Byotrol Share Discussion Threads

[1gw] 20/9/2021 09:17

More than 1 month now since finals were published and still no Annual Report or Notice of AGM (as far as I can see). We appear to be waiting for something.

[football] 19/9/2021 11:27

Americans Are Poisoning Themselves In Large Numbers With Bleach, Hand Sanitizer And Quack Covid Cures Like Ivermectin


Hand sanitizers, which have very high alcohol content, can be lethal if ingested, particularly to small children or for products containing methanol

[football] 17/9/2021 09:56

Thats what' thinking positive news at the AGM but you know me at the moment in negative mode

[1gw] 17/9/2021 09:52

Unless perhaps you thought that by delaying a bit you might get a juicy contract announcement out ahead of the AGM and therefore provide more of a feel-good atmosphere to the meeting?

Has anyone had a notice of AGM yet? I see that in 2018, although the RNS Notice of AGM went out on 4th September, the actual board notice was dated 22nd August, some 2 weeks earlier.

[football] 17/9/2021 09:37

If I was a member of the board I would get the AGM out of the way soon as possible just in case there's any shocks in the half yearly training update and you don't want angry investors at an AGM do you.

[tonsil] 16/9/2021 16:58

It's not a problem. I filtered him ages ago and suggest all do the same.

[the ghost who walks] 16/9/2021 16:36

Is part of the motivation / issue for Sikh that he also lost money on byotrol last year when he shorted it from 2p and only closed at 8p? Or is it just the personal feud?

[supernumerary] 16/9/2021 15:31

1gw - thanks - I wasn't aware of the earlier story - I picked up on the feud when I started looking at TLY. On that it just seemed to me that two posters had different points of view, both of which were reasonable - it's bound to happen in the absence of full information. I was bemused to see him pop up on ORPH too - what a waste of time.

Fair enough to disagree, but carrying it across to other boards is counter-productive - I'd have put stt on filter ages ago if that didn't also filter the TLY board. As it is, I simply don't read anything he writes that's longer than a sentence...

[1gw] 16/9/2021 14:06

Yes, supernumerary, I agree it is silly and indeed rather sad. Perhaps it is reasonable to give some history given the way this feud is having a real impact on bulletin board readers' impression of byotrol.

sikhthetech has long had a problem with bulletin board contributors on a company originally called blinkx, then RhythmOne, then Taptica and now Tremor. When I started participating in a blinkx bulletin board back in 2014 he was convinced there was a "boiler room" or "pump and dump" gang operating there and he tried to enlist my help to expose it. I advised him that in my opinion he was misinterpreting the "community of interest" that existed on the bulletin boards as an organised "gang" - i.e. the posters overwhelmingly were long and were in aggregate hostile to anyone posting more balanced, or even negative, commentary as he was. He (mis)interpreted this hostility towards him as evidence of an organised gang trying to silence the voice of reason.

Over the period 2014 to 2018 sikhthetech became more and more hostile in his posting towards that company, moving from reasonable scepticism to what I felt were outright misleading posts. Over that period I moved from being one of his defenders to being someone who regularly clashed with him over his posts, drawing attention to misleading comments and doubtless teasing him about them on occasion.

What really sealed the deal though was when I invested in Totally, in 2017. Ironically I only followed that company because sikhthetech had pitched it to me over coffee when we met after an event for another company. Starting in 2018 I decided, despite being an investor in Totally, that I would point out some of the negative aspects of that company on the bulletin board, in particular around the balance sheet, in part to give sikhthetech a feeling for what it was like to have someone do this to a company he was invested in. I suppose this started around March/April 2018, but picked up intensity around July 2018.

In August 2018 sikhthetech appeared on the byotrol bulletin board, and he knows how to hold a grudge. It is not only byotrol (and Tremor) where he trolls both me and the company, he has been on SLN, ORPH, REAT, SUMM, CRST. I think byotrol is a particular target for him, though, because he also fell out (on blinkx) with football and shroder, both of whom were investors in byotrol.

[sikhthetech] 16/9/2021 13:59

I posted company/sector newsflow... I try not to rise to the gang's bait and counter the blatant baseless ramping as well as 1gw's hypocricy...

I posted the facts..

picking up the change in tone from the company, changing from 'record sales' in the early days of the pandemic..
The fact there was a lack of TUs after the summer... The small increase in global consumer sales despite the biggest pandemic and the fact that when a product is in demand, other companies adapt...

