Nanoco Share Discussion Threads

[howl01] 29/12/2016 13:46

£700k Syd as I remember

[syd777] 29/12/2016 13:45

In the first half of 2016, Samsung bought panels for an estimated 1.2 million TVs from SDP and Sharp, which turns out panels in Kameyama, Mie Prefecture. That would represent about 6% of Samsung's global TV output in that period. Though it is uncertain whether LG Display would be able or willing to strike a deal of that size, the company is thought to be open to the idea.

[syd777] 29/12/2016 13:42

Kuss yes the upfront fee and the transfer fee of the tech to Merck.

[kuss1] 29/12/2016 13:33

mr oz.

Yes, it was based on LG's order if I recall. LG contracted for all of Dow's supply.

Though we don't know the exact terms..


syd777, do you mean the upfront license fee or the royalties?

[mr.oz] 29/12/2016 13:24

Kuss.. Was DOWs factory build based on the security of orders?

[lauders] 29/12/2016 13:19

The ssoner NANO announce some really positive news the better! What better time to do it than the start of the new year and with CES in flow. I really hope it is 3rd time lucky. Seem to recall the "expectations" at the last two fell WELL short. So this is hopefully going to be one we remember.

[syd777] 29/12/2016 13:17

Kuss I personally have not seen the what the license fee with Merck was,do you think it was higher then WH?

[kuss1] 29/12/2016 12:39

Brucie5,

The 7.8 million is from Peel Hunt's recent broker note. It was confirmed at the AGM from what I can gather. Or perhaps it wasn't denied at the AGM.

So that means Nano expect revenue to begin very soon if they are to get to 7.8 million in 7 months. If they do, yes that will mean the start of a break even revenue stream just out of Runcorn... though it won't be break even for the whole year of course.

[brucie5] 29/12/2016 12:32

But those deals are not far away in my view. Nanoco seem confident with 7.8 million in revenue to July 2017. That's just out of Runcorn. If Dow and Merck start up production in the next 9 months revenue will go through the roof in quick time...
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Kuss, would this be break even?

Just remind me where you sourced this, please. And was it a prediction, assumption or aspiration?

[kuss1] 29/12/2016 12:27

So as expected LG are just confusing the customer with their new nano TV's. A bit like their quantum displays. They are using quantum and Nano terminology but not quantum dots. But it's an irrelevance what terms they use as I'm afraid Qdots are pulling away from the phosphor competition. This will come to light when we see Samsung's new 3rd generation quantum dot TV at CES in a few days. And next year there will be a 4th and then a 5th generation Qdot version. LG will be forced to join the Qdot ship, probably within the next 12 months.

It's also the end of Oled for large TV displays even allowing for LG's new printing processes. Prices may reduce but there is just insufficient volume to make a profit. As it is LG sells every Oled TV at a loss. Also, LG are assuming this is just about price, but it's also about quality. It looks like Samsung's TV's will be superior on brightness, energy efficiency, colour and they will be equal on blacks and viewing angle. So there's just no advantage at all in buying an Oled.

The reason for the delay with Nano is nothing to do with ME in my view. It's the initial preference for cadmium that has slowed progress. LG don't want dots to succeed and Samsung had a supplier. The Chinese opted for cadmium quantum dot material, which they are now sourcing from China. But that's about to change. Which is why Merck are suddenly interested and accelerating their factory build.

Wah Hong's rush for larger cutting lines clearly reflects the demand for large premium 60 inch plus TV's from Hisense and TCL. Any fool can see there is no future for cadmium . It's a marketing disaster.

Dow haven't given up on Qdots either. They will supply both LG and Samsung in due course.

Those yield improvements at Runcorn are real enough. Probably in the order of x4/5 rather than x10. But it's their improvement in quality which is more relevant and a reduction in costs.

The Qdot industry isn't going away. Qdots will be in every TV at some point. The industry will be short of supply. Many more factories will have to be built.

And then there's Qled to come.

That's the value proposition and the reason Nano is valued where it is despite no commercialisation yet.

But those deals are not far away in my view. Nanoco seem confident with 7.8 million in revenue to July 2017. That's just out of Runcorn. If Dow and Merck start up production in the next 9 months revenue will go through the roof in quick time...

