Powerhouse Energy Share Discussion Threads

[vatnabrekk] 06/3/2019 16:55

JackNife: "The question of whether "it works" on unrefined feedstocks..."

I still don't understand what you're on about here. What "refined" feedstock do you think they have been putting through the prototype? And what "unrefined" feedstock do you think they are planning to put through the commercial unit?

They have stated that they have tested the prototype with a variety of plastics and tyre crumb. If by "refined" you mean un-contaminated, then that may be the case. But if plastics feedstocks are contaminated by e.g. food residues, which would render the plastic unsuitable for recycling, then that would not be a problem for the DMG unit because it would all be gasified in the process, plastic and contaminates together.

It was because of contaminates that China stopped taking plastic from the UK (and possibly from Europe as a whole) because they could not use it for recycling, and so had to dispose of it by other means. But this would not be a problem for PHE processing.

So please clarify what you are getting at.

[linesal2] 06/3/2019 13:45

see ya then Mervin!

Plus your figures are totally incorrect- I do agree with the share price Dilating though (getting bigger) but I think you meant dilution... Back of the class for you!

[mervin4] 06/3/2019 13:33

The prototype is only 1 tpd and described by Mr Ryan as 'agricultural'. It will take years more to finance, build, test, further refine and certify a full sized 25 tpd system, and even then it could all prove a failure.

Meanwhile the share dilution will keep on coming and ordinary shareholders will see the value of their holdings ever more eroded.

The sensible thing to do is to go elsewhere with your money.

[ken chung] 06/3/2019 07:53

How much was Mr Allaun's departure payment?

[mervin4] 05/3/2019 21:54

Its

all

very

depressing.

[linesal2] 05/3/2019 12:31

and PHE are looking at other materials!

[vatnabrekk] 05/3/2019 12:18

Your are correct, JackNife, that PHE cannot use whole used tyres, only tyre crumb. I have never suggested anything other. I have stated that in order to landfill used tyres they have to be shredded into tyre crumb first because they are not allowed to landfill whole tyres.

And yes I do accept that tyre crumb is also used for recycling into all sorts of useful products, but that is not the point. The point is that if they are having to shred tyres in order to landfill them, then having done that it would seem much better all round to put that tyre crumb through a PHE system rather than dump it into landfill.

Anyway, as I said above, the discussion is irrelevant at the moment as David Ryan has said that they will be using plastic as a feedstock initially rather than tyre crumb.

[vatnabrekk] 05/3/2019 12:04

Discussion about tyres and tyre crumb as feedstock is more or less irrelevant at this time anyway, because David Ryan said in his recent presentation that initially they would be using plastic as feedstock rather than tyre crumb. This is because they reckon that at the moment plastic is a much bigger environmental problem than used tyres, there is an abundance of it available, and it is also high-energy for producing electricity and/or hydrogen.

Regarding contamination, this is not a problem for PHE because most of the contaminates such as food residues will be annihilated in the gasification process anyway. Such contaminates renders the plastics useless for recycling, and was probably the main reason that China stopped taking waste plastic from the UK and indeed Europe.

PHE will not be using recyclable plastic as feed stock.

[noirua] 05/3/2019 11:38

Dunlop Aircraft Tyres:



The complete aircraft tire is a made up of four basic materials which are Rubber, Nylon, Cord, & Steel. Tires are formed by the process called Vulcanization. ... Aircraft tires are made up of different components. So to answer your question, Aircraft tires are made up of multiple layers or plies such as Nylon, Kevlar, etc.,

Aircraft tires are manufactured to much higher standards and specifications. They are also filled with nitrogen instead of regular air.
This helps with corrosion on the inside of the rim. Many modern cars are now adapting to this standard. Rotational speed is also a concern for aircraft that many cars don’t have to worry about. Yes, there are “speed rated” tires for cars, but they are not standard.
There is also a difference in the composition of the material that they are made out of. Aircraft tires have to be able to withstand harsh landings and the tires still be intact. This makes the manufacture standards much more stringent. There is also usage.
Because aircraft use tires that are created for “harsh use” they are much tougher than regular car tires. They also have to be concerned with aerodynamics when it flight. Even the slowest airplane flies much faster than any car can ever hope to attain. What I am talking about is ‘wind resistance”. Chemically they are made out of the same rubber and steel, but Aircraft have to be much stronger and have far more longevity.

