Antonov Share Discussion Threads

[waldron] 13/9/2005 10:28

cheers crystal


Sun just came out

[crystalclear] 13/9/2005 10:23

Antonov have budgeted revenues from sale of these units and support engineering to be in excess of Euro2m in 2006, the first full year of production.

Interesting that support is a source of revenue rather than a potential liability. For most companies, if there are teething problems with their products, they have to foot the bill rather than somebody paying them to sort it out.

To me, that is a veiled indication that an OEM is using the tuner and aftermarket as a way of getting end-user feedback on the product - field testing it in other words - and that plans are underway (with the OEM not just hopes at Antonov) to roll it out in a vehicle at a later date.

Enjoy your weekend. ;-)

[crystalclear] 09/9/2005 12:55

4,000 is peanuts in volume.

However, are Antonov the tier-1 for this, subcontracting production to NZWL? I think so.
The normal situation would be NZWL as tier-1, licencing patents from Antonov. The difference is that Antonov would handle the sales to the OEMs, (GM's subsidiary Wheel-to-wheel in this case) and take the bulk of the profits.

If aftermarket supercharger kits are over 1000 dollars and GM picks up the main bit, the supercharger, from Antonov for a few hundred dollars or less, there is still room for a tidy profit for Antonov themselves, although they won't pay their running costs with 4,000 superchargers.

[waldron] 09/9/2005 10:47

Antonov selects Neue ZWL as manufacturing partner

LONDON (AFX) - Antonov PLC said it has selected Neue ZWL Zahnradwerk as its
production supply partner to manufacture the Antonov Mechanical Module
supercharger drive.
This follows the announcement in May of the launch of the product into the
US tuner market prior to Antonov's ultimate objective of introducing it into the
mainstream automotive market.
Antonov said pilot production work is underway to enable final sign-off of
the product and deliveries to US distributors will start in October.

[e-mail]
slm/

[mikehardman] 09/9/2005 08:38

slow to get into gear this morning...

[grupo guitarlumber] 01/9/2005 14:50

enjoy your weekend crystal

[crystalclear] 01/9/2005 13:59

I noticed the postings and took a look at the share price. Last time I dipped a toe into the water was at 115p I think. From 100p back to 115p would be a 15% rise. With a CFD and 1/4 of the money needing to be provided up front, that is equivalent to a 60% increase. Since I expect the commericalization of the Rotrex supercharger compressor to be announced at the Frankfurt motor show - only a week or two away - I and a return to that sort of level is certainly realistic, I guess that's not bad. The drop is after all on no news, whereas the start of sales of the compressors will be news to some.

Logically, a rise on news ought to exceed a fall on no news, but the market has a habit of not being logical.

Also, if SAIC want to make their Rover 25s and 75s with a gearbox in them, then some time or other an agreement needs to be made. The world's biggest motorshow would be a good time to do it; but that is low probability and speculation on my part.

=

Dyson.

Turbo chargers sort of run for free - they are driven by heat and velcoity in the exhaust gases. But they suffer so called turbo lag. The addition of an electric motor under software control could help sort that out and make more efficient motor cars.

The article mixes that idea with the idea of starter motors. I don't know much about motors, but know that some sort of switching is usually required to energize different coils depending on the relative position of coils and magnets or coils and other coils. Putting that under the control of some electronics with position sensing and optimizing timing just sound like the right thing to do rather than having brushes and contacts etc controlling it.
I assume that is what is meant by digital motors. It sound good.

=

At low RPM turbos don't produce much power. High altitude makes things worse. Going uphill makes thing even worse than that. Park facing uphill at altitude with a turb car, and the engine might not be able to make enough power to get away from IDLE and into its power band. I know that sounds stupid, but I believe its true. You can have a powerful engine (say 100HP at 4000 RPM) and yet not have the power to get it anywhere near 4000 RPM!

That is the problem that the two speed supercharger from Antonov aims to solve. At low engine RPM it steps up a gear, provides more boost, and the engine can get going. This is also what the Dyson is presumably trying to do. Turbos are fine at high RPM. In fact they have a waste gate so that pressure don't get too high. But they struggle to provide pressure at low RPM.

