Hargreaves Services Share Discussion Threads

[bubloo] 01/8/2020 00:02

CC2014 IF YOU ARE NOT INVESTING WHY ARE YOU EVEN HERE. I THINK YOU ARE INTERESTED TO HAVE SOME BUT TRYING TO BEAT DOWN THE PRICE AND THEN GET IT. YOU ARE NOT GETTING MY SHARES THOUGH.

[castleford tiger] 31/7/2020 22:52

Not even for the yield?

[cc2014] 31/7/2020 12:14

hmm. Well we'll have to disagree.



If you don't need coal then you don't need to pulverise it.

Happy to accept it will take 10 years to become mainstream but I'm assuming the plant is built on a payback return which relies on it running at full capacity for a large number of years.


Anywys, I'll leave you guys to it. I'm unlikey to invest at this price and I know how annoying it is to read negative comments.

[beeks of arabia] 31/7/2020 11:42

I think it would be naive to think that there is not going to be more European demand for such a product. Especially considering the breakdown of world trade relationships and large EU infrastructure projects to stimulate growth.

I think you are looking at this too narrowly.

[netcurtains] 31/7/2020 11:41

Not worried by carbon thingy in fact it's a winner
I'm worried a bit by HS2 thing. Could that be cancelled or is it ok?

[cc2014] 31/7/2020 10:38

No-one concerned about the timing of building the new carbon pulverisation plant and whether they've spent a whole load of capital for something where demand is going to fall off a cliff?

[beeks of arabia] 31/7/2020 09:57

I agree and have made that comment myself.

[meijiman] 31/7/2020 09:48

Would you not have thought that in any normal company the person responsible for the disastrous 'investments' in coal (deep mine and open pit) would no longer be in charge? Must be a great place to work..job for life for everyone. What's not to like.

[beeks of arabia] 31/7/2020 09:22

I will add I know many people in one of the subsidaries, quite closely. They are a wonderful company who look after their staff well. Not many corporates you can say that about.

[netcurtains] 31/7/2020 08:36

Have the Canadians just bought 5% of the company? ( CANACCORD GENUITY GROUP INC)


About the company in Wikipedia:

[bubloo] 29/7/2020 18:41

Think Simon Thompson mentioned in IC that limited free float which could boast shred's price when pi's get interested

[bubloo] 29/7/2020 18:40

cc2014 , I think trying to buy some cheap shares beating this down
potential 21 pence or more dividend next year, additional another 4.5 pence coming our way in September
nav over 400 p
plenty more planning permission achieved land available to sale.
distribution business related partly to nhs ( in present covid situation could give a uplift to distribution arm)I am aware of the volume of distribution occurring in ohs

personally I think safe investment

[bubloo] 29/7/2020 18:40

cc2014 , I think trying to buy some cheap shares beating this down
potential 21 pence or more dividend next year, additional another 4.5 pence coming our way in September
nav over 400 p
plenty more planning permission achieved land available to sale.
distribution business related partly to nhs ( in present covid situation could give a uplift to distribution arm)I am aware of the volume of distribution occurring in ohs

personally I think safe investment

[netcurtains] 29/7/2020 10:15

yep market likes eclectic

[netcurtains] 29/7/2020 09:16

If you like eclectic you'll love HSP

[meijiman] 29/7/2020 09:04

Decent enough..key is the 4.5p divi and some talk of a bigger payout next year.

[netcurtains] 29/7/2020 08:56

Turned £9.7M loss into £1.3M profit.
Only gone up 5% this morning could be lots more to go - trading at below NAV - seems a good deal to me - what are your views?

[netcurtains] 29/7/2020 08:51

These results look OK to me.
Turned £9.7m loss into £1.3m profit.
Cant say fairer than that.
:-)

Currently trading at below NAV, nearly a NETNET
come on this looks like a bargain don't you think?

[netcurtains] 29/7/2020 08:17

Thanks meijiman - looks OK this morning.

[meijiman] 28/7/2020 11:22

I'm not negative at these levels..just bemused at some of the deals here. did they once buy a deep mine in Yorkshire? Anyway moving swiftly on- is it now seen as a property play or a mini conglomerate?

[netcurtains] 28/7/2020 11:04

meijiman: Well that is the definition of a NETNET stock (or near NETNET) - a company that has got into a mess.

I thought everyone knew that. The reason people buy NETNET (or near NETNET) is for (a) recovery or (b) it goes bust and the assets are worth more than the share price or (c) it gets taken over....

There really isn't much downside as long as share price holds up. I have no idea if I have bought near the bottom or not. It might go all the way into being a NETNET or it might recover from here. I decided to buy now and if goes into real NETNET buy again. Its traded around this level since april so might be bottom - I just do not know.

[meijiman] 28/7/2020 10:37

Yes all very well..but maybe they wouldn't need to be so active in restructuring if they hadn't made some huge blunders. Management seemed to think the ending of coal as a power source didn't apply to them!

[netcurtains] 28/7/2020 10:08

thanks for that CC2014...
I have noted that there is also lots of mention of some German Associate (300m euros) whats that all about?
Then there is the future property division in Edinburgh (house price in Edinburgh are rising and I suspect when this development is completed next year we're talking about some money....
Then there is the big mixed property sale just gone through - was that a profitable sale? I have no idea....

I bought in on the statistical chance of rise. The company last said their NAV per share was about 400p

So pretty sure its worth more than 202-206p but who knows.

Interesting play - in state of flux...
I like ACTIVE directors and this board is currently very active restructuring the business.

[cc2014] 28/7/2020 09:49

Hey. We meet again. I am a previous owner of HSP although not now having sold around 290p as the market started to meltdown in February.

You seem to be a fan of companies trading at below NAV. I can't argue with that as they attract me too but many of them trade below NAV forever not because of market mispricing but because of the assets involved or the type of underlying business.

HSP has a long history of bad investments and having to write off assets. Also the management reward scheme looks excessively generous to me and in the interests of the management not the shareholders.

In May 2017 the NAV was 432p and between then and now they sure haven't paid out 70p in dividends, which is why relying on discounts to NAV can be damaging to your wealth

I think it would be worthwhile looking at exactly what they do in detail if you have not had the time to do so already. Despite them now closing their last coal mine a chunk of their money is made from coal trading and associated products for the steel industry. I see that at real risk over the next 10 years as furnaces are forced to convert away from coal.

I won't go on but their earthworks division has proved to be a complete basket-case and given the state of construction I think will struggle.


Having said all that it's not all bad and clearly 200p reflects some bad future performance in the share price.