Pci-pal Share Discussion Threads

[adamb1978] 03/11/2023 08:40

Hi Simon

I think the chances of an offer whilst the patent stuff is around is low. Certainly PE won't touch it during this period. Its almost like the company's shares are suspended.

I dont think this is a bad thing mind you. It gives PCIP time to grow even more such that when this cloud is lifted, the company is that much bigger and will be profitable (it should be profitable in the half year ending 31/12/23).

Adam

[simon gordon] 03/11/2023 07:55

If PCIP did get a low ball takeover offer, I hope shareholders would say no like they did at KINO (Kinovo).

Sycurio continue to hire at a rapid rate. Six vacancies at the moment. They are investing hard. Though strangely one of their new big hires, SVP Global Partner Programs & Ecosystem, has no prior experience in the contact centre world. As a company, many of the leadership have no contact centre experience. When PCIP hire, they take people deeply steeped in the scene. Ritch Caudill, Partners & Alliances, a recent example.

Two new vacancies at PCIP:

"Due to continued growth we are hiring 2 Project Managers to join our UK team. Delivering PCI Pal services for both direct and channel sales customers, you will be responsible for coordinating internal and external resources using a blend of project management and a technical skills. Bearing wider responsibilities than typically associated with Project Management, you will be expected to work closely with various internal teams and provide pre and post go-live support, including delivering product demonstrations and occasional training for customers."

[simon gordon] 02/11/2023 17:47

October was a dreadful month on the chart, probably the 2nd worse down candle in the history of the company.

The share looks like it will be becalmed in the 40p zone for quite a while. Even if the court cases clear in 2024 I don't think this will markedly re-rate it.

It needs to start beating expectations. Meeting expectations will not move the dial. If it misses expectations again it could go to 30p. With that in mind, I hope the CFO doesn't overcook the 2025 forecast in the coming weeks.

2024 is probably a dead zone for the share price. It could be the start of 2025 before the share price starts firing again, 14 months away.

For now, the only thing that is going to truly move the dial is a takeover offer. It's cheap as a multi-year SaaS growth play but the London market is dying on its feet and quality small caps are getting taken out left, right and centre. PCIP could join that list as UK shareholders are too diffuse and not deeply interested in creating wealth and building companies. Nearly all of the time, if the price is right they'll take the money. With the market valuing it at 40p, someone could come in and offer 75p+, most would take it. That's the market.

So, a depressing time for PCIP shareholders, until animal spirits return.


free stock charts from uk.advfn.com

[simon gordon] 02/11/2023 13:31

When reading about ECK yesterday, I came across these stats on the size of the potential market in the US and UK.

ECK RNS - 15/12/21:

Favourable industry trends

The Company's target market both in the UK and US is any sizeable enterprise or organisation that either transacts or engages with its customers at scale and at volume. This activity will usually be supported either by an in-house or outsourced contact centre provider. The greater the volume of payment transactions or customer engagement activity that the organisation has, the more attractive they are to Eckoh, and the larger the contact centre operation supporting the organisation is likely to be.

Eckoh targets organisations that utilise contact centres with more than 50 agent seats, and this represents over 2,510 in the UK and 12,050 in the US. With so little of the large target market in which the Company operates currently addressed, patented technology and with, the Directors believe, limited competition to our offering, this represents a huge opportunity for Eckoh in the coming years.

With regulation tightening and the financial impact of data breaches and fraud growing, the Directors believe that organisations are increasingly looking for ways to move beyond the requirement of merely being compliant in favour of securing themselves more comprehensively, leading to broadening information security budgets and remits. Moreover, the current crisis and the consequent reliance on more contact centre agents working remotely are only likely to accentuate these security requirements. We see the trend of remote working becoming a permanent feature, and this can only benefit Eckoh as our payments proposition enables companies to effectively further reduce or remove the risk of data breaches arising from one of the most challenging parts of their businesses.

[wjccghcc] 01/11/2023 21:38

Here's hoping.

[adamb1978] 01/11/2023 19:58

Personally I think there's minimal to no cash risk re PCIP.

Its cashflow positive now, so unless you think the legal costs are going to be in excess of their >£1m cash + £3m facility + cash which they generate from operations, and particularly being in mind that they're a working cap positive business, then there are fine in terms of cash.

Its not as if lawyers need paying up front either!!

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 18:48

W,

Thanks for that. I was thinking it was something to do with going from On Prem to the Cloud, didn't realise it was hardware related in that On Prem part, the servers?

