Hardide Share Discussion Threads

[4x4mudplugger] 18/4/2023 05:14

What about the value of the forward orders they have and the approvals they have taken years to acquire.. Are these not factored in..

[lefrene] 03/3/2023 16:17

As patents expire so their addressable markets will gradually take over the tech, at no expense to themselves. High volume consumer goods manufacturers won't want this tech, it's heavy industry in the aero space, mining, and oil industries that can add value to their products with the HDD product. But I guess none of them are in much of a hurry, why spend money when HDD does the research for free and sells the product below cost. Might as well wait for it to fall off the perch and pick it up for pennies. A great shame, the product needs to be re-labelled 'green', by showing how much longer machines can last, thus less energy needed to make more new machines, perhaps less energy is consumed when machines are running with this tech on contact surfaces? These white coats need to learn strategies of how to create volume demand, ie they need to learn to make it a business, as it simply isn't a business, and after 20 years of not being a business, perhaps it's time to do something else? It's been a laboratory for 20 years paid for with private money subsidising heavy industries that don't want to pay fair value for it.

I wish them no ill, but as it stands they won't see my money helping to pay their stipends.

[gb904150] 03/3/2023 15:56

Ok, thanks for clarifying tbow.

The problem is that most CLN lenders demand very favourable conversion terms. Usually at a small discount to the 30 day VWAP. It typically involves forward selling of stock ahead of each conversion, then a bit of a relief. Rinse and repeat for each conversion.

The end result is usually share price weakness and a terrible return for equity holders. We've had enough of that already!

If however, a CLN can be done with conversion at a minimum level and at a decent premium to the current SP, well that would be another matter.

The problem remains though - when will HDD reach profitability? At my last calculations they had quite a way to go in terms of revenues to achieve that.

[tbow112] 03/3/2023 13:33

By raising money I do not mean equity which dilutes the shareholders. What they need is a low interest loan which can be repaid at little cost if it is not needed.
A convertible loan stock suits this requirement.

[gb904150] 03/3/2023 11:20

To be fair they have raised money at higher levels on several occasions, over a period of 20+ years.

And yes, 20 years should definitely have been a sufficient time frame to figure out which lines of business they should be in.

:)

I take it no interest in the AGM for anybody?

[tbow112] 03/3/2023 10:01

They obviously should have raised money several years ago, but the story remains a good one.
If Hardide do not have enough pricing power to run a particular line of business profitably they should be getting out of that business. The management should by now have enough information to know which lines actually provide an adequate return.

[rogerramjet] 02/3/2023 11:58

Hardide are just starting on the aircraft industry. It's what they have been waiting for. Oil and gas good and expanding. Power generation taking off.Etc etcThe party is just starting.If you consider what the company has been up against and that they are still here. Covid. Low oil prices reducing number of rigs running etc.The diversification is happening albeit slowly but hopefully the aviation side will win out.

[gb904150] 02/3/2023 11:28

Really? This is a company with a track record of 20 years of shareholder value destruction and are still loss making. You think a company like this should have 'no difficulty raising money'?

There's no doubt there is potential and value in the technology, but the company is running on fumes and has stated in their last couple of RNS's they are looking at ways to raise money.

8th Feb - finals
"Opportunities to further strengthen the balance sheet are also being considered."
"Further initiatives to improve the Group's financial position and to provide further working capital have continued in the new financial year"


22nd Dec 2022 - funding and results update
"The Group maintains strong cost discipline and is focused on moving toward organic cash generation, but in the meantime will continue to explore options to raise additional funds to further improve its financial position."

Surely this company is just a watch, wait and see until there's some more clarification on that? Unless you are confident they can do some deal at a premium to current SP, or sell out completely.

They've also just hit a 3month, 1year, 3year and perhaps even all time low.

Any PI's plan on attending the AGM?

[tbow112] 02/3/2023 09:54

Fundamentally there seems to be something wrong with their financial advice - they really should have no difficulty raising money. To an outsider they need to raise some money and then raise their prices.

[dr biotech] 01/3/2023 17:54

Really the header needs to be updated. The patents have probably expired since this thread started as it’s been so long. Think this company is never going to go anywhere significant.

[gb904150] 01/3/2023 16:10

hi lefrene. Yes, I think that's quite a good summary. Great tech but 20 years of very pedestrian growth, relatively low margins for such a customized, high tech application. They have essentially been subsidizing those end customers for 20 years while drawing on the golden teat of shareholders every time funds get low.

20 years of making losses and even now, do they really have the scalability to get to profitability.

