Bay Capital Share Discussion Threads

[alphorn] 20/6/2010 22:32

using volunteer air stewards

Closed shops was the Union stance about 50 years ago.

[anony mous] 20/6/2010 22:11

unite know that.

[anony mous] 20/6/2010 22:11

so, its not all about travel perks only, like unite been saying.

heres what unite say in Guardian today....

In a recent letter to cabin crew, Tony Woodley and Derek Simpson, the joint general secretaries of Unite, outlined three areas of dispute: using volunteer air stewards, depriving strikers who joined walkouts in March of their concessionary travel, and "vindictive" disciplinary action taken against at least 70 flight attendants since the dispute began.

However, sources state that BA is planning to take strenuous measures for any fresh round of strikes. Willie Walsh, BA chief executive, said last week that he expected to operate 100% of BA's long-haul schedule during any next wave of strike action and effectively lock out Unite and its two cabin crew branches: Bassa and Cabin Crew 89.

[anony mous] 19/6/2010 22:21

British Airways dispute 'not about perks'

British Airways chief executive Willie Walsh has insisted the ongoing industrial dispute with the Unite trade union is not about the return of travel perks to striking workers.

Unite has staged 22 days of strike action to date in 2010, with British Airways withdrawing discounted travel from cabin crew as a result.

In recent discussions Unite has cited the reinstatement of the previous arrangements as crucial to the success of any deal between the two sides.

However, speaking at the Business Travel Market, Mr Walsh stated, if Unite accepted the latest deal on the table, travel perks would be reinstated.

"There is a big gulf between the views of the cabin crew and those of the Unite union," explained Mr Walsh, citing the number of crew crossing picket lines during strikes as evidence.

"If Unite offered an open ballot to members it would be accepted," he added.

With Unite outlining plans for further industrial action, Mr Walsh also stated British Airways hoped to offer all long-haul departures and a significant number of short-haul routes during any further strikes.

[alphorn] 18/6/2010 16:31

What old info???

[horus22222] 18/6/2010 11:48

Shorting on and then posting old info to back it is a touch emotional or is that desperation.

[anony mous] 18/6/2010 11:46

Not at all.
anyway, i reckon we're all now doomed.
BT gonna strike, which means no internet, which means no bookings for BA.
doomed, we all are.
10p a share !

LOL !

[alphorn] 18/6/2010 11:38

Emotional post AM and emotions are best kept out of investment decisions.
(Unemotionally short BAY) ;-)

[anony mous] 18/6/2010 09:13

can't believe how some keep posting this Katla volcano story again and again.
Must be desperate to get this down for their loss making shorts.
Katla..... ticking time bomb .... so what ! everything in life is ticking time bomb. LOL !

[alphorn] 18/6/2010 08:58

Katla is still ticking away apparently:
(11/06/10) After quite awhile of little to no seismic activity around Katla, we are seeing some changes today. We've got 5 earthquakes in the last 12 hours, 2 of them are from the last 4 hours. We also have a brand new quake that has just shown up, right in between that small stretch of land between Katla and Eyjafjallajokull. Eyja has also had a few quakes, but not near as much action as Katla.


edit 05/07/10: 9 quakes in past 48 hours; has been quiet for a while.
edit 20/07/10: 14 in past 24 hours and stronger??

[maximillian1] 18/6/2010 07:57

Big up day today for good ol Bay...set to fly...

[anony mous] 17/6/2010 22:04

Selbourne
thats whats happening now.

[selborne_edge] 17/6/2010 22:02

The best thing for BA to do is to let members of the cabin crew to whither away. Their bahavour suggests that the interests of the company are not important and to have such a disaffected bunch of employees is something BA can do without.

[horus22222] 17/6/2010 14:58

"BA have theoretically already won this battle because Unite have accepted the new Cabin Crew pay and conditions."

A number of people have made the point unite have agreed to everything apart from travel. If that is the case why did members of BASSA say they did not agree with what Mr Woodley had accepted?
Secondly Mr Woodley said "give us back the travel and we will suspend the strike and talk about the other issues."

If they had agreed everything else what other issues did they have to talk about.

"If BA relented, which would make sense since financially the perks cost them very little"

If they have an agreement on everything apart from travel then BA don't need to do anything, Unite can not call a strike vote on that issue as it is non contractual.

Unite have also said the disciplinary issue has to be resolved, which is another area they could have a problem calling a strike over.

[rankor] 17/6/2010 13:00

BA have theoretically already won this battle because Unite have accepted the new Cabin Crew pay and conditions. The only issue outstanding is the reinstatement of travel perks to strikers. If BA relented, which would make sense since financially the perks cost them very little, then they would have got what they wanted - a stronger, more competative airline.

