Bay Capital Share Discussion Threads

[gramsci] 02/7/2010 10:46

Overly simplistic, Selborne; you can't just look at rank & file wage cost; as a shareholder of many companies, I also resent the wage demands of most CEO's, bankers and lawyers; reality check - it is a cost of doing business, mate, any business. Oh, and public companies exist for other reasons beyond just the shareholder. But you know that, surely.

BA is between a rock & a hard place, of course. Yes, their cost base is too high if low cost is their sole criteria. And their internal bickering is too much if they want to keeping trading on the reputation as a class-act with the Best of Britian cache.

As a long time business class traveller I used to take pride in travelling BA. Today, however, I do not. BA seem to only want rockstar type passengers in first class - who more and more have their own planes or use lease-shares to bypass the whole commercial terminal nonsense - or trailer park trash in economy, who will always fly the cheapest carrier. BA cannot be the absolutely cheapest (do they want to be? No.).

Yep, BA is in that difficult niche every business student knows to avoid - the middle.

[selborne_edge] 02/7/2010 10:28

The purpose of a listed company is to make money for its shareholders, not to provide air waiters and air waitresses with a standard of living to which they think they are entitled. BA just has to match their costs with those of its competitors.

Its all very simple really and it is a great pity that members of the cabin crew are unable to understand such a basic concept.

[gramsci] 02/7/2010 10:00

One could say that all workers in the UK are overpaid; if pay were the only issue why not just employ 3rd world crew only, like the shipping industry, where >80% of the crew are Filipinos. Is that the airline you want?

[anony mous] 02/7/2010 09:49

Willie Walsh is doing a great job.

5 years ago ???

the airline sector/economy was very different.
shauney, have you not noticed the recession and companies making cutbacks ?

BA needs/needed to change, and these stupid overpaid staff have to go ! or adapt, just like in many other companies.

[shauney2] 02/7/2010 09:36

Oh dear what's happened to this thread!

I agree with exbacrew re Willie Walsh.
When he took command more than 5 years ago BA had the best routes, the best trained cabin crew,the best flight crew,the best cargo facility and a whole new state of the art terminal to look forward to.
How could he fail with those backing up a proud brand known around the world?
The share price was around 250p with a good chance of the dividend being
reinstated.
The share price is now around 30% lower with no divi and a workforce who have lost all trust and respect for management and an airline whose brand is now better known for its strikes than what it really does.

The fact that they have now offererd the cabin crew a pay rise tells me that the strikes are now severely hurting the bottom line and Willie wants to end the dispute but is too proud to reinstate staff travel to the same level as before the strikes.
We will know in the quartly results at the end of this month.

[anony mous] 01/7/2010 22:26

British Airways: Trustees Sign GBP1.3B Pensioner Liability Deal
1 July 2010

LONDON (Dow Jones)--British Airways PLC (BAY.LN), an airline company, announced Thursday that the trustees of its Airways Pension Scheme or APS, have entered into an insurance transaction with Rothesay Life, covering 20% of pensioner liabilities worth GBP1.3 billion.

MAIN FACTS:

-The APS scheme has committed to pay Rothesay Life pre-determined cashflows.

-In exchange, Rothesay Life will make payments to APS matching 20% of the actual pension payments as they arise.

-The insurance transaction provides protection for longevity risk and provides a direct match for the pension cashflows in all inflation and interest rate scenarios.

-The transaction does not change contributions from British Airways and is consistent with the long-term aims of the scheme to reduce the reliance on the employer over time.

[selborne_edge] 01/7/2010 18:28

BA just has to get rid of the employees who are not working in the interests of the Company. Compared with its days as a nationalised company, there is no alternative except to compete with the likes of Ryanair. It is going to be a hard road for BA employees but there is no going back now.

[anony mous] 01/7/2010 17:33

agree, chancer.

unfortunately BA is still infested with people like exbacrew.

[chancer] 01/7/2010 17:29

exbacrew - With language like that, no wonder BA got rid of you. You therefore are showing your "TRUE" colours as a "MILITANT"

I take it you are on the Dole and unemployable so have to do your best to discredit BA.

Life is full of frustrated "Losers" like you Mr EXBACREW

The more like you that come out of the woodwork, the easier it is.

[chancer] 01/7/2010 16:46

exbacrew - You seem to get some comfort out of the share price falling. I take it you have a grudge against BA as an ex employee.

You appear to be an activist. Lets hope your pension is also falling.

[exbacrew] 01/7/2010 16:07

LOL - I think it absolute value now, once the strike is settled it will rise Im sure of that

[anony mous] 01/7/2010 15:50

maybe we need some bad news to get it up again
LOL !

[anony mous] 30/6/2010 16:03

mkts down across all sectors.

[alphorn] 29/6/2010 15:05

US consumer confidence numbers for June awful; this will neither support the markets in general nor bode well for trans Atlantic travel.

[selborne_edge] 29/6/2010 11:56

BA needs cabin crews who want the airline to succeed in a very competitive business and give the impression that they are 'serving' passengers. To be worried about 'perks' when BA is being so dangerously weakened is one reason why you just don't want these cabin crews back.

UNITE is of course very happy; their only objective is to bring BA to its knees and unemployment for many.

[alphorn] 29/6/2010 08:56

A Union striking on these issues needs to fail. They are doing nothing for their members and are living in a different century. They are fighting for a closed shop:

"the use of volunteer crews not working under collectively agreed conditions; the failure to restore staff travel benefits withdrawn from striking workers; and "vindictive" disciplinary actions arising from the strikes".

[bartram] 29/6/2010 07:53

Today's FT:

BA warns cabin crew as ballot nears
By Pilita Clark

Published: June 28 2010 22:47 | Last updated: June 28 2010 22:47

British Airways has warned its cabin crew they face the risk of fresh legal action or even dismissal if they go ahead with a strike vote that could see another round of walkouts at the loss-making airline this summer.

In a further sign of pressure, BA revealed on Monday that 4,500 people have formally registered interest in being hired as Heathrow cabin crew since it started a recruitment drive last week for 1,250 new staff on sharply reduced salaries at its main airport base.

The moves come as the airline and the Unite union that represents most of its 13,400 flight attendants square up for a new bout in what has become one of the worst industrial relations battles seen at square up for a new bout in what has become one of the worst industrial relations battles seen at Europe's third biggest airline by revenues.

Unite has already staged two waves of stoppages over 22 days since March, in a row that originally centred on the airline's move to cut cabin crew numbers on most of its long-haul flights.

More recently, the union said it would launch another strike ballot on Tuesday on three other issues: the use of volunteer crews not working under collectively agreed conditions; the failure to restore staff travel benefits withdrawn from striking workers; and "vindictive" disciplinary actions arising from the strikes.

Unite said on Sunday it would postpone this ballot to allow its members to vote on a new offer BA made on Friday, in which the airline slightly improved a previous proposal to guarantee existing staff allowances would not be reduced once the lower- paid recruits started work later this year.

The union said, however, it would not recommend its members approve the revised offer because it failed to address issues such as staff travel. Its leaders strongly suggested the postponed ballot would eventually go ahead.

But a letter seen by the Financial Times reveals that the airline's director of people, Tony McCarthy, who has been heavily involved in the dispute negotiations, wrote to Unite's joint leaders, Tony Woodley and Derek Simpson, on Friday to warn that this ballot could place BA employees in jeopardy.

"Whilst we are carefully examining the reasons for your new ballot, we would like to point out that we believe they are not new items and, therefore, you are potentially putting your members at risk," said Mr McCarthy.

"I would strongly urge you to reconsider the content of this revised offer carefully before you initiate your ballot."

Under UK industrial law, workers can lose their statutory protection against dismissal if a court deems that they are striking over what are effectively the same issues.

Asked if this was what the airline intended, a BA spokesman said only: "We are considering the position."

Marc Meryon, a partner at Bircham Dyson Bell, a law firm that specialises in industrial relations, said the threat of dismissal was clearly one interpretation of Mr McCarthy's letter.

"This may be a suggestion that any future industrial action should be treated as a continuation of the previous action and so placing members at risk of dismissal if they continue to take strike action, or that a re-ballot of members on the current dispute may be vulnerable to challenge," he said.

Unite has not said when it will hold its new ballot. But last week's news that BA has started hiring new crew, a move it says will save £100m in 10 years, has heartened investors in the City of London.

A spokesman for the airline said on Monday that 16,000 people had clicked on the careers section of its website since it started advertising for the new recruits last week and 4,500 people had officially registered interest in making an application to be hired.

[chancer] 27/6/2010 14:48

exbacrew -

Recruits will be paid £18,000 to £25,000 a year instead of the current £25,000 to £35,000.

BA's website has seen more than 25,000 hits from people showing an interest after a national newspaper advert


Read more:

Strange, but Unite have stated they will not ballot next week.

I wonder what changed their minds. The Unions do not want to lose face but I am sure the demise of the "Unions" will be a gradual decline over the years !

[dancing piranha] 25/6/2010 18:35

Even our new PM chooses to use our new national carrier to travel to the G20 summit in Canada!

Well done Ricky.... long live "British Virgin Airways"!

Shame on you BA!