Land Securities Share Discussion Threads

[elmfield] 15/1/2009 16:27

watching but not moving in yet, stick to the wooden box and wait!

[borderbill] 15/1/2009 15:24

Andrew

I too checked the LAND threads yesterday (expecting posting activity) when I noted it had made a new low with the FTSE some margin above the recent lows - it was off 20% in a week. I agree with you there will be a time for commercial property again but the share price of LAND is shouting out that it is some way off. I expect this is associated with the sell of in banks this week given their exposure to property invetments (esp HBOS).

I woudl have thought you might look to get back in to actual property (not anything with leveraged development) in the second half of the year when some more developers & projects have gone bust.

[andrewbaker] 15/1/2009 12:50

The interest in this thread matches the interest in investing in commercial property right now: v v little. Maybe I'll use this as a proxy for when to get back in. 'Til then, I'll Rip Van Winkle!! snoozzzzzzzzzzzz...

[little beaker] 08/1/2009 09:22

They've tossed Trillium away

[1fox1] 19/11/2008 19:01

Not sounding great for new finance

[little beaker] 12/11/2008 07:11

Eye-poppingly long report, which looks ok in-line at first glance.

[chairman2] 04/11/2008 16:53

The correlation between European property funds and
the UK market is a subtle one - they have not shown
that close a linkage in the past.

More worrying is those funds that have invested
heavily in Eastern European markets - Losses there
could be very substantial in my view.

Where large professional investors have invested
in commercial property through collective
schemes (PIDS, UT,s closed ended and open ended funds)
their is a natural reconstruction route whereby
investrors take direct investments in some of the
underlying properties in the funds. The transactions
may be arms length but they will not be open market
distressed asset sales in my view.

From what I am hearing long term investors are starting
to look favourably on commercial property as an asset class
- possibly the first to recover from the effects of the
credit crunch. Of course that applies only to
Prime fully let strongly covented properties, the possible
exception being retail shopping centres.

The empty office market may also be a basket case for a very
long time.

[call-logger] 11/9/2008 19:04

XD is indeed 17/9

[call-logger] 11/9/2008 11:23

Think it's next week - they pay dividends quarterly now

[adda] 11/9/2008 08:49

when do they go x-divi? I thought it wasnt until march 09?

[kenny] 10/9/2008 15:43

Extract below, from today's Telegraph, commenting on yesterday's trading may explain the property sector's move up:

=======
Unusually, property shares had a good day after Lehman Brothers analyst Ross Smotrich upgraded the whole sector.

"We view interest rates as the re-rating catalyst we have been waiting for. When liquidity returns to the London interbank market, we believe that NAVs will regain credibility, and there is already dividend-yield support. Rents are falling, but real estate prices are increasingly governed by capital markets. On a 25pc discount to our trough NAV estimates, we think REITs are pricing in stagflation and strategic stake-building is starting," wrote Mr Smotrich.

Derwent London perked up 50p to £11.15, Quintain Estates & Development rose 9¾ to 216½p and Helical Bar put on 13¾ to 345p.
======

[randomwalker] 09/9/2008 15:43

bit of excitement today ;-)
xd coming up.....but this move is way more

[currypasty] 17/7/2008 10:52

small parcels of land 1-20 acres are fetching £10k/ acrea at the moment, about ouble from a few years ago

[father o toole] 17/7/2008 10:36

curry, a man once told me "they dont make land anymore"

[lady alethea] 17/7/2008 10:30

Also should add the obvious and that is the lack of liquidity!

Although as part of an overall well diversified portfolio this wouldn't or certainly shouldn't be an issue.

[lady alethea] 17/7/2008 10:16

Like most things land could well become much cheaper with all the current economic woes....apart from that no income is the only real nego CURRYPASTY although aye should add that there is land and there is land i.e. chances of obtaining planning permission etc.

Would be interested to hear more about the tax breaks and grants that you refer to in the header?

[currypasty] 17/7/2008 10:07

A couple of years ago i sold a buy to let house, and bought a field. Why, well BTL days looked numbered. Yeilds were getting smaller, as prices rose, fees and expense seeed to be rising, gas checks, insurance, repairs etc, plus the hasste of 'call outs' for repairs.
Land seemed pretty straight forward, rising prices, no more supply, tax incentives, grants.

Today land is pobably an even more imprant part of an investment portfolio. Gold seems high, interest rates not clever, when account for inflation, BTL yeilds even worse, shares could be bumpy for a couple of years.

Ill kick a thread off, and when get time do a bit of a diary about my fields., to include what garnts are available, what tax incentives are given, what to actually do with it when youve bougt it... etc


anyone interested ?

[dancing piranha] 11/7/2008 19:47

Great short over the next year!

[boris johnson] 01/7/2008 15:48

How close is the land to any buildings relating to Canal activities any Wharfs wharehouses etc.

Barratts did something very similar in a similar location in the grounds of a large house got permission to build houses and apartments.

one thing that swung it was the land was classed as commercial due to to canal headquarters close by. Of cource it was Barratts and they know how to arrange things to their liking !

[adda] 30/6/2008 11:31

absolutely agree with you ydderf. As business contracts so does their requirement for office use. As GDP contracts and deflation asserts itself, demand for retail premises will contract. As Banks retrench and demand better cover on Companies debt the cost of finance will increase for those more over leveraged Companies and ones are more exposed to the recessionary cycle.

Question is, how low do you see these going??

[ydderf] 27/6/2008 08:58

to all of you:

what is 'property investment' ?

is it the same as 'investing' in commodities?

seems to me that the basics of investment have been overlooked in this long credit bubble - where is the real growth in earnings coming from in property?

in truth property value is linked firmly to the price and availability of credit - period! only overpaid directors of property co's and innocent and naive holders of the shares believe it is the genius of management which causes values to inflate, yes INFLATE! not grow.

growth in property values (as compared to property prices) can only come from GDP growth, or in rare instances where for e.g. the footfall environment changes....property shares are finished until the cycle ends and punters start to buy (discount of 66 per cent perhaps at that point)anticipating the next bubble...

[chairman2] 25/6/2008 14:12

Councillor

It means there is a strong chance the deal
will not through and shareholders wont have
the comfort of a cash cushion.

In these dire property markets I'm not
sure I'd want to be a seller unless I absolutely
had to sell.

[the councillor] 25/6/2008 12:21

the arabs comtemplating a bid for for trillium - meeting the 1.4b asking price - any ideas what this will mean if the deal goes thru ?