Provident Financial Share Discussion Threads

[superiorshares] 10/5/2020 20:26

Icutandrun. My friend :-)
Thankyou for your informed posts.
I am deep in my research at the moment with these home credit companies. Might be worth buying a basket of them in due course.
One thing I am wondering about.
When things start to move again. We will still be knee deep in Corona in fact it will probably be rising towards our midriff in another couple of months.
Do yo think these companies Will have any staffing issues ?. I don't know how lucrative it is to be an agent, but I would imagine it's going to involve a lot of M.O properties , flats etc, plus it will be all cash. It's Corona heaven !. Could be a problem getting people to stick with it ?.

[1cutandrun] 07/5/2020 17:50

Sorry, don't know why that pasted like that. should be Https

[1cutandrun] 07/5/2020 17:46

Someone sent me this. hxxps://tenor.com/view/donald-duck-donald-donald-trump-skirrell-trump-gif-13564386.

[1cutandrun] 07/5/2020 17:27

The Chinese don't know how to handle him. They think he is quackers :-)

[seagreen] 07/5/2020 15:25

Be interesting if Donald Duck having upset the Chinese makes up with them over weekend and says they are back on course and they have accepted a degree of acceptance the covid started there.....would not find 100/1 on monday lol.......but senior Goofy's are going to have talks very soon...might jolly up the feel good factor...



Financials may have their day in the sun *-)

[1cutandrun] 07/5/2020 13:11

PFG shares are a good buy long term but most are. I only trade short term with max holding of 2 stocks at any one time. I have gone back in with Barclays as there's still a lot of headroom. I'm keeping an eye on NSF. Do you buy in before the annual report or not, that is the big question. My gut feeling is yes, but why did they take the option to delay it. Is that a good or bad sign? Most of the banks and finance companies who have had poor reports, their shares have gone up on the day. No release date for the report yet and still shows as Mid-May.

[jimbobs147] 07/5/2020 01:00

Not tempted to get back in at sub £2?

[fenners66] 07/5/2020 00:23

I thought their other consideration was bringing in risk management for the individual client loans and making that follow "procedure" in house.

The climate of massively fining the loan companies for extending credit to customers who could not afford it , worried the management as they saw mis-selling as a major risk ?

Not in any way trying to defend their useless approach , just a consideration as to why they were so reckless.

I bought at about £7 and sold at £21 - too early but thankfully early enough !

[1cutandrun] 07/5/2020 00:06

Yes, and everyone at the grassroots knew it was going to be a disaster. I said they should have rolled it out gradually, but what I forget, was the agents had their own chat webpage, and the news would have soon been out, that most of them were going to lose their jobs. Agents would have started leaving and that's another ramification, who would cover for these agents? I expect that's why the company didn't do the obvious. Logistically this change over was never going to be easy. To roll this out gradually and minimise the hit (revenue/arrears), would have probably taken two years, but this could have been controlled. To keep the agents happy and try to stop them leaving over this period of time, the company could have offered them a retainer and paid compensation. It would have cost a lot, but nothing compared to what happened. One nightmare scenario.

[jimbobs147] 06/5/2020 22:22

Are you here all week?

[meijiman] 06/5/2020 20:33

Maybe a crook was in charge of this debacle?

[dexdringle] 06/5/2020 20:22

To simplify further then...

New management roll out catastrophic strategic change which goes horribly wrong. Top men resign in disgrace. Another bloke also considered significantly responsible is sacked. Tribunal finds that he was indeed significantly responsible and that his sacking was legitimate.

Question though. How could they have thought the roll out of the new structure could possibly work? It is difficult to believe that no one considerdd the negative possibilities? I mean, I can see that wouldn't work and I know very little about it.

[dexdringle] 04/5/2020 20:22

..any chance of you doing a very high level summary please ?

Thanks

[1cutandrun] 04/5/2020 19:00

For anyone who has an interest in PFG. This is a detailed account of what went terribly wrong and why the shares crashed. This should never have happened and why heads rolled.