It looks like the UK case should be clear cut and probably low cost, even with an appeal.

Think legal cash burn now comes down to the ruling from the Markman Hearing. Fingers crossed, Judge Cogburn rules it's not infringing and they can move to dismiss. Going by Justice Bacon's ruling, the odds are decent for PCIP. But, yeah, it does elevate uncertainty.

Going by the stats there is a 33% chance it goes to trial:

Carter/Ledyard - 2018:

In the U.S. approximately 4,057 patent infringement suits were filed in 2017. Roughly 90% of patent suits filed each year are abandoned or settled. Of the 300 or so remaining, two thirds never go to trial and are adjudicated on summary judgment, meaning that a Judge decides the outcome of the case before there is a trial.

The decision by the Court on the meaning of a claim term can end the litigation long before any jury trial. For example, the Court could decide on a broad definition that encompasses prior art references never considered by the Patent Examiner. Counsel for the alleged infringer then moves for summary judgment, and the Court proceeds to find the patent invalid based on its own claim construction. Alternatively, the Court could decide on a narrow claim construction which results in a claim so narrow that it no longer covers the infringing product.

[wjccghcc] 01/11/2023 18:33

Agree though that both are being affected by lengthened sales cycles.

[wjccghcc] 01/11/2023 18:33

ECK top line growth is masked by the fact they had a lot of hardware revenues in their earlier US contracts. These were accrued over the three year life. Those contracts are now renewing for just the software part so lower revenues but higher margins. Hence flat revenues but operating profit + 17% in H1. I hold both but more ECK as still have concerns re the PCIP cash situation if the court cases drag on.

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 16:42

ECK are struggling to get top line growth:

2021 - £30.5m
2022 - £31.8m
2023 - £38.8m
2024 - £39.6m
2025 - £43.2m

2024 and 2025 are forecasts.

The jump from £31.8m in 2022 to £38.8m in 2023 can be accounted for by the purchase of Syntec who did £6.8m in the year to June 2021 before purchase in December 2021.

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 15:02

This notice from Gov.UK states that contract notice will be 2nd January 2024. Total contract value £13.3m:

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 13:09

Victor Value over on LSE has posted an update from the DWP on the contract tender which was originally expected to be awarded 10 Oct.

There is now a new tender for a three year contract to start August 2024 valued at £6.1m, with the potential to extend for 36 months thereafter.

Here's the notice:



The main requirements:

Under the new SCPS Contract the DWP has identified the following requirements, which may be subject to change before the issue of the Contract Notice:

• The ability to take customer payments using a Dual Tone Masking Frequency (DTMF) facility.

• The provision of up to 9000 SIP Licences, with an option to increase by 2000 SIP Licences. (Further detail on this potential increase will be provided in the procurement documents).

• The ability to take Inbound and make Outbound (Average 170 million minutes per annum) calls for any Business Group including any systems that take card payments across the whole network.

• The availability of a customer self-service Interactive Voice Recognition (IVR) solution.

• A potential requirement to provide a ‘Nailed ‘Up PSTN service for up to 6 months.

The new SCPS Contract is required to ensure continuing capability for DWP to receive customer payments in a PCI DSS compliant manner and provide all Outbound Telephone calls for the department.

[zipstuck] 01/11/2023 10:38

ECK valuation of trailing sales basis 3 x Sales.

PCIP is 2 x

[loglorry1] 01/11/2023 08:58

What we really need is some legislation to make call centres insist on hiding CC details. Only yesterday I paid an excess on an insurance company over the phone. The operator stopped the recording but she still took the CC details and typed them in. What's to stop here stealing the details and selling them on?

[adamb1978] 01/11/2023 08:52

THanks for that link Simon. Yes, sales cycle lengthening is something which I've seen in other areas too but that's been going on since summer 2022. The pleasing thing re PCIP is that it hasnt disupted them materially yet, presumably due to the savings which their cloud offering can bring to customers vs existing on-prem products

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 08:36

Morning Adam,

SPE taken out for a 100% premium yesterday. Small cap software stocks are getting snapped up. Wouldn't be surprised if it happens here.

There was a report out on the SaaS market the other day mentioning the lengthening of the sales cycle. They called it the year of the price hike, be interesting to see if PCIP can move prices up in 2024.

Vendr SaaS report for Q3 2023:

[adamb1978] 01/11/2023 08:14

Thanks Simon. Similar % trimming to the % which analysts trimmed off PCIP too

[simon gordon] 01/11/2023 08:06

ECK out with a trading update this morning and here's the broker view....