HDD is running on fumes again hence the share price weakness. Looks like they are getting close to another funding 'solution'.

It has sure been a great ride for the BOD....but not so much for shareholders.

It's a good example of the dangers of investing when the exec team hold very little stock. Their continued salaries are the priority, not shareholders returns.

Still - surprising the Badenoch's, Evershed, Andrew Boyce with their significant stakes have been happy to oversee such erosion of value.

AGM on the 23rd. Anybody attending? There wasn't exactly a warm invite to get involved.

What kind of funding coming up then? Another discounted placing? Or a death spiral CLN?

I sold out quite a long time ago, but I'm still interested by the technology and what should be value.

[lefrene] 01/3/2023 14:16

This is the type of high tech business that 'should' have been capable of making many machines last indefinitely, and I was tempted to invest many years ago. However I realised that most manufacturers don't want their machines to last forever, thus the markets for this remarkable technology would likely have a limited market in specialist equipment. ie a much smaller market than one might initially suppose.

Over the years it's been a classic white coats enterprise, apparently not much business initiative to broaden their addressable markets, and the model is to pass the begging bowl around whenever the coffers get a bit low, ie it's not an actual business enterprise. The clients are getting the product too cheap, and presumably this company is going to get swallowed on the cheap by a major aero engine manufacturer, before too much longer.

[tbow112] 31/12/2022 14:11

Always seems to me that this sort of company should be raising money with a convertible loan stock - say £10m at 3% convertible at 30p.

[pugugly] 29/12/2022 12:20

"The Group maintains strong cost discipline and is focused on moving toward organic cash generation, but in the meantime will continue to explore options to raise additional funds to further improve its financial position."

OH DEAR !!!!!!!!!!!!
Further dilution possible. If by any idiotic management decisions "Death spiral" then unfortunately End of Road and overseas takeaway at a scalpers price. (imo)

[casholaa] 22/12/2022 17:49

8th of Feb.

[casholaa] 22/12/2022 16:27

No problem.

[rogerramjet] 19/12/2022 07:44

TBA December 2022Hardide don't even know when the results will be published......

[rogerramjet] 19/12/2022 07:10

I went to bed early last night hoping for results this morning........

[nick100] 16/12/2022 07:21

This year it is pretty late

[rogerramjet] 08/12/2022 14:04

Anyone know when the preliminary results are for 2022?TIA

[gb904150] 10/11/2022 11:40

Yes, nice approval for Leonardo but the fundamental issues are still unchanged.

For FY22 the situation still doesn't look great. I'd expect something approximately:

Revs £5m.
COGS £3m
GP £2m

Admin expenses £2.6m.

Operating loss -£0.6m.
Depreciation £1m

As per the last TU at end Sept they had cash £0.7m with a bit more due in from a large customer.

That was after the £0.55m fundraise at 19p.
They were close to the sale and leaseback of Martinsville, USA, so that will boost the coffers, but then they'll start paying rents.

They just still seem a long way from profitability after all these years.

Prelims will be early December so I think just wait and see how the picture looks then.

Any ideas on the value of the Martinsville property? Shame on the timing, they'd have got a lot more for it 12 months ago.

[ansc] 10/11/2022 10:34

Health reasons have made me take my eye off the ball recently so missed this announcement last month:

27 October 2022 - Hardide plc

("Hardide", "the Group" or "the Company")

Supplier Approval and First Orders for Leonardo Helicopters

Hardide, the developer and provider of advanced surface coating technology, is pleased to announce that it has received full supplier approval from Leonardo Helicopters ("Leonardo") for its Hardide-A coating to coat flying parts, and the first production order has been received for processing. Leonardo is one of the UK's leading aerospace companies and one of the biggest suppliers of defence and security equipment to the UK Ministry of Defence.

The first parts to be coated are components used in the gearbox transmission systems of a particular class of helicopter and are part of an existing aircraft upgrade. The Company expects the approval to open up further opportunities within the Leonardo Group, based in Italy.

The Hardide-A coating was developed to meet the needs of the aerospace industry as an environmentally compliant alternative to Hard Chrome Plating. It has been qualified by several aerospace customers including Airbus, Lockheed Martin and Triumph Group.

Philip Kirkham, CEO, commented: "We are delighted to have secured approval from Leonardo Helicopters to coat flying parts after more than seven years of extensive testing of the coating. The first components have been received for processing and we look forward to a long and productive relationship with the Leonardo Group."

[tbow112] 29/10/2022 17:24

The question that arises is that if the development is of significant importance, how did it take 7 years to receive approval.