Iofina Share Discussion Threads

[orslega] 07/8/2014 09:03

some bigger buyers this morning....100K just went through...

[che7win] 07/8/2014 08:51

Sandbag,
Good point.

I think MMs have been smart here, they were gathering shares the past week and pushing on up with the share price, the fall into the 40s was irrational, but some panic shareholders were around.

I have said it before, I think below 75p is cheap...

[bogg1e] 07/8/2014 08:46

Yes indeed, but what is it worth?

[sandbag] 07/8/2014 08:36

Che,

"but backed up with water, oil and gas potential"
Don't forget the helium!

[engelo] 07/8/2014 08:31

Looking back Triton sold on for $500 per acre?

[engelo] 07/8/2014 08:13

Rogerbridge could you spell out theTriton real please? When was it?

[engelo] 07/8/2014 07:58

Mr Big 23344 re land values: what's your ballpark valuation per acre? $50? $100? More? Have calculator ready waiting to multiply by 293,000 :-))

[rogerbridge] 07/8/2014 07:57

If the 30k sold to Triton went for $15m, what is the rest worth!
Personally, a joint venture sounds good, the assets can only increase in value over the coming years. Especially as water will be a commodity of increasing value.

[che7win] 07/8/2014 07:26

One of the reasons I was and am attracted to IOF is because we have an iodine business, capable of changing and established industry, but backed up with water, oil and gas potential.

Each one of theses areas could be worth more than current market cap, it derisks the business somewhat.
The longer we hold on to oil and gas acreage, the more valuable it becomes, in fact it would be nice to see a valuation put out by the company, these are hidden assets.

Last year, I was expecting the water business to be the fastest and most profitable part of IOF, even with the inclusion of a JV partner to help fund the costs.

[superg1] 07/8/2014 07:26

Bog

Filling in a gap there I think I read somewhere a while back that wells can get refracked every 18 months to 2 years.

Other comments include they can be fracked up to 1o times in the life of a well.

I forget how many bakken wells there are now (6k/7K) but yes they were talking 30,000 plus pre the 3 forks find, AND it's highly likely the drilling will spread to others areas.

So in theory up to 15000 fracks per year reworking wells, which is more than double of now, there could be 50,000 wells. Then add on that maintenance water.

I'll try and find some decent references about reworking, hopefully within the big oil company presentations.

In theory water use in the bakken area, will go maybe 3 fold or more than current use and will stay at that level for many years.

Irrigation permit holders supplying the oil industry will cease.

They estimated 3 bill gallons would be used for 2012 and it ended up as near double, so even the experts are way off.

That figure doesn't include all the water theft going on as they struggled to get supplies, so water use will have been higher.

Once the infrastructure is fully in place with better water monitoring, the official figure should rise.

[bogg1e] 07/8/2014 07:12

Cheers for the feedback.

[superg1] 07/8/2014 06:40

Leggit

Some good work on the Montana timelines there limits v actual execution.

If you are right and the hearing is done, then as you say I think it is highly unlikely it will take the full 90 days.

If you are right, you just relieved the 'boredom' for some.

[superg1] 07/8/2014 06:29

Water is only relevant if we get the permits, or do the rights swap, or produce and discharge water for sale.

Topic raised as mentioned by one poster that the hearing may well have taken place (yet to be officially confirmed, not doubting the poster)

Following what the laws say then they should get the permit.

I had wondered if some had sold as they had interest in the water side of the business. It would seem some new and old faces have appeared. EG Welcome back Greenroom.

On the tight supply situation and the buyer.

It was thought that if PIs got involved then the price would spike, that is exactly what happened yesterday, probably due to the water hearing comment.

[mister big] 07/8/2014 00:27

I agree selling triton mistake but the numbers quoted there do make the point that Atlantis very valuable - I weighed that up when made the $5 m dollar loan .
Water, gas and oil will be very valuable .

[gemferret] 06/8/2014 23:55

Bogg1e

@The implications for water demand are significant in a state that gets less than 13 inches of rainfall each year in its driest areas, and ranks among the bottom 10 states for precipitation. In 2012, the Bakken oil industry used about 5.5 billion gallons (209 billion liters) of water-more than the amount used by the 110,000 inhabitants of Fargo, the state's biggest city. When the Bakken is fully developed in the next 10 to 20 years, the oil and gas play's 40,000 to 45,000 wells may need to consume roughly double that amount-as much as 10.2 billion gallons per year (28 million gallons each day)-in maintenance water to keep the oil flowing'

That was before the 3 forks was confirmed. So they estimate by the time it's fully developed water use will be double that of now for maintenance water

only. That doesn't include reworking which is effectively a refrack.