Singer - 1/11/23

Eckoh has provided a H1 trading update with a record performance in Total Contract Value won (+40% yoy) and a record new business pipeline in North America with multiple contracts where Eckoh is the selected vendor, but due to a lengthening in sales cycles, these sizable contracts are now expected to land in H2. North American growth is key to the Eckoh investment case and H1’24 ARR increased 22% yoy to $16.8m. Eckoh’s new products (e.g. Secure Call Recording) have been well received and are expected to go live with several clients in H2.

We have lowered our FY24 revenue forecast by 6% to £39.6m (from £42.2m) following this morning’s trading update. Given the outperformance in margins, we leave the rest of our FY24 P&L and cash flow unchanged with £4.1m H1’24 adj EBIT leaving £4.2m required in H2. This is consistent with this morning’s update as Eckoh remains on track to meet FY24 profit expectations. We also lower our FY25 revenue forecast by 4% but leave profits unchanged.

[simon gordon] 29/10/2023 11:57

Slate - 20/10/23

How Hackers Swindled Vegas

And walked away with one of the biggest ransom payments in history.

[andre] 26/10/2023 22:02

Hi Simon.Clearly you believe this is undervalued or you would be a fan. I do also. But PR is never wasted. It is part and parcel of any business because it is marketing/advertising but often cheaper. I have no intention of selling anything. I'm in for the long haul. All I am saying is missed PR is missed opportunity for recognition.

[adamb1978] 26/10/2023 17:01

I'm sure they will put out another RNS once the appeal deadline has passed and with the result of the court case which decides on the fees.

In the meantime, PR is frankly a waste of money

[simon gordon] 26/10/2023 08:32

CX Today - 25/10/23

A Second Zoom Boom Is Coming, and It’s in CCaaS

Zoom is pouring resources into CCaaS, hoping to shake up the market

Zoom isn’t just your go-to video conferencing platform anymore; it’s quickly become a one-stop shop for all enterprise communications.

With its successful expansion into UCaaS, customer experience is now the next major focus, inspiring the launch of CCaaS, conversational intelligence, and virtual agent platforms in the space of just 18 months.

Yet, that’s just scratching the surface. A workforce engagement management (WEM) suite, employee experience hub (built in partnership with ServiceNow), and new agent assist applications are further examples of Zoom’s unwavering CX ambitions.

Now, this extravagant innovation spree is starting to deliver results – especially in CCaaS.

Hundreds of enterprises have flocked to the Zoom Contact Center already, many with 1,000+ service agents.

Attracting such business is crucial for Zoom. Indeed, the vendor recognizes the complexity of contact center transformation projects and aims to put down a marker that it’s up to the task.

It wants to show that it can support contact centers in envisioning, designing, and building new service journeys that meet – and keep pace with – customer expectations.

Moreover, it wishes to highlight how it can standardize multiple systems onto one platform, meet global compliance regulation, and deliver new actionable analytics that bolster customer, employee, and business outcomes.

In an exclusive interview with CX Today, Brandon Knight, Global Head of Zoom CX Channel & Ecosystem, appeared confident in its ability to understand and tackle all these market complexities.

Continued...

[simon gordon] 25/10/2023 17:48

Zoom - 25/10/23

Zoom Launches ISV Exchange Program

New program will allow Zoom to sell select ISV solutions directly to customers

Building on the incredible success of Zoomtopia Partner Connect, Zoom is embarking on a new mission to empower partners in reshaping how Zoom brings unparalleled solutions and endless possibilities to valued customers. Today, Zoom is launching the ISV Exchange Program, which enables Zoom to sell strategic ISV’s (Independent Software Vendor) best of breed solutions to customers. This marks a pivotal moment where Zoom can seamlessly integrate partner offerings directly into the Zoom platform, creating an all-encompassing, unified experience that addresses both technological and business requirements...

...PCI Pal: “PCI Pal’s suite of secure payment solutions seamlessly complement Zoom’s dedication to help people and businesses stay connected. As one of the first partners to join the Zoom ISV Exchange Program, PCI Pal’s secure payment solutions will be offered through Zoom Contact Center and Zoom Phone. This integrated partnership creates a frictionless payment journey for Zoom customers as they enable their customers to make payments through their communication channel of choice, enhancing the overall customer experience,” Darren Gill, Chief Revenue Officer, PCI Pal.