Phoenix Share Discussion Threads

[jubberjim] 26/7/2024 17:51

I'll make a note in the diary

Thanks for info

[tornado12] 26/7/2024 16:57

Just seen on website the H1 results will be declared on 16th September.. one for the diary .. GLA

[gbh2] 26/7/2024 12:13

Abysmal volume atm.

[boonkoh] 26/7/2024 12:09

Potentially good news for Phoenix. Clamp down on Insurers who buy in pensions and then reinsure overseas. Of which which I don't think phoenix does?Bank of England warns it will restrict reinsurance deals if controls are not improved - https://on.ft.com/4bYVkCy via @FT

[gbh2] 25/7/2024 12:45

Suffering from low volume drift, and sp's rarely drift upwards.

[my retirement fund] 25/7/2024 06:21

Good news for our sector this morning: BOE Reveals Design of Emergency Lending Facility for Non-Banks https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-07-24/boe-reveals-design-of-emergency-lending-facility-for-non-banks The Bank of England revealed details of a new facility designed to avoid UK bond market blow-ups like the one two years ago by lending directly to asset managers.

[my retirement fund] 25/7/2024 06:13

I think sweeping statements such as flatlining pensions relief tax is dangerous, especially based on simple political views with absolutely no peer reviewed research on the matter. I'd say the most important thing in recent years is that private pensions need to keep up with inflation, and with that in mind, increasing the tax-free lifetime cap urgently needs to increase. Sweeping statements about flat rates is a poorly understood subject given that pension contributions come from a tiered tax regimes and is complicated further by company contributions in lieu of wages which have very different outcomes depending on personal circumstances.

[1dirtysteve] 24/7/2024 21:59

Agree with all of the above. We can only hope it’s not as bad as we imagine. I’d be happy with the AA slashed and everything else left the same but I fear it will be much worse than that. Pensions are an easy target unfortunately. No wonder so many don’t bother with them.
I’ve a decent chunk in my ISA too but surely they’d never dare touch those 🤔 I’d put nothing past Labour.

[fenners66] 24/7/2024 19:59

Not that the previous lot didn't have their tax raids on the responsible.

Dividend tax allowance
Interest allowance
Smashing the CGT annual allowance.

They will say they had their reasons after giving away all the cash during the pandemic ,
but its going one way , give up working and live off benefits is the lesson....

Until no one pays tax anymore and it all collapses.

The Marxists will like that though.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 24/7/2024 19:53

How long will it take RR to roll back the LTA..? GBP1.073M, or round it up, then catch hard working diligent savers for 55% on lump sums withdrawn over it or 25% if drip fed out..

The flip side to that argument is can they afford to lose all the people that will retire early 50-60 to avoid going over it, particularly senior health car professionals, police chiefs, but it will sweep up a lot wider audience than that..

Some big questions coming up to be answered in the autumn statement, LTA, pensions contributions tax relief, income tax, child benefits just for starters, and IF that cap is removed how the hell is it funded, they will be looking for tax raids, if she waits that long..?

An ISA tax raid is also possible with a taxable threshold over the limit..?

[fenners66] 24/7/2024 19:18

1DS - so a reinstatement of the lifetime pensions cap could already see you with an extra future tax liability.
Next up a removal of the IHT protection perhaps...

How dare we have the temerity to be responsible , work hard , pay taxes and provide for our families future ?!
Instead we should be spending everything as soon as we get it. Fueling the economy and inflation , so as to allow the govt the excuse to raise wages and benefits and therefore tax us more.

Leaving ourselves to rightfully claim our share of free social care in our later lives , I guess we deserve to be punished with higher and higher taxes until we learn ...

[mcunliffe1] 24/7/2024 16:11

A bit of advice, slightly tongue in cheek, but nonetheless, fully valid. When I ran this past the IFA I went see three years or so ago he was surprised but confirmed it probably would work.

My SIPP is considerably smaller than yours at £206k. I've used it as income support from the age of 60 when I'd quit the software game. I would draw-down the max permitted to avoid paying tax. That was about £18k when I had my wife's 10% marriage allowance trf. She has no pension.

It would have been nice to draw-down, say, £25k and the way to achieve that and avoid tax would be to divorce my lovely wife of (then) 43 years giving her half of my then pension pot of about £220k - so, £110k each.

We would continue to live together, she could not then of course pass her 10% marriage allowance but we could have both draw-down £12.5k each and neither of us would have paid tax.