What happened? fy results from the company backed up my stance..



sikhthetech20 Nov '20 - 13:49 - 7156 of 8600 Edit

1gw,
H1 ended 30th Sept and so will include the period when they had 'record' sales (March-June) before the summer lull. The company now states orders are 'healthly', so no longer running at 'record' levels, ie lower level of sales.

The question is have sales increased again. Given other companies have adapted and have now entered the market, I don't think they will see anything like the levels at beginning of the pandemic.

H1 figures will be distorted by the one off spike in Q1, as evidenced by their statement re summer lull.

"I would not be surprised if they had been deliberately cautious given the then very recent news on vaccine success. "
Why would the vaccine make any difference, given your assertion that people have changed their attitude to cleaning forever?. The company is right to be cautious as a lot of the public are fed up and ignoring covid guidelines. Half of US (Trump followers) don't believe covid is a risk anyway.

As to Turtlewax, it's a trial, just like the Target trial, so no real financial benefit to Byot until results of the trial are known.



It's nice to have an investment decision proven right so conclusively by events. Read the company/sector newsflow.

[supernumerary] 16/9/2021 11:32

smt - the attack by stt is not worrying and is not 'competitor driven' - it's silly, and is driven by a personal dislike for 1gw. If you want a guild, start one.

[1gw] 16/9/2021 10:15

I don't remember coming across the TraffiGlove relationship before, but noticed the logo on the "Key Investment Case" slide. Presumably an old (but still current) and/or relatively minor deal, given its positioning on the slide below Rentokil Initial?

[1gw] 16/9/2021 10:09

SMT - what a choice of username for someone appearing to want to engage in serious debate about the company and its prospects!

We barely have enough interest in the company to have any discussion on a public bb, never mind a guild that provides an extra hurdle to participation. I try not to rise to the bait of stt's posts too often, but am happy to use them on occasion as a starting point for making a point about the business - such as how I think the company has successfully "grasped the opportunity" of the recent extraordinary environment by completing an impressive number of multi-year licence deals.

If you are really dismayed by the quality of posting on the bulletin board, perhaps you would like to contribute posts of an appropriate quality to raise the overall level?

[slapmytodger] 16/9/2021 09:45

I am amazed at the garbage written on this bb, it is pretty clear most are not investors or bothered to listen to the investor meet company presentation or brave enough to ask a question or phone/ email the ceo. The attack by stt is worrying and must be competitor driven yet intelligent contributors such as 1gw seem to want to waste time responding to his clueless postings. Ditto brownson.
Is it not time for a guild where we can have a proper debate. This is a v cheap company but not the easiest to understand. The share register includes some very smart investors who don’t like losing money and is normally a good starting point for discussion.

[the ghost who walks] 15/9/2021 17:31

Absolute nonsense.

[football] 15/9/2021 16:06

Micro did a lot of that money come from a 55p placing Tottally did and then started a share buy back at 15p while paying a divi from that placing



talk about robbimg shateholders to fill the borads pockets

[sikhthetech] 15/9/2021 15:44

And they raised £4.3m(before expenses) in 2017.... to build a marketing team and to build a stronger balance sheet.

Yet when it came to covid, where was all the marketing???


"It was apparent that the team was going to need more finance to invest in sales and marketing and to build a small team in the US to commercialise the newly-received EPA product registration. I also felt that we needed a stronger
balance sheet as it was clear that the team had to make short term decisions to generate immediate cash flow and margin. While this was necessary due to the Company’s financial position, a stronger balance sheet will enable the business to take the longer-term view and provide greater comfort to our customers and suppliers.
So, I was very pleased that post year end we were able to conditionally raise £4.3 million before expenses in new
equity capital from new and existing investors through a placement and subscription. An open offer is also available
to existing shareholders up to a maximum of £1.1 million."

[microscope] 15/9/2021 15:36

Football, changing the agenda really won't help you, but as you brought it up, I was discussing the cash position.Byotrol 2.8 million 2019, to a thin looking 1.6 million now.Totally March 2019, 7.5 million, now a healthy looking 14.8 million.Back to Byotrol, and I sympathize with the concerns you have expressed here. :)

[sikhthetech] 15/9/2021 14:56

Micro
"It really has become an IP play and if they are to fund significant expansion, I suspect they'll need to raise funds to achieve meaningful growth"

They've had declining cash for years, which was my concern last year.



sikhthetech - 15 May 2020 - 11:02:32 - 5955 of 8742 BYOTROL-CAN DELIVER AMAZING
If they had to increase manufacturing capacity then have they got the cash to do so?

