James Halstead Share Discussion Threads

[zangdook] 18/1/2022 00:30

Thank you. That makes it clear.
Is that internal manual available anywhere?

[wad collector] 17/1/2022 23:11

Zangdook
From HMRC internal manual, which clarifies the issue , it later clarifies that the same is true for AIM shares and the 2 year rule. Yes it makes no difference if they are reorganised or whatever.



shares
IHTA84/S107(4), with effect from 6 April 1996, provides that, without prejudice to subsection (1), shares within IHTA84/S105(1)(bb) (i.e. any unquoted shares), which are:

owned by the transferor immediately before the transfer; and
would, under TCGA92/S126 – S136 (capital reorganisation, company reorganisation or amalgamation) be identified with other shares previously owned by them,
will have their period of ownership treated as including the period of ownership of the original shares. So if, for example, there was a capital reorganisation just six months before the transfer, but the earlier shares had been held for five years, the period of ownership of the earlier shares would be taken into account if they themselves would have qualified for the relief.

[bda3490] 17/1/2022 12:03

Bonus issue/ stock split my belief is the IHT position is that the date is not 14 Jan but the date of original purchase. Its an artificial construction that alters the share price. Has to be that way or else you'd have to use the original share price for the base cost which would be a nonsense. Another way of doing it is to move from 10p shares to 5p - again twice as many at half the price.

Think of it as 2 6 inch logs versus 12 inch logs. Or two £1 coins in exchange for one £2 coin

OK if it was a bonus in lieu of a dividend (Script) then that would have a new date as you gave up a dividend on that date

[zangdook] 16/1/2022 23:35

But is it a reinvestment? Calling it a "bonus issue" makes it appear we're being given something new, akin to a dividend in specie.

It's interesting to hear you've been talking to them. I've found it almost impossible to get definite information about some of the minutiae of the rules. I had a couple of companies taken over and was careful to reinvest immediately, but aiui this only works if shares have already been held for two years - ie if you've held for 23 months and a company is taken over you have to start all over again. Do you know if that's right?

[wad collector] 16/1/2022 17:39

Can't see it will make any difference , because under the AIM IHT rules , you won't lose IHT protection if you reinvest "soon" if a company loses AIM status by takeover or whatever . So however it is interpreted ,split/bonus , you are immediately reinvesting in an AIM company.
Having recently negotiated with HMRC on an AIM portfolio, it is also clear that they are overwhelmed with work and they don't have time to look into any of these sort of issues in more than a fraction of the IHT applications. Though that is a different issue of course...

[zangdook] 15/1/2022 02:25

Another problem - how does this affect the IHT exemption for AIM shares? Does the two year clock start ticking from 14 January for the "bonus" shares, or from the original date of purchase?

[zangdook] 15/1/2022 00:22

It looks like a blip, and one that at least some shareholders could not have taken advantage of if they wished because of clueless brokers not realising the number of shares held has doubled.

Whether the blip was caused by pre-existing buy orders going through or because some holders were temporarily unable to sell, it didn't last.

[wad collector] 14/1/2022 14:22

Well I will happily eat my words if a share split puts up the price 10% again. Let's have another one tomorrow!

[trigger blade] 14/1/2022 12:45

40 years of virtually unbroken sales, profit and dividend growth in a basic industry, during which time competitors (including German ones) have gone bust or got out of the business is very impressive. They’ve also done similar share splits in the past and eventually the share price has risen to the pre-split level. I think that’s the logic they’re using again now.

From memory, the Halstead family or family trust count for about 40% of shares, so their interests are closely aligned with private shareholders.

A quick look on a historical share price website shows that in Jan 2000, the share price was the equivalent of about 12p, so any purchase then would be yielding close to 100%.

Each to his own, but I’m happy with my holding and with the way the company is run. With hindsight, I wish I had more.

[3800] 14/1/2022 12:42

"or there are people/robots who missed the news and see anything below 500p as an excellent buying opportunity." maybe you have a good point there there may be some who have long term limit order buys set up ready for any dip in the price.
3800

[kalkulacka] 14/1/2022 12:00

It is almost 10% up today, at 316p, so either the market really likes the (IMHO pointless) split, or there are people/robots who missed the news and see anything below 500p as an excellent buying opportunity.

[bda3490] 14/1/2022 09:33

So share price is 612 and an all time high and your moaning . The split was well publicised!

Saddo

[gateside] 14/1/2022 08:36

AZN are around 8500p and they don't see the need for a share split.

[zangdook] 14/1/2022 08:22

The title of this board is still apt even after 20 years. Why no 7am RNS with the new total of shares in issue?

Not alarmed but annoyed because my brokers are not up to speed and show a huge loss.

[wad collector] 14/1/2022 08:14

Yes here is your bonus but let me halve your pay...
OK who else was transiently alarmed by a 48% share price fall this morning?

[zangdook] 14/1/2022 02:25

The fact the board think this is a good idea and are willing to waste time and money on it is a big negative to me. I still like the actual business side but I'll be watching more carefully now. Presenting it not as a share split but as a "bonus" just makes it worse.

[wad collector] 13/1/2022 19:56

These share splits always seem pointless to me , the idea that the lower denomination makes them more tradable seems flawed to me. Just adds admin costs.

[alter ego] 13/1/2022 15:17

rns just now

"James Halsted plc (AIM: JHD) announces that, following shareholder approval at the AGM on 18 November 2021, it is expected that the issue of bonus shares will become effective at 8.00 a.m. on 14 January 2022.



Application has been made to the London Stock Exchange for the 208,372,026 Bonus Shares, which will rank pari passu with the existing ordinary shares, to be admitted to trading on AIM. It is expected that admission will become effective and that dealings in the Bonus Shares will commence at 8.00 a.m. on 14 January 2022."

[alter ego] 13/1/2022 13:35

I assume so, would be a shock if you didn't expect it.

[zangdook] 13/1/2022 13:23

So we'll be looking at £3, not £6.

[alter ego] 13/1/2022 13:15

"The Notice of the 2021 Annual General Meeting sets out the details of a proposed bonus issue ("Bonus Issue") of shares whereby Shareholders will be issued one ordinary 5p share for every ordinary share held by them at 5.00pm on 13 January 2022 ("Bonus Shares"). The issue of the Bonus Shares is subject to the approval of Shareholders at the AGM."

all resolutions at the agm were passed so effective at close of business today.

[wad collector] 13/1/2022 12:04

£6 looked overoptimistic last week but new ATH today pushing close. Never fall in love with a share?

[wad collector] 20/12/2021 17:18

Looks like we might get a bit of a bounce at the year end with a 570 close today. 600 not impossible this year if Omicron turns out not to fill our hospital beds.

[wad collector] 21/11/2021 21:29

That is pretty positive, which bearing in mind his understated approach, is even more positive!
IC just ran an assessment pointing out their warehouse stock approach has made them much more resilient to supply chain problems.
However good things are, they say close to Panmure Gordons 575p target so only a HOLD. FWIW.