Manganese Bronze Share Discussion Threads

[toffeeman] 10/6/2004 13:00

appols for the multiple post error

[toffeeman] 10/6/2004 13:00

2.5% of the company traded in a B trade today.

[merlin37] 06/5/2004 14:55

Not entirely convinced of the re-testing aspect, as it's not exactly a normal share, having a pretty hefty negative EPS. Seems more like a special situation with something cooking.

I thought the sub-100 days (and even sub 150) represented serious undervaluation, certainly compared with NAV s which at the time exceeded 200 but now is given at 121 p., implying a substantial goodwill factor at present prices. It is a pretty unique product, though I gather taxi drivers other than those of black cabs are entitled to a widdle by the rear wheels at the roadside.

That said, my suspicions there might be useful synergy with MFW leaves me with egg on my face ... though whether bus building and taxi manufacturing fit I am not sure. Perhaps the long-term demise of Leyland as bus-builders was writing on the wall, and visions of Hong Kong being as London used to be and filled with black cabs are merely a pipe dream.

[toffeeman] 06/5/2004 14:32

Re-testing of previous resistance which dates back to 1999-2000 (275p).

My view is that the fundamentals are worse now than when the price was at 70p as they have sold off the key freeholds and booked the profits.

Zingo does not seem to be making the progress it should and if they are not careful they will miss the window of opportunity and be overtaken by improved technology.

They don't make sufficient money on flogging cabs - they seem to make it on finance deals.

On the other hand there appears to be an institutional appetite for the stock so if demand exceed supply then fudamentals matter not a jot!

cheers

[merlin37] 06/5/2004 14:17

What goes on to-day?

[toffeeman] 06/5/2004 12:09

Well I just shorted MNGS - I don't see the valuation, but it has been rising strongly so a small controlled risk short only.

[merlin37] 20/4/2004 17:03

PS

I wondered fot a moment if I was dreaming, for by "headier days" I had 400 plus in mind. Checking back I see that 400 was indeed broached at the end of November 1996, going up, and in August 1998, going down.

[merlin37] 20/4/2004 16:53

Interesting .... by way of curiosity, though unsure of the usefulness !!! ... when I went into MNGS (long ago, in headier days) it was either MNGS or Ricardo. More relevant, though whether of greater usefulness, is whether there are implications for Torotrak.

[charlie] 30/3/2004 11:23

I believe that the further review of the Public Carriage Office's Conditions of Fitness is likely to result later this year in the market for London cabs being opened to a wider range of competitors. In other words Manganese will lose their near-monopoly on hackney cabs in London. It is difficult to think of a more serious setback for the company.



In the light of this I'm really puzzled as to why Lansdowne, Toscafield et al are buying so many shares.

[clogirons] 25/3/2004 13:13

Manganese Bronze are trying to do some kind of deal with the Chinese and are
also looking to get black cabs manufactered in Brazil.I would appreciate any
comments about this company. Thanks. Clogirons.

My fist effort,i hope i have got it right.

[crystalclear] 19/3/2004 20:07

Does anybody have anything useful to say about Christopher Ross who has been appointed by Antonov PLC? He was CEO of Ricardo it seems. Is he on his way down, or old and looking for an easier life, or what?

Antonov's Board has been further strengthened by the appointment of Christopher Ross as a Non Executive Director. Christopher is currently Deputy Chairman of Manganese Bronze plc and a Non-Executive Director of Carclo Plc, both UK listed automotive sector companies. Previously, he was Chief Executive of Ricardo plc. He is widely credited in the automotive industry for having transformed Ricardo into the world's No. 1 powertrain design and development business

[typo56] 18/3/2004 21:13

Looks like Rutland may have dumped all their 38.4% holding today. Watch out for the RNS.

[jim digriz] 10/2/2004 12:33

I'm not sure either what to think about MNGS at this price. Great company, but I bailed out a few weeks ago thinking the price was getting ahead of the news. I also don't think MNGS is quite the same "value" proposition it was a year or two ago. At that time it was a good value stock - value has now been realised, very profitably for anyone who bought during the long dip. From here on its a growth stock (hopefully!) - that's a different game. There are lots of growth prospects - but the share price is beginning to make some serious assumptions about growth that hasn't yet happened.

Was quite impressed with the almost 100,000 calls to Zingo in December though.

Jim diGriz

[merlin37] 10/2/2004 02:16

In light of yesterday's news regarding the joint venture in China and the fillip to the share price, I thought a quick review of sentiment prevailing at the lower prices of 130 - 150 might be interesting. In the old mixed metaphor of spolt milk having flowed under the bridge I can but only regret being of too little faith when the price took a dive below 100 ..... must have another decko at the historical price series.

