Camellia Share Discussion Threads

[crumppot] 17/7/2023 12:51

isnt this called job for the boys?

[arthur_lame_stocks] 17/7/2023 12:20

It looks to me like most of his experience is in Banking and Finance. Is that the most suitable skillset for running an agricultural company?

[crumppot] 17/7/2023 10:45

Nothing is changing....

[zoolook] 17/7/2023 10:36

Yes. Internal appointment of CEO indicative of more of the same rather than radical change and realisation of value for shareholders.

[piedro] 17/7/2023 08:55

Not very encouraging the new Director changes.
I had hoped they would put some whizz kid in as CEO.

They've just reshuffled the pack.

AIMHO, BWDIK

[crumppot] 23/6/2023 16:15

Big fall in the share price today?

[crumppot] 09/6/2023 10:44

They should do a buyback and pay a special dividend

[cjohn] 09/6/2023 08:04

Oh dear, a profit warning: margins under pressure in the agri-businesses. Wot a surprise.

No sign management get it either.

Still eezymunny is right. There's real asset value here, provided the management don't blow the cash on "diversifying" into more dire agri-businesses.

Also agree with itx
that if they can't control their itch to waste shareholders' funds on agri-acquisitions, it should be up the value chain, not yet more low margin risky producers.

[russman] 09/6/2023 06:10

no mention of apples.

[1tx] 08/6/2023 19:47

Thanks for the info crumpot I am not surprised longer term holders are unhappy.I trust any share buybacks will be in the form of a share tender as for example recently happened at Goodwin where I am a shareholder.Shareholders could tender a fixed proportion of their shares,if they wished,for purchase at a premium price & also apply to redeem further shares for any allocations not taken up which would be allocated pro rata to applications.

I feel normal buybacks in the market are useless for small private holders.

[value hound] 08/6/2023 16:10

crumppot / anyone else who attended the AGM - what questions, if any, were asked re strategy / outing the inherent value / increasing shareholder income etc.?

The intended acceleration of diversifying agricultural operations by crop and geographical location coupled with "modest" buybacks won't be enough to please CJohn and others! :-)

[eezymunny] 08/6/2023 16:04

Err the promise of a significant buy-back when they consider the share to be materially undervalued doesn´t look to you more significant than a mild and rather predictable warning?

Come on Arthur - you´re losing the value plot!

[crumppot] 08/6/2023 16:03

Some unhappy shareholders at the AGM today. on a show of hands the Chairman looked like he lost the vote for his reelection but 99% of the proxy votes were for him.

[arthur_lame_stocks] 08/6/2023 15:51

I must admit I stopped reading the t/u after I realised it was a profit warning so I can only assume there was also some good news in there along with the bad. I'm not sure why else the price would actually go up today.

[1tx] 08/6/2023 10:28

From todays gloomy trading update it is difficult to see what agricultural product anybody would want to invest £100m spare cash in!Over the years my most profitable agricultural related investments have been & continue to be the supply of requirements to farmers.That is to say companies like NWF & Wynnstay which I have held many years.

Looking at CAMs share price chart over recent years even after the recent modest rise,shorting it would have been probably more profitable although I doubt if it would be possible or likely that anyone would have bothered.

Although I have been aware of the company for years I only started investing in it recently when the shares fell below £50 as a potential asset play/value investment.

[nerdlinger] 08/6/2023 07:46

I can't see any short positions disclosed here but that doesn't mean there aren't any. A short squeeze would be nice (for holders).

[cjohn] 07/6/2023 15:49

Piedro Jun '23 - 10:31 - 466 of 467

Just look at this tripe:
"... they are going to find it increasingly difficult to be
profitable. A bunch of low margin agri companies is never
going to be a huge profit generator ...."



Thank you for your kind words, Piedro, on my earlier comment.

Your graph is colourful but doesn't show margin!

A look at the annual report shows agricultural turnover of 283m sterling. They have
"adjusted" trading profit of 15.5m. But then there are various impairments of intangibles and PPE in the agricultural sector giving a trading profit for 2022 of 5.8m.


Even if we just go with the the figure you show on your graph, this is a pretty thin operational margin! Obviously, if we include all elements of agricultural trading, it's wafer-thin.

[piedro] 07/6/2023 10:31

I'm buying.

Despite all the criticism they are doing what they said they would do.

I suggest studying the changes that have taken place at Kakuzi and at
the tea estates to understand the process.

Just look at this tripe:
"... they are going to find it increasingly difficult to be
profitable. A bunch of low margin agri companies is never
going to be a huge profit generator ...."

[cjohn] 07/6/2023 09:57

Definitely worth writing to the board pointing out that there is an agricultural company trading at a huge discount to net asset value, whose shares would definitely be worth using the copious cash on.

[crumppot] 07/6/2023 08:57

I am worried about what the directors are going to do with the majority of the proceeds. They will only spend a small amount on share buy backs. That leaves a lot of money to be spent on investments such as Bardsleys.

They should pay out a big dividend to the shareholders.

[eezymunny] 07/6/2023 08:55

More up to date:

31/12/22

Very tangible assets (pretty easy to value?)

Net Current Assets £109m
Inv properties £25m (fair value 35m)
Inv in associates (insurance etc) £73m (plus up to £20m uplift for BF&M sale)
Money Market +debt inv 8m
Equity inv £26m
Heritage assets £9m
LT receiv 3m

Total £253-283m


More debateable/less tangible/hard to value assets?

Bio assets £14m
Bearer plants £99m
Land+buildings £50m
Plant/machinery £30m

Total £213m


LT debt liabs

£4m , def tax £37m


The market cap is so utterly out of kilter with that balance sheet, they´d be off their rockers to do anything but buy back shares whilst silly old Mr Market is willing to sell them at such a daft discount. Even the pretty hard tangible stuff, less all liabilities looks to be well north of 200m vs 160m market. And all the tea plantations, buildings, agri assets etc in for free as well. Madness...

[russman] 07/6/2023 08:21

hive those bits off to KKimani.

[arthur_lame_stocks] 06/6/2023 23:19

I guess they might appeal to a local buyer with a philanthropic side?

[1tx] 06/6/2023 22:50

This is an incredibly complex business in particular the Indian/Bangladesh operations we employ around 100,000 people,own over 40,000 houses occupied by 250,000 people,run 250 nurseries & schools,50 Hospital etc etc covering hundreds of sq Miles...It is probably unsellable.Essentially Gordon Fox bought numerous British Owned Tea plantation companies & their managing agents that were set up in the 1860 to 1900 period.
Nothing is going to happen very quickly.......