[nelson5100] 05/3/2019 11:37

Linesal2, when you next pop into the office just ask them when are they going to comply with Aim rule 26 and update the significant shareholders schedule as it is now beyond the time limit for updating.

Will Renewme Limited still be there??

[linesal2] 05/3/2019 11:20

Aircraft tyres are the easiest to recycle as they have no metal in the treads only metal is where the tyre sits on the rim.

[supernumerary] 05/3/2019 11:09

ls2 - I was looking for a link to someone who'd pay you to take it. I always seem to find the ones who expect to be paid for it eg:

There's a good outline of the process here:

The latter reckons around $20-60 per ton for Tyre Derived Fuel.

[linesal2] 05/3/2019 10:52

Just type in youtube retread process-goodyear do it,Michelin etc.some rasp some strip it off in inch wide strips.

[vatnabrekk] 05/3/2019 10:51

JackNife, you are wrong about tyre crumb not being a waste product. Only 15% of used tyres in the UK is recycled. Currently whole tyres are not allowed to be landfilled, so they either end up in a tyre mountain above ground, or if they are to be landfilled then they have to go through the shredding process first. So if PHE are going to use tyre crumb for their process, then shredding is not something that would have to be done just for PHE, it is already being done in order to put it into landfill.

So what is a better way to dispose of the tyre crumb, landfill or turn it into electricity and/or hydrogen in a PHE gasifier?

[linesal2] 05/3/2019 09:51

Jaknife
Actually tyre crumb is a waste product from the retreading process, where the tyre tread and sidewall is rasped off, and by the way just one company in Birmingham that I am fully aware of produces approx 1 tonne a day of this WASTE product AND THEY PAY TO HAVE IT TAKEN AWAY!

[linesal2] 05/3/2019 09:35

It was stipulated in the presentation waste does not have to be pre-cleaned.

[noirua] 05/3/2019 09:16

Turning waste into power: the plastic to fuel projects


Plastic to hydrogen
The new method would be a cheaper than current recycling options, as any plastic can be used without needing to be cleaned. According to The Balance Small Business, it currently costs around $4,000 to recycle a tonne of plastic bags, which often leads to plastic waste being burned or thrown in landfill to avoid expenses.

Dr Moritz Kuehnel, from the university’s chemistry department, said: “There’s a lot of plastic used every year – billions of tonnes – and only a fraction of it is being recycled. We are trying to find a use for what is not being recycled.

The beauty of this process is that it’s not very picky. It can degrade all sorts of waste.”

[lagosboy] 05/3/2019 08:53

It was originally pre-screened tyre crumble that was reported by Phe.

That means all the nasties like metals are removed first just leaving good old rubber in a shredded form. Of course totally useless as a real world application.

Mixed plastics is all that has been declared that I can see, but again any nasties that may have contaminated the mixed plastic are removed first.

Go down to your local dump- green waste contains rubble, paper and glass are mixed and it goes on - to be commercial and scalable it seems to me to be a perquisite to be able to deal with all common forms of waste and on a mixed basis.

[vatnabrekk] 05/3/2019 08:10

What do you mean by "refined" and "unrefined" feed stock? And how do you know what feed stock they have tested on the prototype - where is the detail reported?

[cmackay] 04/3/2019 22:06

There is a functioning prototype and a statement of feasibility for a commercial unit. The question is can it be brought to market, not does it work. I believe it can be.

[superbarnet] 04/3/2019 21:44

The filter works well!