In other words water use is going to climb so IOF are sitting pretty on a resource especially if restrictions ever appear.

Bob suggested that all water rights could be appropriated within a couple of years. IE acceptable limits hit. What then!!!.

If the Fresno takes 500k bod that's 7.6 billion gallons per year. That's about 250 iof water wells and a lot of desalination, but if someone needs it, it's there.

I checked what they paid for the acreage, it was around $5 to $10 per acre and they got $11 mill worth of 3D data thrown in.

30k acres that they let go (triton) got sold on for $15 mill doh!

[mister big] 06/8/2014 23:50

I believe IOF will partner with someone to exploit oil and gas , if not a sale of the property which in my opinion will be far in excess of the original purchase price - IOF is an iodine company and better focused doing that . I would favour disposing of Atlantis once it's true value is established - meanwhile with low cost technology being proven capital expenditure will be more readily funded or done through partnerships .
Atlantis will go for multiples of the original price !

[gemferret] 06/8/2014 23:42

Bogg1e

Each well gets reworked/refracked many times in it's life cycle to boost production.
Each well needs daily maintenance water to wash out salts, which amount to a complete frack.

Talk of 30,000 to 50,000 wells but that was before the 3 forks discovery.

It's not a case of frack and forget.

In fact in Canada and the US water flooding in now coming back, where they force water into the levels to up the pressures to force out the oil.

Schlumberger talk of hot water flooding being the best option

hxxp://www.glossary.oilfield.slb.com/en/Terms.aspx?LookIn=term%20name&filter=waterflood

So basically as Bob Shaver (now retired) the water guru said, "To me, water is going to be the oil of the 21st century."

He gave an estimate of use for the Bakken for 2013 and it ended up as double.

It seems ND still have emergency irrigation permit change of use rules in place, that is against water laws, they will expire at some point, once correct permits are in place.

Farmer Rambo's 100 barrels a day are no use to the likes of the huge oil services companies, 60 cents pb or not. They need big supplies guaranteed.

Farmer Rambo has to close down once his limit has been hit for the year, some have been hit with huge fines for going over their allowance.

[mister big] 06/8/2014 23:38

I think I'm sponsoring Jim's book !
It's definitely worth reading he's the smartest person I know. ..

[bogg1e] 06/8/2014 23:07

The value of the water (at Atlantis) though is only as great as the volume clients are prepared to purchase. If as superg has pointed out in the past, the chesapeake system has 170k in their pipe network and don't even require half of that for their drilling operations, how much water would operators require and for how long? I take it once the well has been drilled there's not much further use for the water right? (Unless it has iodine in it of course!)

[mister big] 06/8/2014 23:07

The point the gas pipeline is correct it's linked up to the main pipeline - so fracking is not just a possibility someone will do it. !

[mister big] 06/8/2014 22:59

I was originally told 10 billion barrels however the key point is that Atlantis was purchased before the oil and gas boom, by definition these properties have shot up in value with fracking .
I did dd and enquired separately into land valuations with rights - they went through the roof ! So Atlantis is valuable on any basis .

[superg1] 06/8/2014 22:17

Atlantis estimate is 35 billion barrels.

The current water discharge permit is for 30k bpd, that simply matched the plant intended use. It can be upped.

It's said that lawyers laughed IOF out of the office when they mentioned going for a discharge permit, calling it impossible, so IOF did it on their own over a number of years.

Pipelines are already in place.

I understand to Fresno reservoir has a 500k bpd storage limit, and water you store, you own.

Between IOF and the Bakken is the Bowdoin wildlife reserve, upstream from that is a scarce water area, that's why the US fisheries did a rights swap.

IOF in the times of actually dealing with the wells reported of one around 2,700 bpd, talk of better than expected and methods to improve.

34 wells already there plugged, and back then they were $50k each to drill.

I've no idea what desalination costs are, but that's more or less what it is about with IOF, the water seems to have just low level salt in it. As can be seen in photos they were happy to let it spray over adjacent land.

It's looks to me like a potential lucrative business all on it's own.

The US moan about fresh water lost forever (a water deficit) when used for fracking and injected, but IOF have permission to turn produced water into fresh water, so they have no affect on the water levels in those circs.

Stick in in the river and any customer can take it out downstream.

Not a priority but sitting there in the background.

[mister big] 06/8/2014 22:14

Where are netley and Arlington ?
Where is netley and Arlington ?
Surely , 'are 'is correct .

Not that it matters. !!

[freshvoice] 06/8/2014 22:10

Your grammar was correct Mr. Big, Netley and Arlington are singular. I.e. One and the same entity.