[syd777] 29/12/2016 11:47

LG had said it was going to do something different to Samsung and it will be nano tv using,Quantum dot Daehangma and not Quantum dots its own product.Like PC has said all is not lost with TCL,HiSence going CF and Samsung expanding its range by 25 million QD TVs.ME did mention Samsung and HiSence at the AGM.TCL would be a great coup as it dose very well in North America,Asia and could be a success in Europe with CF incorporated TVs.

[fil340] 29/12/2016 11:08

All that capacity but no contract. Not even with the OEM's who will showcase Wah Hong's film. ME busy spending his share money over Christmas rather than closing deals: marvelous leadership.

[kenirogas] 29/12/2016 10:35

Oz: half of that 10x came from longer hours, hence the "capacity", rather than yield.. IIRC it was chemistry changes that improved the yield over a 6-8month period? But I know where you're coming from. He's on record with the 500kg, and that's 24/5 working, so scope for further 40% capacity if if falls short, or is otherwise required (if the plant can run 24/7 without maintenance)

[marktyson] 29/12/2016 10:13

I just got an email from Samsung PR a few minutes ago. It contained 10 predictions, and below is #9 as its relevant to this industry:

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"SAMSUNG REVEALS TOP TECH PREDICTIONS FOR 2017 AND BEYOND"

9. Nanotechnology in our TV: Nanotechnology, and specifically quantum dot particles, will be the next superstar to emerge in smart material. We expect the tiny particles to cause a revolution in next-generation television technology, as the nano crystals semi-conduct to create amazing colours depending on their size. Quantum dot technology will also improve healthcare where it could be used in bio imaging to treat cancer cells.

------------------

[joepublic1] 29/12/2016 10:04

Lots of news reports pouring out pre CES now including new QD monitors from Samsung, rumours that LG will slash the price of OLED screens, and this report that LG will release a 'nano' TV - but apparently not using QDs.

hxxp://news.mk.co.kr/newsRead.php?sc=30000017&year=2016&no=901376

Clearly the battle is on and it sounds like LG are worried.

[mr.oz] 29/12/2016 09:36

Keni
I've always doubted the integrity of the 10x statement
Not least because the efficiency of any process that can be made 10x more effective overnight must've been wholly inadequate in the first place
And then you have the track record of ME

[onething] 29/12/2016 09:35

I'm not up to speed on the nature of CES, but the name would suggest it is about end product, not component technology. I would be surprised if Merck, Wah Hong, etc, had anything other than a token presence, if at all, just to get them on the floor and in the sessions. This is what Nanoco are doing there. Qdots are such a fundamental component that the likelihood of a manufacturer chancing upon the stand and finding out about them for the first time is zero. The industry is well aware of what is out there and near term and long term future tech being developed.

[tonsil] 29/12/2016 09:07

CESSurely it is more relevant to check the size and presence of Dow, Merck, Wah Hong at this show?

[kenirogas] 29/12/2016 08:40

Mr.oz: think the 10x was capacity at Runcorn ( now 500kg). Dow improvement "only " about 5x

[robotface] 29/12/2016 08:37

Not really as the shorters were here before last years CES.

[mrplay] 29/12/2016 08:24

Can we agree its mainly been the shorters that managed to drop the share price. A year ago no stand at ces, we saw 40-60. this year with comfirmed ces stand and still lower 40's. Shorters could be shorting for other reasons such as lower the price so much that take over woud be cheap.

[mr.oz] 29/12/2016 08:20

Did the 10 X yield improvement actually mean that the tech can now service 10 x as many display units?
There's a significant difference

[ih_169538] 29/12/2016 07:37

Private suites ..just like I said.

CES 2017 Exhibitor Manual: The Venetian and The Palazzo Hospitality Suites

The public doesn't come to these

hxxps://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=hxxp://www.ces.tech/CES/media/pdfs/VenPal-Hospitality-Suites-Manual.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwifts2O8pjRAhUGz2MKHerqBeoQFghFMAI&usg=AFQjCNESHTtnoqJ-Ok5lZU1roR3cor7syw&sig2=KUz9l2UqaXDQIyihv_BOyQ