That makes Dyson and Antonov effectively rivals.
I say that for fun however. There is room in the market for many players and the investors that think a product is going to be a killer application often get burnt I believe, although there are Dysons and Microsofts out there. I rather assume Antonov will get several hundred thousand SAIC transmissions and some Honda Integrated Motor Assist (IMA), and a bit of supercharging and pulley work; and also come out with a reasonable hybrid design as the maket for them starts to take off.

[grupo guitarlumber] 01/9/2005 12:47

money matters and every days a weekend.

and its only thursday

[ariane] 01/9/2005 12:40

item off topic and its the silly season anyways.


Dyson targets car industry
This is Money
1 September 2005
INVENTOR James Dyson is hoping to take the success he enjoyed with his bagless vacuum cleaner to the car industry.

The entrepreneur plans to use the motors from his vacuum cleaners to power fans and starter motors in cars.


The Malmesbury-based inventor will hope he can repeat his clean-up of the vacuum market with the Dyson Digital Motor, which is contained in his DC12 cleaner.


There are no plans for brightly coloured plastic cars to hit the roads just yet - although Dyson refused to rule out a possibility of a Dyson car.


'I wouldn't like to say no, but we have lots of other plans at the moment,' he told the Financial Times.


He added: 'The digital motor has been talked about a lot in the industry, with few results, but we have done it. It will lead us into new products and it could lead to us being motor manufacturers.'


The firm's digital motor features turbo-charger compressor technology and with more than 100,000 revolutions per minute, it operates five times faster than a Formula 1 engine.


The lack of carbon brushes in the motor also make it more reliable, durable and lighter than conventional electric motors.


Dyson, who spent 10 years working on the motor, said he had fielded enquiries from one car company and three aerospace companies.

[crystalclear] 04/8/2005 23:20

Issue of Equity

RNS Number:7549P
Antonov PLC
04 August 2005



Antonov plc (the "Company")

Issue of Equity

The Company announces that at a board meeting held on 26 July 2005, 216,930
ordinary shares of 20p each were allotted at a price of Euro1.5732 each under the
terms of an existing facility arrangement dated 21 January 2005. Application
will be made at the earliest practicable opportunity for admission of the new
ordinary shares to trading on the Alternative Investment Market of the London
Stock Exchange.

The enlarged issued share capital of the Company now consists of 28,749,794
ordinary shares of 20p each.


For further information, please contact:

David Bovell, Finance Director Tel: [phone]
Antonov plc

Richard Evans Tel: [phone]
Brewin Dolphin Securities Ltd.




(only available when I'm logged on!)
According to my little tool, that's 341,274 euros.
At 4,000,000 euros per year cashburn, that ought to just see them through for a month or maybe until the Frankfurt motorshow.

[crystalclear] 02/8/2005 03:07

Shanghai Automotive will invest 3.7 billion yuan (USD460 million) to set up a factory to make its own Rover-based cars and SUVs using Ssangyong designs beginning in 2007.

SAIC recently lost out to Nanjing Automobile in the bidding process for collapsed British carmaker MG Roverb but it owns the rights to build the Rover 25 small car and Rover 75 sedan under an deal sealed in October 2004.
Capacity at the new facility would be expanded to 120,000 units by 2009. The cars would be the first to carry the Shanghai Auto brand. In the passenger car sector the company has so far built vehicles in partnership with GM and VW.



Sunday Express

Nanjing Auto's successful bid for MG Rover was thrown into fresh turmoil as it emerged that two of the Pheonix Four businessmen who made millions out of the collapsed car marker had joined Nanjing's UK management team.

[crystalclear] 01/8/2005 16:25

...
Sources close to SAIC said last week: 'We are going to be making (Rover) 75s in China early in 2006. We will have cars in production in China by then, and we believe that will be well before Nanjing.'
...

[shirishg] 31/7/2005 04:22

Post removed by ADVFN

[crystalclear] 31/7/2005 00:18

2006 Honda Civic rumoured by some to be a 6AT, by others to be an automated manual, and some talk of a CVT; so its anybodies guess, but unlikely to a completely Antonov design, as the old designs are dated and Honda don't have a licence for the newer designs.

