Kier Share Discussion Threads

[sparty1] 19/7/2021 10:10

which is why insti`s have been both supportive and accumulators of the shares , hence the shareprice well above the strike rate..

As ever ,you make little sense.

[wallywoo] 19/7/2021 09:23

And I state again operating profit is not bottom line profit or cash generation and is extremely misleading.You may well be just stating the same misleading comments by the CEO. The exact same company that said they would have net cash by June 2019. It is still misleading.Kier have yet to prove they can generate any cash at all. They have made no promises that they will either. They have everything to prove.

[stdyeddy] 19/7/2021 09:16

And since you require reminding, let me point out key passages from the latest update:

The Group expects to deliver a full year 2021 adjusted operating profit margin of approximately 3%.

The Group is confident that it now has the platform to achieve its medium-term targets of:
Revenue: GBP4.0 - 4.5bn
Adjusted operating profit c. 3.5%
margin:
Cash conversion of operating c. 90%
profit:
Balance sheet: Sustainable net cash position with capacity
to invest
Dividend: Sustainable dividend policy with dividend
cover of around three times earnings across
the cycle.

[stdyeddy] 19/7/2021 09:14

wolly, I am merely repeating what the latest news is from Andrew Davies. He is not a liar; he is a cautious and diligent ceo who has spent two years turning Kier around. You, on the other hand, are an unprincipled advfn troll intent on gulling people out of their shares. Forward price/earnings for Kier is less than 4. The sector average is 18. Kier's share price will easily triple from here when the market re-rates this share and possibly even quadruple.

[wallywoo] 19/7/2021 08:54

Lol, this rubbish has issued 458 percent more shares in 2.5 years and raised £471m in that time. It still now has roughly -£300m net tangible assets, so a very poor balance sheet and easily the worst in this sector. It has to recruit a army of share rampers (who mostly post no where else) so the share price still has some demand. It has disappointed for years.


To put it simply Kier is a money pit, a charity, but certainly not a investment.


Stdy states the same lie again and again. Operating profit is not bottom line profit. Kier has always had a operating profit. There's no evidence yet that Kier can generate a return or cash. It has everything to prove.

[stdyeddy] 19/7/2021 08:09

Btw, who is telling us to be 'very careful'? Is it the liar wolly/bathboy who pretended to be short Kier for seven months and tried to persuade people on here to sell and miss out on a 300% rise? Oh yes it is!!! Give yourself a little auto-lick you lying snake. So now you're posting from both of your 'handles' at the same time; two 'identities' that have been 100% wrong on every pompous pronouncement that you've made for 10 months. wolly, everyone knows that bathboy is you and that you're a lying fraud with a vendetta against kier.

[stdyeddy] 19/7/2021 08:07

hahahaha. wolly/bathboy you are reliably wrong as usual. Kier wrote down assets and paid restructuring costs; it didn't lose money, it incurred costs. Davies has said clearly that the restructuring is over. Kier is making money. His cautious forecast is between £140m and £157m annually with a third to be paid out in dividends. Trading update tells us of a 3% profit on turnover ahead of forecast. This is a message that you will continue to deny, and I will continue to post for two months.

[bathboy2] 19/7/2021 07:59

I said this the other day, operating profits 3%in 2019 and 2.5%in 2020, and lost money after exceptionals??, the debt mountain being reduced is a possible help, but like it's said, everything is waiting for proper numbers,

[ontheforks] 19/7/2021 07:48

You got orders to fill by any chance you can't keep popping up with comments like that after being wrong about kier for so long not to mention all the shorts you claimed to have opened cmon man sort yaself out good luck longs 👍🏻

[wallywoo] 19/7/2021 07:02

Be very careful here, the ramping / con team on here are trying to suggest that Kier's 3 percent operating profit margin means they will make a overall profit.Kier have made substantial losses for years and cash has flowed out at a rate of £200m a year, but they have always made a operating profit. It means nothing, and it certainly doesn't mean that they will be making 3 percent overall profit and cash on all revenue, which can be distributed to shareholders.Kier have everything to prove moving forward and is a extremely high risk investment.

[ontheforks] 18/7/2021 08:42

Anyone read the interview Davis did on the 16th of July in building I couldn't read it all but the bit I did read seems positive... How's your shorts doing zico good luck longs 👍🏻

[zicopele] 17/7/2021 20:41

Keep buying lads

[pl dil] 17/7/2021 16:24

Wassup Sam , missing me ?