With £1.7m cash, as of 31st March, I wonder if they will have a placing soon to help pay for increasing capacity?

Cash balances have been declining for years..
Cash:
fy2018 £3.85m
fy2019 £2.8m
H12020 £2.01m
fy2020 £1.7m (expectation was £2.6m)


sikhthetech - 09 Feb 2020 - 16:41:45 - 4253 of 8742 BYOTROL-CAN DELIVER AMAZING
<...>
Obviously they will gain some additional cash from the spike resulting from the Coronavirus but how far will that go... and will it be enough to prevent another placing?

Company's

Weak cash position:
"At the year-end we had cash resources of £2.8m (2018: £3.85m) which is sufficient to finance our ongoing operations and the remaining earnout payments to Medimark's vendors but not to fund additional resources, capabilities and nationwide marketing expenditure in the US."


<...>

[football] 15/9/2021 14:49

Byotrol £22k a week profit on £11.1m

Tottally £1k a week profit on £113m

[microscope] 15/9/2021 14:48

On a less theoretical (but rather more practical) level, while I mentioned the relative strength of the balance sheet compared to previous years, nevertheless I've been taking a look at the cash position, which looks less than impressive.

3.85 million in 2018, 2.8 million the following year (which was a key reason given for not expanding in the US).

1.4 million cash in 2020, before a minor improvement to 1.6 million in 2021 (and guaranteed minimum IP of 1.6 million for next year, v 1.3 million).

Expansion in the US would have meant funding requirements, at the company's own admission, and while that is more expensive than elsewhere, nevertheless if 2.8 million was inadequate, how much 1.6 million will allow closer to home must be highly debatable.

It really has become an IP play and if they are to fund significant expansion, (mainly by growing profit via those IP deals, and/or landing new ones), I suspect they'll need to raise funds to achieve meaningful growth, at a time when money is tight in the wider economy, and their own supply chain less than smooth.

Also the chart is imho at a vital support level which needs to hold.

[sikhthetech] 15/9/2021 14:43

1gw
"I think we may find that by focusing on completing multi-year licensing agreements during the pandemic they have indeed grasped the opportunity"

Really...

It's jam tomorrow.


What happened to all the opportunities they grasped after SWINE flu A DECADE AGO???


BoD have been saying similar for years.

The comments below were made A DECADE AGO, when Swine flu was supposedly be the catalyst for future growth...so nothing new.

The fact is these were pumped based on Boots being one of the retailers who sells Byot based products.
And Boots is a national retailer so would get PIs interested.


"The significant increase in sales is in part due to the concern regarding swine flu; however it can also be attributed to a greater appreciation of the qualities, efficacy and broad applications of Byotrol. "

"We remain confident of the prospects for Byotrol "

Distributors & Parners
" Healthcare through our relationship with Synergy Health plc in Europe and through distributors in the US
* Food and beverage, both through distributors and direct sales
* Consumer products through our joint venture, Byotrol Consumer Products Ltd. "

[1gw] 15/9/2021 14:23

I think we may find that by focusing on completing multi-year licensing agreements during the pandemic they have indeed grasped the opportunity. Just as a reminder:

FY20
Tristel - 3 products - announced March 2020
Advanced Hygienics (extension) - not announced until prelims in Sept 2020

FY21
Integrated Resources - Americas (byotrol24) - announced May 2020
SCJ Professional - announced May 2020
Turtle Wax Europe - announced April 2021
Byoworks - sub-Saharan Africa - announced April 2021
Soltech - Middle East - announced April 2021

So 6 multi-year license agreements (and possibly 7, depending on when the Advanced Hygienics deal was done) completed after the pandemic began. I think it would be reasonable to assume that by doing this byotrol will have managed to lock in more attractive terms than had they done them before the pandemic. The rewards from these agreements will not be evident until the end of the terms, as only then will it become clear how much royalty each has generated and how valuable a renewal or re-tender then is.

In addition, Solvay appear to have grasped the opportunity by accelerating their work on Actizone.

All these things play out over many years. I would suggest that the ultimate rewards from this concentration of effort on securing new multi-year licence deals may well be far in excess than could have been achieved by trying to capture more of the short-term very high demand during the early stages of the pandemic.

[sikhthetech] 15/9/2021 13:38

1gw
"In a few years"

Yes, as I said jam tomorrow... In a few years other companies will again adapt to what is in demand...


They were presented with the perfect opportunity and failed to grasp it... Maybe they will 'in a few years'...

Oh wait, they had a similar opportunity a few years ago (decade ago) with Swine flu... what happened???