[chancer] 17/6/2010 11:02

The union members ( not just unite but unison ) are in fear of their jobs and as a last resort are preparing to try and make a last stand or in other words make a name for themselves as someone or something that cannot be bullied.

What they fail to see is they themselves are the bullies and by casting fear into their members expect solidarity.

Unfortunatly, as BASSA have found out, unite and unision will be the losers.
Without members and of course revenues their own demise will eventually become apparent.

Unions are for people who do not have a mind of their own and of course an ideal cover for insurgents to hide behind

[selborne_edge] 17/6/2010 10:48

UNITE and the cabin crews donot appear to understand that BA cannot 'give-in'. The future of BA depends on cutting costs and this process has only just started. The forthcoming cuts are going to be very painful for all its employees.

[anony mous] 17/6/2010 10:45

knocking on 2.15.


from the Guardian (yesterday)... good read...


The British Airways industrial dispute comes to a temporary end today with no sign of the permanent closure craved by the airline's 38,000 employees. A senior longhaul pilot at the airline, writing for the Guardian, probably speaks for many when he says he feels sorry for the staff swept up in the volatile conflict, rather than BA's executives or the leadership of the Unite union.

"There is no trust among the crew," says the pilot. "Everyone could be about to pass on your thoughts and deeds to either sides' perceived bullies. Everyone feels they have much to lose and can trust no one; even colleagues from other departments."

Unite and its two cabin crew branches, Bassa and Cabin Crew 89, are preparing for new ballots that could herald strikes at the peak of the holiday season, but shop stewards acknowledge that the action is taking a heavy toll.

Bassa's main office in Heathrow's terminal five is shut and Bassa representatives claim they are no longer being granted abstentions from shifts to carry out union duties. So, in a sense, BA has brought to fruition its claim that Bassa is dysfunctional by curtailing the branch's activities.

BA still needs to strike a peace deal with Unite and there is one on the table, but it is typical of the broad-stroke agreements hammered out between union general secretaries – Tony Woodley in Unite's case – and chief executives, represented by BA's Willie Walsh.

In a blow to Unite and Bassa, it barely repeals the staffing cuts that started the industrial dispute last year. It also outlines the creation of a new fleet staffed by newly-recruited, lower-paid cabin crew in a different working structure – seen by analysts as the real prize for BA.

While Bassa has haggled over some of the details – disciplinaries, removal of travel perks and a new allowances system – there appears to be minimal distance between both sides. The only stumbling block is BA's refusal to reinstate, in full, discounted air travel for flight attendants who lost those perks when they joined a wave of strikes in March.

Walsh is refusing to restore the strikers' seniority rankings, which give a crew member with 30 years' experience priority over someone with 10 years' service and so on. Under his offer, travel perks will be restored but strikers will be downgraded to the seniority equivalent of kindergarten.

To Unite this is an unacceptable punishment for striking and must be dropped for a deal to go through. To BA, already sitting on what looks like a good deal, it would be wrong to absolve employees who have damaged the company. And so the grim standoff enters the second half of the year.

In the meantime, BA builds up contingency plans that have seen it fly around eight out of 10 passengers most days during the strikes. Walsh has already expressed an intention to fly 100% of booked passengers in the next wave of strikes, increasing the pressure on Unite to prove that as Britain's largest trade union it can deliver a good result from a confrontation with one of the UK's most prestigious companies.

Gregor Gall, professor of industrial relations at the University of Hertfordshire, says Unite's failure to secure a deal so far could feature in the contest to replace the outgoing joint general secretaries of Unite – Woodley and Derek Simpson.

"Whoever wins the general secretary election is going to head a union that has not come out with flying colours. People will ask why the biggest union in Britain has not wrapped this up with a better outcome than exists so far." With another ballot looming, Unite will have another chance to prove the doubters wrong. But BA will get another opportunity to chip away at its members' resolve.

[anony mous] 16/6/2010 19:53

no, that means 2.15+

[alphorn] 16/6/2010 17:30

Negotiations have ended with no agreement this afternoon; expect sub 200p tomorrow.

[shauney2] 15/6/2010 17:50

Oh your back Anon. No need to look at the price then.
They must be up;-)

[anony mous] 15/6/2010 13:15

thanks horus for that info.
gives an approx timeline.
;-)

[horus22222] 15/6/2010 12:54

Next ballot will be on or after the 3rd August.
Unite have sent a letter to all crew stating that if they receive a ballot paper and they are not employed by BA after 3rd Aug, they must not vote.
So it looks like that is the date then.

I am sure unite will not want to risk the vote and this may be simple posturing, it does however offer time to sort out the problem.

[anony mous] 14/6/2010 23:12

14 June 2010

British Airways cabin crew dispute could be nearing a resolution as new Acas deal is tabled.