I wasn't consciously aware of the fact that the 13-week moving average took a couple of dips below 100 the first occasion being between August and December 2001 , bottoming out in October at 72 p. . The second dip was both longer and deeper, of a years duration from July 2002 to July 2003, and bottomed out in Ocrober 2002 ar 57.8 p. ~ though intuitively I suspect the first was the more severe decline relative to the market at large and certainly in percentage terms relative to its own previous prices. (Data are based on weekly closing mid-prices.) The second time the pull out from the trough was slower and a long-run moving average above 100 was not established again until the July 2003 disposal (the date sticks in my memory as the relevant one without double checking it, and is fully consistent with the share price rising by something of the order of 50 per cent. comparing July with June 2003.

My original sentiments (when the dividend yield exceeded the P/E ratio) have been overtaken by events ... and such a phenomonenon does indeed appear to have been a harbinger of rough seas ahead. The then NAV of the order of 200 p. has been eroded, and is now quoted at 123 (or 121 net tangibles) and the P/E ratio and dividend yield are of taken interest .... though can there be a crumb of comfort in a lowish Tobin Q figure of 0.58 (at last week's closing price) ?

On balance I might feel optimism with the Chinese connection and I recall thinking that Hong Kong would look good filled with black cabs, and there is a largish population in that part of the world, and an economist told me that the income elasticity of demand for taxi journeys exceeds unity ...... which might bode well as Chinese income per head grows. One might have thought that the congestion charge to enter London would have had some impact; it is not unlikely that cab operators income is higher albeit offset by post 9/11 setbacks in air travel. Perhaps this is yet to filter through fully to demand for new vehicles.

I'm not certain what conclusions can be drawn, but since I quoted what an economist said to me it might be diligent to remember that economists are notorious in not reaching conclusions.

[toffeeman] 30/1/2004 14:00

Yeah - if you use an on-line broker that charges 12.50 a deal you spend £62.50 if you sell 5 separate lots of 1000 shares.

Wheras if the price drops 6p you lose £300 + 12.50!

[moneybags] 30/1/2004 12:42

And worse than that.I have another 5,000 to sell as they wouldn't take 10,000 off me so I have to wait till Monday to sell the other 5,000 and they have now gone and dropped the price.

Grrrrrrrrr

[toffeeman] 30/1/2004 10:27

The NMS is 1000 so you were trading 5x the nms size - just indicates how illiquid the stock is.

[moneybags] 30/1/2004 09:51

I had a heck of a job selling just 5,000 shares in these this morning at the market price.
All the four market makers were giving me quotes of 3p below the market selling price to take my 5,000 shares.
Got them away at market price after my broker did a lot of grumbling with them.
What does this tell you about a stock when they won't even buy 5,000 shares off you.....?

Regards , Moneybags

[moneybags] 30/1/2004 09:51

I had a heck of a job selling just 5,000 shares in these this morning at the market price.
All the four market makers were giving me quotes of 3p below the market selling price to take my 5,000 shares.
Got them away at market price after my broker did a lot of grumbling with them.
What does this tell you about a stock when they won't even buy 5,000 shares off you.....?

Regards , Moneybags

[washbrook] 08/12/2003 08:06

-37.5p big spread at 8.05am

[jim digriz] 26/11/2003 19:13

Hi Toffeeman - I take your point about Zingo being the only truly serious upside. I'm not so worried they aren't trialling beyond London though - a few million quid isn't much of an advertising budget in this day and age and its probably best concentrated. If its a success in London, it might be easier to sell in other places?

I figure that even if Zingo flops, the downside shouldn't be too bad, given the ongoing taxi business and was cheered to hear in today's AGM report that 1st quarter sales were up.

On a different topic, it sounds from today's RNS like I missed one heck of an interesting AGM... wonder if many of the other 6.5 million shares will vote at the next meeting...

Jim diGriz

[toffeeman] 25/11/2003 11:02

Hi

I am worried that the rise in price since the disposal was to let out Richer at a good profit.

The only thing which has the potential to make serious money is Zingo and I am very concerned that the window of opportunity is open but rapidly closing - the take up in London seems too slow to me and I read the placing as a need to try and use the money to boost the takeup.

By now I would have like to have seen othe cities in the UK being trialed along with tests in other non-UK capitals the New York limo industry (as opposed to the yellow cabs) seems an obvious target.

Mind you wtfdik

I called the ceiling at 130 expecting Richer to exit there and have missed out on 50% incremental return.