[smurfy2001] 04/5/2020 18:56

Thanks 1cutandrun very helpful.

[1cutandrun] 04/5/2020 16:35

Yes you're dead right. That comment did make me laugh. I would have thought, that had to be the top attribution of a CEO. Otherwise they would never get to that position.

[superiorshares] 03/5/2020 19:02

Icutandrun
That is another thing I have to look at control of agent's.
Overall I think things will be very messy at least in the near term.
I still believe though home credit is here for decades to come and done right very lucrative.
Thanks again for your input. Apologies to you dexdringle it's the wrong thread I am on
Regards to you both.

[1cutandrun] 03/5/2020 18:49

PFG where testing handhelds for years but they all had problems. Funny that, as Prudential were using Huskys. The true fact was cost. Then apps came out and agents could use their own phones, saving the company a fortune. PFG were always being investigated by HMRC due to the self employed status. Uber started up and there was an outcry on being self employed. PFG knew they would get bad press, as they had so many people on that status. So things had to change. Instead of rolling it out gradually they did it all in one hit. What idiots. That was a recipe for disaster and yes it was. Under Kuffeler that would never have happened. When I retired the share price was £22 and went up to £30, now look them £1.88. How the mighty fall.

[superiorshares] 03/5/2020 18:27

icutandrun
I have also worked at one of Europe's largest commercial solicitors before :-).
The legal costs for takeovers work both ways as far as I am aware ?
NSF must have incurred considerable costs in the failed takeover ?
I am assuming takeover costs , Corona costs are all in the share price already ?
Why I am biding my time is I think the impairment costs, in percentage terms. Will be a total unknown for a few months yet.
Also I don't think the Divi will be restored untill perhaps 2023. There will be a lot of mess to sort through.
Anyway you Will understand a lot more about that than I ever will.
You are my new Friend 😊
Regards

[1cutandrun] 03/5/2020 17:31

As for the take over bid. Kuffeler was banking on his reputation but PFG has well established share holders and they didn't want to take the risk. The board of PFG must have been pulling their hair out and it cost them an arm and a leg to fight this bid off. As for Kuffeler, he just walked away with a smile on his face.

[superiorshares] 03/5/2020 17:25

1cutandrun.
Thankyou very much for your reply. Years ago I was a postie and back then, it was early finish. A couple of the postie's were part time agents. It's were i got my scant knowledge of it. They did it for provident. NSF and MCL were not around then as far as I am aware ?.
That was my thoughts on the arrears. I am thinking of going with NSF because to be honest with Provident, it wasn't broke and that chap tried to fix it. With moving all the agent's to full time etc. Just an unforgivable disaster that for me.
That collapsed the share price quicker than Corona.
I will have a Google of the NSF chap tomorrow.
Regards

[superiorshares] 03/5/2020 17:23

1cutandrun.
Thankyou very much for your reply. Years ago I was a postie and back then, it was early finish. A couple of the postie's were part time agents. It's were i got my scant knowledge of it. They did it for provident. NSF and MCL were not around then as far as I am aware ?.
That was my thoughts on the arrears. I am thinking of going with NSF because to be honest with Provident, it wasn't broke and that chap tried to fix it. With moving all the agent's to full time etc. Just an unforgivable disaster that for me.
That collapsed the share price quicker than Corona.
I will have a Google of the NSF chap tomorrow.
Regards

[1cutandrun] 03/5/2020 17:04

John Philip De Blocq Van Kuffeler is over 70 and could have put his feet up but not this guy. He is well respected and has lots of friends. That is why he has no problem raising funds. Google him and see his pedigree.
The biggest downside with PFG and NSF is their home credit divisions. They are both going to take massive hits. I can see them now, phoning customers to get card payments but most don't have bank accounts. The arrears percentage will go through the roof and it will take a couple of years to get them back on track. All home credit firms will be in the same boat, and as you say, people need these companies as banks are not interested in them. NSF is a sound long term investment. As they stand at the moment, I would drip feed in before the annual report but if they go down buy big time. There is a health warning with this. Your investment can go down as well as up lol.