Cineworld Share Discussion Threads

[williamcooper104] 31/3/2021 16:01

Thanks - that's what I thought it was Does mean ironically that the liability goes down as the credit gets worse

[lthtrust] 31/3/2021 15:52

I found this definition.The lessee's incremental borrowing rate is defined in IFRS 16 as 'the rate of interest that a lessee would have to pay to borrow over a similar term, and with a similar security, the funds necessary to obtain an asset of a similar value to the right-of-use asset in a similar economic environment'.

[hpcg] 31/3/2021 15:28

They can't take on more conventional debt because they have covenant waivers. Existing lenders will not allow anything senior. The convertibles were fine as unsecured / junior. The lender covers by short selling. It was like an equity raise.

[lthtrust] 31/3/2021 15:18

In the 2020 preliminary report it states "The incremental borrowing rates applied to property leases for the COVID-19 amendments ranged between 5.9%-16.8% for modifications between March and September and ranged between 17.9%-26.4% for modifications
between October and December." In the November 2020 RNS Cineworld said that they have $4.9 Billion Bank/bond debt at an average interest rate of around 4.5%. Why are Cineworld using such a high incremental borrowing rate ?

[srpactive] 31/3/2021 14:05

No problem, we are starting to create a good thread here of
shorts and longs, we can work together to improve.

dyor

active

[swiss tony] 31/3/2021 13:53

Thanks, I guess they top skimmed at 120p and bough more back at £1, nice work.
Onwards and upwards it seems....

[srpactive] 31/3/2021 13:43

ST

They have been increasing from the lows I believe, they
reduced a little the other week but now beck well over
12%.

I have thought the Chinese will be getting well into the
West entertainment industry, here is their chance thanks
to the shorts that have driven the West's companies values
through the floor.

dyor

active

[swiss tony] 31/3/2021 13:36

Thanks hpcg, much appreciated.
So now we have an RNS stating Jangho have bought back into Cine.
I am thoroughly confused. Are they just trading and picking up 3/4% every time?

[srpactive] 31/3/2021 13:05

RNS

Jangho increased from 11 % to 12.68%, quite an increase,


dyor

active

[hpcg] 31/3/2021 09:45

The family office / hedge fund Archegos Capital was liquidated on Friday. The 9 or so holdings it had all dropped by near 40%. They had also doubled since the turn of the year (ViacomCBS, Discovery, Baidu, GSX example names). GSX is a criminal enterprise that will eventually and suddenly zero, but was well shorted. The fund had been double counting its collateral with several banks. Goldman, Morgan Stanley, Credit Suisse and Nomoura all sold large blocks of shares with the latter two making billion dollar losses. Estimates are they were using between 5 and 20x leverage.
Archegos did not take direct holdings but used contracts for difference, with the bank buying shares to cover. This obscured the ownership situation though it should have been fairly obvious something was amiss from the vertical rise in the first two months. It seem certain that other entities will be doing the same; banks will do anything for money. As the MBS situation demonstrated Goldman and Morgan Stanley are much smarter than the European and Japanese banks who are always the losers.

It is very likely that professionals are behind the short squeezes in Gamestop and AMC, and they managed to co-opt the Reddit crowd as their marks. CINE a bit different in that the Jangho complex drove the price up, and as recent RNS show are now selling out hoping to have attracted enough new money to pass of their shares too. This has been open, at least to the extent we know.

If you ever see an investment bank on the books it isn't them, it is them fronting for someone anonymous.

[swiss tony] 31/3/2021 06:14

hpcg, can you expand on that please?

[creddy] 30/3/2021 18:34

I have a small holding, quite happy with my small holding and looking forward to it growing bigger when cinemas reopen causing huge excitement. if it goes the other way then my small holding may shrivel up and shrink smaller. always do your own thinking,

[williamcooper104] 30/3/2021 15:58

From memory you decrease rental liabilities as your borrowing rate goes up as your incremental debt cost is the discount rate used to discount the lease liabilities A little how banks created equity by fair valuing their liabilities during the credit crunch

[lthtrust] 30/3/2021 15:37

It is difficult to compare the assets and liabilties in the 2020 preliminary report with 2019 annual report because Cinewolrd made significant increases to the Incremental Borrowing Rate which changes the reported values of the assets and liabilities.
However the Equity attributable to equity holders of the Group was $2,937.7 Million at the end of december 2019 and only $226.3 Million at the end of december 2020. This shows us that the pandemic has resulted in the destruction of over $2.7 Billion of Cineworld's equity in 2020.

[srpactive] 30/3/2021 09:47

I bought a few more in this mornings dip too, reminds me of itv
years and years ago when I was buying them in the 30p's before
the rise. We shall see.

dyor

active

[kidknocked] 30/3/2021 09:27

I'm back in, fall is overdone I'd say.

[srpactive] 29/3/2021 09:11

S6

Just out of interest what else are you going short on now?

Tia

active

[srpactive] 29/3/2021 08:46

s6

So it has increased 250% from your sell comment.

And you come on here critising people who have done the
opposite, really.

A balanced thread indeed.

DYOR

active

[wigwammer] 29/3/2021 08:36

Lol. Thanks for conceding you ARE the same smartie who repeatedly encouraged people to sell near the lows. The touch of an ape :)

[smartie6] 29/3/2021 08:28

Long run wigwammer.

Pointless counting your pennies today if it goes bust tomorrow. FFS.

[srpactive] 29/3/2021 08:00

L / Sm

What on earth are you talking about, I have just mentioned
the turnaround possibility and along the way saying all
views shorts and longs should be listened to, to create a
balanced thread for all to benefit. So cut the childish
ramping comment.

The shorts did very well in the fall, the longs did okay
on the return, just accept this is an investment, grow
up and take emotion elsewhere.


Every investor as I have said for decades must dyor.

Actually if shorts and longs worked together we could
all improve and make more money, such a shame.
That is why I welcome shorters to a thread to balance
and attempt to improve.

DYOR

active

[wigwammer] 29/3/2021 07:28

Lol. I wonder which "I got it wrong too" premium member down-ticked that? Please to know you're all here :)

[wigwammer] 29/3/2021 07:17

Smartie??!! The same smartie who was repeatedly telling people to dump in the 30's? Jeez pal, at least change your username and have some self respect :)

[smartie6] 29/3/2021 07:09

Hit the nail on the head.