[crystalclear] 29/7/2005 13:07

Sorry,
You too. (Nice weekend!)
Do you lot live in some sort of commune, or is it just for money matters that you get together?

Link to patents which refer to Antonov's IP.

[crystalclear] 29/7/2005 13:05

Grupo
Whenever you comment there is always a weekend coming.
Do you only work Fridays?

There is stuff on the interent about SAIC's plans for Ssangyong in Yizheng.
I'll try to add more about this if I can find out something.
The potential is that Chinese made Ssangyong SUVs will start to use SAIC's K-series engines from MG Rover engine designs and may ultimately be mated to Antonov's DCA (a dual clutch Antonov transmission designed for the Rover 75).

It seems Nanjing plan 280,000 Rover 45 replacements - 80,000 made in the UK. Nanjing own Powertrain Limited who were doing the Antonov transmissions for the Rover 25 and 75 - importantly from a time shortly AFTER these designs were handed over to SAIC. It is therefore possible that Nanjing will use the Antonov transmissions too.

You might think that is idle speculation, but the press notes that Nanjing had been planning this for two years, and Nanjing already had plans to partner SAIC in the Chinese production of Rovers, even before MG Rover drowned.

[crystalclear] 29/7/2005 09:44

SAIC announces launch of JV
By Li Fangfang (China Daily)
Updated: 2005-07-29 06:16


Shanghai Automotive Industry Corporation (SAIC Group), one of China's biggest vehicle producers, and Shanghai Automotive Co Ltd (Shanghai Automotive) announced yesterday they would set up a joint venture with provisional name SAIC Luwei Co Ltd in Shanghai.

SAIC Group will control 60 per cent of the JV with a 768 million-yuan (US$94.70 million) investment and 60 per cent of its total registered capital of 1.28 billion yuan (US$157.83 million), according to the firm.

Shanghai Automotive will take the remaining shares by providing 521 million yuan (US$63.13 million) in capital formed by cash, land and facilities from its factory in Yizheng, East China's Jiangsu Province.

Total investment will hit 3.68 billion yuan (US$453.76 million) with a 3.401 billion yuan (US$419.36 million) fixed investment and 279 million yuan (US$34.40 million) in bottom-line cash flow.

The JV is expected to develop its business on the research and development (R&D), production and sale of vehicles, engines and spare parts. SAIC Group said by 2009 the JV's vehicle output will stand at 120,000 per year, without revealing what type of vehicles it would produce. The volume of engines is expected to hit 170,000 annually by 2010.

To develop its global strategy, the development of an innovative brand has always been the key target of SAIC Group, according to the company. Using the technology of Ssangyong and MG Rover, SAIC Group hopes the JV will manufacture its own vehicles to make the group more competitive internationally.

SAIC Group owns the intellectual property rights to the technology of Ssangyong and MG Rover after acquisitions last October and this April.

Zhang Xin, an analyst with Guotai & Jun'an Securities Co Ltd, said: "It is my belief the setting up of the JV is to rescue the failing factory in Yizheng. "But it's also an opportunity for SAIC Group to develop its own brand."

Song Bingshen, an analyst with China Securities Co Ltd, told China Daily that SAIC Group's factory in Yizheng had losses of 100 million yuan (US$12.33 million) last year.

"But I think SAIC Group is thinking more about its branding. As China's second-biggest automaker, SAIC Group needs an innovative brand to face the fierce global competition," said Song.

Both analysts expected the JV to come up against difficulties due to hot competition in the auto market, especially the passenger car market, which is largely occupied by world leading automakers.

"If the JV manufactures passenger cars, it will bring unnecessary competition to Buick, Passat and so on, which are also brands of SAIC Group," said Zhang.

Song said: "With a name like Luwei, which sounds like an MPV (mini passenger vans), and the MPV advantages of Ssangyong, I expect the JV to produce MPVs."

The analysts suggested the newly formed JV develop its business on commercial vehicles, rather than passenger cars.