At some point we would re-marry to then maximise IHT.

Check it out.

[1dirtysteve] 24/7/2024 15:43

Mcun, you may be right. I’ve always thought the relief system is fair though. Yes I’ve benefited from higher rates of relief but in fairness I will almost certainly be paying higher rate of tax in retirement too. Therefore for me it would make no sense putting more in at 20 or 30% relief to pay 40% on way out or worse, 55% if LTA is reintroduced.
I just worry that incompetent politicians could make a mess of this and damage pensions in a big way. I also keep chucking more in my SIPP due to the inheritance benefits which will probably now go too 😩

[mcunliffe1] 24/7/2024 15:36

1DS: In a short, succinct post you have confirmed the righteousness of levelling out the tax relief given to people. You've built up a £1.55m SIPP and all credit to you for that. You have, I suspect, been ably assisted at 45% and 40% relief gifted to you by the remaining taxpayers, many of whom pay tax at 20% on relatively low earnings.

From the point of view of PHNX, LGEN etc. flattening out the tax relief at 30% could result in a great deal more pension saving contributions overall.

[1dirtysteve] 24/7/2024 15:06

Fenner I don’t. They will. But it will be in the form of higher income tax not in the form of getting 10% of my pension contributions. They win and everyone’s pensions suffer. I might ramp up my AVC’s to 50% salary for a few months as one last effort before I stop altogether.
For context I have £1.55M in a SIPP aged 47 so will just rely on growth from now on if the relief is changed.

[gbh2] 24/7/2024 14:26

I'm just wondering if there's much risk connected by going over my usual maximum
holding percentage.
I remain unconvinced about the about of damage Liebour might do to the pension industry!

[fenners66] 24/7/2024 14:13

1DirtySteve
- as an additional rate taxpayer , if you end pension contributions should they end higher rate tax relief , how do you propose they will NOT therefore get more tax revenue from you ?

Or is the missing detail , you will stop earning enough to be a higher rate payer at the same time?

[1dirtysteve] 24/7/2024 13:46

I’m an additional rate tax payer. If they reduce tax relief on pension contributions then that’s the end to me contributing. I’m lucky I guess that I’m old enough to already have a decent wedge in my pension. I guess Labour are calculating their savings from these measures based on increased income tax now from money no longer going in to their pensions. As they won’t be getting a penny from me in direct pension contributions savings. It’s no wonder so many don’t bother with pensions when the rules and goalposts are constantly changing 🤬

[jubberjim] 24/7/2024 13:40

Those that can afford it can and should pay more tax.

We should ensure that it is not wasted.

I play about on the markets to fund the wife's holidays and if we can t afford it she stays at home and I suffer alongside her.

But the tax we pay should be spent helping those less fortunate and funding the NHS

That's it

We are all very fortunate so let the Government get on and govern and if we don t like it we vote them out next time.

[my retirement fund] 24/7/2024 04:13

Spud, I think I'll happily continue to express myself as I wish thanks. However, if you truly have nothing useful to say, you should remain silent.

[kernelthread] 24/7/2024 00:56

They could "improve returna on penaion funds" by "borrowing" (a.k.a. printing) loads of money, which would make stocks go up. Of course you'd eventually need a wheelbarrow full of cash to buy a loaf of bread, but then you can't have everything.

[fenners66] 24/7/2024 00:09

pete you might believe in that utopia of greater contributions to pension schemes by some sort of balance to the give and take of tax relief , but the underlying reason for the new chancellor to do this is to make tax savings, the savings made will by definition not be going into pension funds and will have to be achieved to pay for other spending plans.

Reducing the relief to 20% overall looks a step too far - but this is on the back of an earlier announcement about "improving" returns on pension funds...

So looks a lot like - start with the fake (?) good news , before moving on to the bad news.

Perhaps a new single rate of 25% and £billions "saved"

[pete160] 23/7/2024 23:08

I suspect the Govt will reduce the top level of tax relief from 45% and increase the lower level to 30/32%, but at the same time they will increase the minimum contributions from employers into stakeholder pension funds, and decrease the starting age and wage limits of when people qualify.In Labour's view this is levelling up - and also handily, getting someone else to pay for their seeming 'generosity' whether that be higher earners or employers.So, on balance, there will be more money saved in pensions, which will be good for pension companies such as phnx, lgen, av, etc.

[yump] 23/7/2024 22:46

Someone mentioned shipbuilding which reminded me of this: