Vividas Share Discussion Threads

[the_pimp] 01/4/2007 14:08

llr,

It comes down to being convert a product into revenue, achieving breakeven and market share as rapidly as possible. VDS revenue growth has not been as speedy as they would have liked - put back by the delays with the adult partner however anticipate b/e is now at the end of the year and they are fully financed to that point.Even each of those little Sony Trailers is something like $15-20k each and is about 30 minutes work. Not bad money if you can get it although they intend to change the model to viewing minutes with a full marketing campaign.

Some companies have the best technology but fail to generate any revenue.

P

[lofty] 01/4/2007 12:43

llr



Looked at this site. Size matters, as they say. Just about 1/12th screen size.

Front page excellent. Looked at the ITV site. Sound excellent.Vision a little fuzzy even at this small size.

Nothing yet to match Vividas but will keep looking. Sometimes it pays to back
the opposition also.

[lofty] 01/4/2007 12:16

llr

Poster on your first link. re Nuba:

I have just tried that link - but i found it problematic - when i tried to watch a trailer - it said i had to be a registered user. I registered and then it said i have to install a player. I dont have administrator rights on my computer and so cant install this player. I think thats the big point of vividas - you dont need to install anything to watch their stuff!

Nuff sed.

Add: 2nd link does not work.

[littleredrooster] 01/4/2007 04:13

What happened to NubaTV? If superior technology can't survive, VDS will stand little chance?

[littleredrooster] 01/4/2007 03:17

'Vividas also gets a performance boost by partnering with Akamai (www.akamai.com) for hosting the content'

Well, so can any other streaming company. That's what I've been saying. VDS's codec is not proprietary and neither is its distribution network.



"I'm also a new fan of NubaTV ( which also broadcasts over the Net but with a better quality than Vividas. They are beta testing HD files over the Internet at the moment."

"On my PC with DSL Vividas is buffering a lot, NubaTV is fine. On the quality NubaTV beats Vividas. Tried with cable connection and NubaTV becomes the best quality streaming ever (HD quality)."



"To be fair, I recently saw another streaming video solution from Narrowstep (www.narrowstep.com) that matches the quality of Vividas. They too can deliver full-screen, high-quality streaming video over the Internet. I'll be following up with an article about their approach in the near future."

[the_pimp] 31/3/2007 12:28

Would really like to see the "live" product at work as that is the area that imo could be very high margin business.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 12:20

I think Elephant Dream may have been the first HD-DVD movie at 1920x1080



"The next generation of DVD formats are on their way, and one of them is HD DVD, supporting HD 1920×1080 video, high quality surround sound, and many advanced interactive features"


One of the future aims for Vividas may be to support some of the 'advanced interactive features' that a common place in DVD into their technology.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 12:18

I think it depends on what they term HD, The Pimp. At the moment, 1280 × 720 seems to be the accepted standard. Higher resolutions are now also coming out with the likes of Blu-ray's 1920x1080.

Interesting to compare file sizes for a 4 minute clip on the H.264 Video / AAC Audio codecs on the Apple site:

File size: 83.3 MB
Resolution: 852x480

File size: 215.1 MB
Resolution: 1280x720

File size: 277.6 MB
Resolution: 1920x1080

[the_pimp] 31/3/2007 12:08

The Analyst - VDS can already do HD. Think they achieved it last summer sometime but look back at the rns's.



The transformers trailer was available in HD.



Lofty- nothing wrong with your pooter. The trailer was encoded that way. Don't know why as the full screen effect is better.

The just need to start generating proper revenue from it all.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 12:03

Vividas can work with other codecs too. Not having to rely on any one codec is certainly another good feature of their technology.



"The Technology
So how does it work? It's remarkably simple really. They invented a better player. Essentially video files are encoded using On2's (www.on2.com) VP 6 compression algorithms (although Vividas can work with other codecs as well). The Vividas player is then embedded at the beginning of the file. When a user wants to play a video a small bit of java script code detects the user's computer configuration and determines the best player applet to use. The player applet is then downloaded to their browser's cache. Since the player is only about 260K it downloads very quickly. The trick is that unlike other players where all the decompression and playback is handled by the user's CPU the Vividas player splits the tasks between the CPU and the user's graphic card. When the user is finished watching the video all traces of the player are removed from their system.

Vividas also gets a performance boost by partnering with Akamai (www.akamai.com) for hosting the content (although it is not an exclusive agreement so they can work with other providers as well). When a site gets a request to play a video that request gets passed to Akamai. The Akamai system locates the correct content that is stored on multiple servers around the world. It figures out which server would deliver the content most efficiently to that particular user and then begins the download.

Apart from the quality there are a few other advantages to the Vividas approach. First, since the player is downloaded with the video and erased from the user's system when the video has finished playing it will be very difficult to reverse-engineer the player and pirate the videos. Another advantage is that Vividas can track each and every download and that highly accurate statistical information can be provided to their customers as well as used for billing.

Currently Vividas does all the encoding for clients but that really isn't the business that they want to be in so they are releasing a 'black box' encoding system called the Vivcast Encoding Suite that clients or independent service bureaus can use to do their own encoding. Customers who need to encode a lot of video or need to keep everything in-house can rent the Vivicast on a monthly basis and pay a small pay-per-view fee for each file."

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 11:59

On the quality front the ultimate goal for any video streaming company is to get to a resolution of 1920x1080, without any buffering and playing using an everyday broadband connection.

In a year or so, an everyday broadband connection in the UK will be 4mb, although in many countries that is already the average and 16-24mb is offered as standard (depending on distance from an exchange).

I wonder how long before that type of HD quality will be streamed and whether it will be vividas that does it first? Only time will tell I guess.

[lofty] 31/3/2007 11:58

the_pimp

As far as I know, my pooter has all the bells and whistles. The Bill Gates
lecture is absolute full screen and excellent quality.
Yet, running your address just above, 471 it does not fill the screen.
What if anything am I doing wrong? Full width with about 60% height in the middle. PLease.

the analyst

Did it yesterday. Unfortunately something had to go.

[the_pimp] 31/3/2007 11:56

This article sums up VDS's technology position quite well. They use On2 codec as do a lot of other companies but it's the delivery and the patents around it that is the real value in VDS



On the On2(ont) chat rooms they are very complimentary about vds.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 11:48

Lots of comments on this board, positive and negative going back some time.





" Rasheed187
#38 · 2006-02-11 11:55:35 AM
Frequent Poster
Group: Gold Member
Posts: 2011
Joined: 2004-07-08
From: The Netherlands
Member No.: 867
Is it just me or does online video still sucks? I´m really not impressed by the new flv (Flash video 8) format, Vividas performs a lot better, strange because both seem to be using the On2 codec. I really think it´s a shame that we´re living in 2006 and we still have to do deal with inferiour video technology, is it perhaps a business thing? I mean I can imagine that the big players do not want to loose their market share, but why not just buy Vividas? "

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 11:46

"Still noone out there at the moment IMO"

I agree, but as we've said before, it's just a matter of time before others offer the same. Until then, it's a race to get as many deals set up as possible.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 11:31

Had seen the on2 technology stuff before, but not the 'partner' link between Apple, BBC and On2. All Apple and BBC need now is some technology to make the On2 codec actually work. Vividas patented technology would do that.

Starting to convince me to buy more shares, although I probably hold enough already.

[stegrego] 31/3/2007 11:06

Have checked out the On2 website and sample videos and have to say they are p!ss poor - especially when compared to VDS - Even their own player software still does rubbish job in full screen and the rest of the players are in very small windows.

Still noone out there at the moment IMO

[the_pimp] 31/3/2007 09:21

Haven't seen this link before:

[littleredrooster] 31/3/2007 07:03

Published: 25 Jul 2005 Updated: 14 Aug 2005

Interview with Doug McIntyre from On2 Technologies

Interview by David Vogeleer

Last week, FlashMagazine had a chance to talk to Doug McIntyre, CEO of On2 Technologies and ask him a few questions about the new video codec being used by Flash and what he feels is the future of video on the web.

It's no secret that Macromedia wants Flash Video (FLV) to be the next big thing. And with more and more people getting fed up with the video experience on the web, Flash may have found a niche in the video world with its good quality, small file size and a player that is the most downloaded piece of software on the Internet.

And while demos of the new Flash player are being shown by Macromedia at different conferences all over the world, many people are wondering where this new video codec has come from. On2 Technologies with its VP6.2 codec is the answer.

What made Macromedia come to On2?
My understanding is that they took a very broad look at the codecs available with video quality as the most important market. They came to us the middle of last year. After some testing, we negotiated terms and they began their integration. If the video quality had not been considered best of breed, I don't think we would have ever been contacted.

Why should people consider Flash video as a serious contender for video on the web?
The first thing is the Flash platform. It is miles ahead of Java, Real or Windows Media in PC penetration at 98% worldwide. Even with the old H.263 codec in Flash 7, the video is being used by Amazon, ESPN, CBS, The Washington Post and a host of other major content sites. It has also replaced Java as the player of choice for online video advertising, and has close to 100% share there.

Now the video is improving by a very wide margin. The quality of the picture at data rate is better than Windows Media, Real or QuickTime. You don't need one format for PC and one for Mac. You now have one platform that gets you all of the Internet viewers, with the best video in the world and you don't have to pull up Windows Media for one clip and QuickTime for another.

In addition, it is a much better experience for the end user. People using broadband now are no longer early adopters. We have a lot of people on line who just want the Internet to work without having to acquire a lot of technical knowledge to use it. Flash video is easy to use. Other formats require much more messing around by the end user.

What is the difference between the video codec included in Flash 7 and the new codec for Flash 8?
The old H.283 codec was good in its day, but that is three or four years ago. The industry is seeing video compression improvements every year. VP6 is state of the art. It really is like the difference between driving a 2006 model car and a car from the 1970s. The differences in performance and features are that great.

Will users be able to utilize the new video codec, VP6.2, without having to purchase Flash?
On2 does have its own VP6.2 encoder that works with the On2 player and server. For people who want to encode in VP6.2 for Flash but do not have Macromedia tools, we sell VP6.2 Flash encoders through our Flix encoder line and we are setting dozens of channel partners to sell video encoders for the new Flash. We have already announced a deal with Autodesk and there will be many more of these. We want the Flash encoder with VP6.2 to be universally available.

What is the size/quality difference between video produced in VP6.2 and the video most people see on the web today?
It is much better than current Flash video, and, depending on data rate, probably 10% to 20% better than Windows Media 9. In the majority of cases, people on the web will be able to tell the difference.

Who is already using VP6 or VP7 to put video on the web? Who is planning on using it?
VP6 and VP7 are being used by companies like AOL for their media player and the Win amp player. That is a very broad distribution. VP7 was just licensed by Viewpoint, which has 120 million players and a PC penetration of about 60% of the market. We will be announcing several two-way live video VOIP alliances soon with major VOIP and instant messaging providers. VP7 is an excellent codec for this.

How far back can the VP6.2 codec go as far as the Flash Player is concerned?
The encoder will be backwards compatible to older players with H.263, but to get the new video quality, you will have to have the new Flash player.

Does the new video codec support meta-data?
Yes. At least the Flash 8 version.

Who will be able to use this new codec to produce Flash video?
We are making the SDK to create encoders available to virtually any encoding company that wants it. I think you will see dozens of encoder applications supporting the new Flash video. Companies and individual like to use certain encoding interfaces because of their unique features. We need to make sure that all of these support the new Flash video encoder.

How will the impending Adobe Macromedia deal fit in with/affect how you see video in the Flash player moving forward?
I can only speculate that Flash and video are part of the reason Adobe did this deal. If Adobe wants to compete with Microsoft across a broad spectrum of software, they have to have these ubiquitous tools, and now they have them.

Doug, thank you so much for your time in answering a lot of questions people have been curious about.

Related reads: The quest for a new video codec in Flash 8

[littleredrooster] 31/3/2007 06:46

Apple Computer, Inc.

[littleredrooster] 31/3/2007 06:39

About On2 Technologies

On2 Technologies (AMEX:ONT) is the premier developer of video compression technology for Flash, Internet, VOIP, video-on-demand, and wireless applications.

On2 Technologies has been a leading provider of video compression software since 1992, offering unrivaled image quality at low data rates. Our technology is completely proprietary and not reliant on so-called "standards"; this enables us to rapidly improve our products while still offering the most competitive pricing and licensing terms in the industry.

On2 Video is Everywhere
If you've used the video features in Adobe Flash, Skype 2, AOL AIM Triton, Vividas player, Viewpoint Media Player, or Tencent Messenger/QQ, you've already seen On2 video--because all of these popular applications are powered by On2 video. If you haven't used these amazing products, download one today and see for yourself how On2 is revolutionizing Internet video.

Who Uses On2 Video?
On2 video codecs are used in the user-generated content/Web 2.0, Instant messaging & videoconferencing, Internet advertising, surveillance, satellite, home entertainment, and video-on-deman markets. On2's software is used by such leading companies as Adobe, Skype, AOL, Brightcove, Vividas, Viewpoint, Muvee, Pointroll, Sony, XM Satellite Radio, BBC, ABC News, iFilm, and SeaChange International. For a complete list, see our Clients & Partners page.

On2 also licenses its software for use in set-top boxes, consumer electronics devices and wireless/mobile applications and offers high-level video encoding, customized technical support, and consulting/integration services.

Finally, our VP3 codec, which we donated to the public as open-source software in 2001, is the basis of the popular Ogg Theora video project.


For more information, see the following:

Why choose On2 Video?


Why compress video?


On2 TrueMotion VP7

On2 TrueMotion VP6 for Flash

On2 video vs. H.264 & MPEG-4

On2 is a World-Class Company
In addition to our core business, we are an engineering company that can serve as an expert resource for all of your video application needs. We offer a variety of solutions for enterprise customers and developers as well as consumer-oriented video compression software.

As the world's premier codec developer, On2 creates advanced full-motion, full-screen video compression technology that has revolutionized the industry. With our TrueMotion VPx family of codecs, broadcast quality video (DVD) can be compressed at 600 kilobits (.073 megabytes) per second or less, drastically reducing the cost of streaming video over IP networks.

For more information about On2, see our Investor Presentation (PDF).

Setting the Standard...
On2 has been developing digital media technology since 1992, and we have authored over a dozen patents. We were not satisfied with merely being better than the competition, so in March of 2005 we released the TrueMotion VP7 codec once again raising the standard in video compression. VP7 demonstrates marked improvements in quality and performance up to 50% over VP6. In short, no other codecs on the market can match On2's in image quality or decoding speed.

...While Adding Value
On2 also develops other products to further serve our clients. Our Audio for Video Codec (AVC) works seamlessly with our VPx video codecs to provide a full-service content encoding solution. TrueCast 8, our RTSP-compliant client/server suite, completes the picture, creating a family of products that make low datarate video-on-demand a viable opportunity for the cable, set-top, and Internet industries for the first time.

For those professionals who demand the highest performance encoding hardware, our Professional Encoding Station product combines power and flexibility with remarkable ease-of-use.

In addition to developing and marketing our own products, we license our technology to and develop solutions for other leading-edge digital multimedia vendors. For more information, see our Clients & Partners page.

Engineering Services
On2 also offers in-house video encoding, remastering, and training services. We can deliver encoded video that is similar in quality to that produced by DVD encoding or post-production color correction facilities.

We're Open
When we released our VP3 compression technology into the open-source community in late 2001, it quickly became the world's most efficient open source video codec. With no platform limitations or restrictive license fees, VP3 is a truly common format that is open, well-documented, and free. VP3 gives consumers the quality they demand in the environment they choose, with VP3-based plug-ins for other media formats, such as Apple's QuickTime and RealNetwork's RealPlayer.

[littleredrooster] 31/3/2007 06:17

The basic VDS codec will seemingly soon be available for Flash. Flash 9? Why use VDS technology when the On2 Codec SDKs will be available to anyone to include directly in applications? Similarly, VDS's distribution network can probably easily be reproduced by other companies. I would presume that VDS doesn't own its own network but instead rents capacity on someone else's.

"VP7 has higher compression has not been released for flash yet but is used with vividas java based streaming"



On2 VP6 is an advanced proprietary video compression technology.

On2 VP6 is the video compression technology that Macromedia/Adobe licensed for its Flash 8 family of products.

On2 VP6 is among the best video codecs on the market today, surpassed only by our On2 VP7 codec. It offers better image quality and faster decoding performance than Windows Media 9, Real 9, H.264, and QuickTime MPEG-4.



Truemotion Codec SDKs

All of our codec SDKS are easy to program, offer video quality and compression ratios that exceed H.264, MPEG4, and Windows Media, and come backed by our world-class developer support services.

On2 Codec SDKs

Our codec SDKs enable you to build On2's revolutionary video and audio codecs directly into your applications! The codec SDKs are provided in a "low level" library form so that you can encode and decode video frames embedded your application with complete control and minimum overhead. The VP7 Codec SDKs are the lowest level building block for VP7 applications. Now available for Macintosh!

On2 VP7 VFW Codec

The On2 VP7 VFW SDK enables you to quickly and flexibly build On2 codec support into your applications using the popular Microsoft Video for Windows (VFW) interface. The VFW solution is not as fully featured as the Encoder SDK (see below) but is easy to use and is fully compatible with VFW-compliant video processing utilities like Adobe Premiere, VirtualDub, Cleaner, and others. The VFW Codec SDK also gives you access to the VP7 DirectShow Playback filter.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 00:20

The Pimp, cheers for that link. It's excellent progress as I wasn't expecting that development so soon.

[the analyst] 31/3/2007 00:16

"I can't see why the company would wish to use VDS streaming"

No, you wouldn't Holly. lol! ;)

Apple may be thinking there could be advantages in having a system that could stream movies that are of similar quality to DVD in full screen, rather than stick with a window the size of a matchbox that keeps stopping to buffer. After all, the Apple TV is aimed at putting video onto a full sized television for viewing. Hence, quality needs to be good.

Apple need to seriously improve quicktime to be able to use it to stream onto a tv from what I've seen. Owning a codec and player is one thing, but if it doesn't fit the need, then there is a problem for them.

Vividas works in near-HD at a full 30fps with only a 700kb connection

[littleredrooster] 30/3/2007 20:31

"I don't know Apple TV will work with Vividas streaming, but if it does, then I wonder if Apple will be looking at Vividas to provide the technology?"

Apple already has its QuickTime codec and player. I can't see why the company would wish to use VDS streaming. Maybe one should look at the video iPod.

'3: Is there any benefit in bandwidth to flash streaming as opposed to using a QTSS?

flash uses sorenson spark or on2 VP6 video codec VP7 has higher compression has not been released for flash yet but is used with vividas java based streaming

Quicktime has more codec options like h.264 which has high compression algorithm'