading and outlook

-- Signed significant new fuel cell and electrolysis license with Delta Electronics on 18 January 2024, which includes staged revenues of GBP43 million to Ceres through technology transfer and licensing, of which approximately half is expected to be recognised as revenue in 2024. Initial production by Delta is expected to start by the end of 2026.

-- Our electrolysis programme is progressing well. The 1MW-scale electrolyser successfully completed testing in Germany and is now en-route to partner Shell's site in India. The Ceres team is now developing the next product concept for a 4-5MW modularised system, which would facilitate larger scale installations.

-- Construction of the Bosch and Doosan factories continues to progress, however the launch of commercial fuel cell systems is now expected to take longer, with initial royalties anticipated from 2025 onwards.

-- We were not able to conclude the planned China JV in 2023. Whilst we continue to maintain strong relationships with both Bosch and Weichai it is now our belief that the proposed JV is unlikely to be completed in its current form. However, we are evaluating other options with Weichai to address the China market. We will update the market on our progress at the appropriate time.

-- With the new license deal with Delta, we have confidence at this early stage of the year to at least double revenues in 2024, compared to 2023, based on existing contracts.

Phil Caldwell, Chief Executive Officer of Ceres commented, "It is great to kick off the new year with a significant new license deal with Delta, our first to include SOEC, and further validation of our strategy to invest in our green hydrogen technology. We start 2024 with a strong cash position and a growing pipeline of opportunities to work with progressive partners to adopt our technology to decarbonise our global energy systems."

Ends

[folderboy] 24/1/2024 07:04

Pleased I added and will continue to hold but I think this trading update will disappoint - back below £2?
OR - maybe I was just hoping for more and this is fine. As ever - just have to wait and see.

[piperpeter] 23/1/2024 15:19

Those interested in green hydrogen may perhaps wish to cast an eye over what Molecular Energies (MEN) has in its locker; specifically Green House Capital Group Plc, in which it has a 75% holding. It also has 20.5% of Atome Energy Plc, a green hydrogen/green ammonia company with a major green Calcium Ammonium Nitrate project ongoing.

Green House Capital Group Plc has 100% interest in several hydrogen related companies and will spin out from MEN with IPO this quarter.

MEN market cap GBP 7 million.



Pp.

[book5] 23/1/2024 15:18

IMHO, CWR was treated as a hydrogen share.
But we are not entirely a hydrogen company. Asians want us to extract energy from gas at a higher efficiency and lower capex than standard gas+ turbine power stations
Wait for China to come to us

[chessman2] 23/1/2024 15:16

FWIW this is much undervalued IMO.

Having said that I must confess to be underwater at present!!

[brucie5] 23/1/2024 15:03

Added at 2.48. bit of a coin toss as to whether the TU will be net positive for the chart; but since we're still trying to catch up with the DELTA news, this should really be in bullish technical territory - ie. at around £3. IMO, obviously, so NAI. The picture has certainly changed pretty radically over the last week. Hopefully CWR will be able to make that crystal clear again tomorrow.

[nov31] 23/1/2024 14:34

I think 340p is possible

[book5] 23/1/2024 13:28

It makes sense to visit China on the way back from Taiwan
CWR could reach 300p this month