[petersw1] 16/7/2021 22:43

Thanks zico for helping guide me to see the bull case is stronger than I thought :)

[petersw1] 16/7/2021 22:13

The reason to raise being that it gives a net benefit to shareholders. Without it the refinancing terms on the debt would have been worse. They raised enough to make the balance sheet good enough and to keep borrowing costs at reasonable levels.

[petersw1] 16/7/2021 21:42

I didn't forget the £10m pension contribution. I don't see how that can be considered a cost of the raise or sale nor how it could be considered part of the overall refinancing costs. I expect to see it added to the pension assets that are shown on the balance sheet and contribute to the overall position.

The prospectus for the raise lists "total estimated costs related to the Principal Debt Facilities Stage 2 Amendments of £18.2 million".

It also meations "Principal Debt Facilities Stage 1 Amendments", that became effective on 13 April 2021, but I haven't seen any cost listed associated with that. I presume there were costs.

The turnover forecast shown on SharePad for FY2021 is £3308.8m
3% of that suggests earnings of £99m

99-(18.2+22.7) => £58.1m earnings after subtracting the known costs described above.
I don't imagine there being other costs including the Stage 1 Amendments more than that. So maybe we might even be positive overall not just adjusted.

That sounds better than I was expecting.
Feel free to correct all my mistakes.

[itisonlymoney] 16/7/2021 21:14

zicopele/bathboy, you've been given the answers more than once. Profit is stated as "full year 2021 adjusted operating profit margin of approximately 3%". Kier has made approx £100m profit after adjustments. A good result after 2 years of writedowns.

The cash raise is separate. They raised another £350m and there some costs. So what? What company does a cash raise of £350m without costs? What's your beef man? It's common knowledge the last management team let costs get out of hand and paid out dividends they couldn't afford. New management team has taken two years to turn it around. Hats off to Davies. He played a weak hand really well. Now debt is minimal he can focus on growing the business.

[zicopele] 16/7/2021 18:02

You forgot the £10m pension contribution on KL sale.or the loss on KL of £10m or the underwriting costs £12m.

Then there is the refinancing costs for debt. Goodness knows what that was.

The list goes on and on. Lucky that it is all absorbed in the 3% margin which Steddy keeps telling us about.

What a great company Kier us. Cant see why they raised equity at all. With their cash generation why did they bother?

Bet nobody can answer that simple question.

[petersw1] 16/7/2021 17:13

I make it £351m raised gross, £328.3m net with costs of £22.7m.


Why do you need to wonder?
It is already stated as "full year 2021 adjusted operating profit margin of approximately 3%".

[zicopele] 16/7/2021 16:00

Fair play to Kier management. They raised £350m yes £350m and have reduced debt by £320m.

Just another £30m costs associated with all this financial engineering but who cares? That is the shareholders problem.

I wonder if the operating profit of 3% will be achieved after writing off all that £30m. Steddy can probably answer that one for us.

[bathboy2] 16/7/2021 15:45

Can they make money on 3%operating margin, possibly, but has the debt pile been reduced enough, keep believing the board expectations, too late when they find another skeleton in the cupboard, or something to blame, covid, supply issues, materials prices, lack of skilled labour, all of these are floating around to be used if required, lol, at least the sun is shining, a cold beer to be had, enjoy the weekend

[stdyeddy] 16/7/2021 12:55

Another contract win for our favourite construction firm, and one likely to lead to many others for the other freeports plus existing port developments, all shown to be in need of big investment post-brexit.

KIER TO BUILD BORDER CONTROL BUILDINGS FOR PORTSMOUTH PORT


This £17.1m project will support the wider ambitions of this new free port for Solent, which is one of the eight free ports announced by the chancellor in his budget.

Procured through the Procure Partnerships framework, it is one of the largest investment projects in the port’s history and it set to generate 100 new jobs when construction is complete.

This is the latest project Kier has won in Portsmouth, with others including Mayfield school.

[stdyeddy] 16/7/2021 12:51

You are a berk -- exactly like wolly. The spelling is 'you're' you nitwit. Do you remember these little English lessons that we used to have a couple of years back? Evidently not.

[bathboy2] 16/7/2021 11:13

You must be in kier at £11 or more average, that's why your so desperate, Un-stdy or un-hinged is it