Panther Securities Share Discussion Threads

[russman] 22/10/2021 04:01

Seems a positive deal. More than NBV.

[russman] 01/10/2021 04:36

Divi seems pretty safe in the medium term. Trying to diversify the portfolio would seem sensible. Maybe planning restrictions will be relaxed further to aid High Street developments.

[topvest] 16/7/2021 19:21

Re 353 quote. I think that RNS was one of the best RNS announcements made by a listed company....absolutely priceless Perloff - very astute and very funny. If you read the recent annual report then he has a contrarian view on the value of retail property and has a few angles from change of use, particularly on some of the closed Beales property. I'm not saying he has made all the right calls, because he hasn't. But, Perloff's entry price on most properties has a large margin of safety from a change in use / other angle. Many other properties will be having a worse time than Panther!

[debsdowner] 16/7/2021 11:54

Surprised Perloff still keeping his hands in retail his hands have been burnt more than once he doesnt understand retail.

[hennessy trades] 15/7/2021 17:26

Portnard Ltd (AP holding company) own a charge on the long leasehold Beales in the Poole Shopping Centre to secure funds lent to New Start 2020. That's according to companies house with Brown and Tean Dallaway (also of Airsprung Ltd again owned by AP) so Panther is effectively ploughing more money in but it's probably the lesser of two evils with the other being empty behemoth stores in poor condition and locations.

[hennessy trades] 15/7/2021 17:19

I should say funding

[hennessy trades] 15/7/2021 17:19

I think Panther are finding New Start 2020 and own all the share capital.

[debsdowner] 15/7/2021 16:04

Declaring a dividend didn't do much for Panther its now fallen back more than the dividend as I indicated it would.

Interestingly the ex manager of Beales has b een hired by New Start 2020 and reopened some of Beales stores which will please Perloff but I suspect the rents been greatly reduced on new terms!

A new tennant would be a fool not to renegotiate a better rate with so much property avaiLABLE. Not sure where Brown is getting his money from in his new venture. What Brown is doing is making sure its near 80% concessions in his reopened stores.

[debsdowner] 18/6/2021 21:12

6 shopping centres to be flattened



Seems councils have different views to AP.

[debsdowner] 09/6/2021 12:56

GAP to close 19 stores

[russman] 07/6/2021 08:00

Vacancies are rising
Arrears are rising.
Perloff has to start dealing / adapting or retire.

[debsdowner] 06/6/2021 17:50

A far better investmnt imo would be builders and suppliers such as outlined by this article



Flooring apecialis Healman ans Wickes are both seeing demand outstriping supply as people are spending money on their homes.

Panther has overpaid for its arcades and will be stuck with empty units for years. There was talk of Panther turning some of its empty units in Wayfarers Arcade into a resteraunt but the town has too may already.

[debsdowner] 06/6/2021 12:09

Russman,

Perloff used to brag about the potential yield of his retail properties but instead of filling vacancies they just increased. The Wayfarers arcade seemed cheap at the time but the owners of the arcade a private family must have known which way shopping was going.

He is in a difficult position now with some of his properties some may be converted to private rented housing but that must be risky now with properties reaching their peak as to prices and a potential housing crash.

Any conversions to offices must be high risk. Warehouse facilities are a possiblity but I suspect low demand for small outlets.

His lenders must think there is risk as they have reduced his maximum borrowings if i have that right.

I just dont think the company is going anywhere fast short term, Peloff will do OK with his stake in the company and his dividends, but its not an investable share imo short term with the wide spread.

I will just be watrching on the sidelines but dont expect any fireworks here and good luck to him in any event.

[russman] 05/6/2021 20:53

Very difficult to change the portfolio mix quickly and efficiently.
Perloff has always dealt in the cheap end of the market.
It is cheap for a number of reasons & risk is increasing.

[debsdowner] 05/6/2021 14:48

Up to 70 of 700 shopping centres could be close and some are 80% empty due to covid



Many couold be empty for years and I think Perloff is being too optimistice with conversion or rented to the council.

[debsdowner] 30/5/2021 21:23

HT

This is what Perloff said at the time:

Warming to his theme, Perloff let fly: "I have long held the view that: 1) It is foolish to upset your Landlord. 2) It is foolish to upset those that provide you with finance. 3) It is foolish for a quoted company to upset its largest shareholder. 4) It is foolish to sack a director who is knowledgeable, well connected and who does not charge a salary or any expenses.

"In one fell swoop Beales has managed all of these, which must be some type of record! It is hard to understand their logic."



What is ironic is Beales didnt do any better when it was acquired by Perloff and delisted as a PLC !!!!

In essence it was foolish for Perloff to come out with the comments he made as his knowledge on retail and the future of retail flawed. I suspect the board of Beales got fed up with a property FCO who had no knowledge of retail disrupting the board.

[hennessy trades] 30/5/2021 10:37

According to companies House Peters is 44. Wasn't he on Beales board at some point but removed much to the chagrin of Perloff?

[debsdowner] 30/5/2021 09:53

HT

"It is intended that Simon Peters, who has been Finance Director for over
fifteen years, and played a major part in keeping the Group on a steady course,
will step up to be Chief Executive Officer as from 1 January 2022 thus
relieving me of some of my responsibilities, despite numerous requests for me
to fully retire, entirely from my wife, which seemed to cease towards the end
of the first lockdown. Thus I will be able to continue to work for similar
hours concentrating on all matters that are most appropriate to my skills as
Executive Chairman. "

"steady course" !!!!

The bealles aquisition which Simon Peters was overseen by turned out to be a dissaster. Rretail was already strugglign before Perloff bought the company. Perloff also bought at least 2 arcades one of which was in Southport which at the time was yieldijng a good return and they thought they could increase the yield and now its almost empty.

I would say Perloff has lost the plot and not surprised his wife wants him to retire.

It could take years to convert or rent out some of his retail acquisitions and with worldwide property and assets overvalued the company is high risk imo,

Notr sure how old Simon Peters is but I suspect not far behind Perloff they have been together a long time.

Shareholders who invesst here are investing in an illiquid share in strange times and the1 only thing keeping the share price from falling further is the dividend.

There doesnt seem to be any new blood comming in at all so that is a concern, in fact staff have been reduced.

There are far more exciting opportunuties toi invest in losts of shares have doubled in price since the pandemic started.

[hennessy trades] 29/5/2021 15:07

Yes and the question is will the new tenant in Skeggy still be there when the rent hits £150k? Any letting is good as it rids him of the rates burden but for how long? Also he mentions handing over reigns to Simon Peters but according to the website he is an accountant not a property man. Have they got any property men apart from Mr Perloff?

[debsdowner] 29/5/2021 14:54

TRCML

"economical the truth" sums things up, I missed the results but here is my take:

Cover on interest rates has dropped near half compared to 5 years ago is a red flag!

His ramblings may on occasions educate people on what or not what to do but he has still made a number of poor aquisitions in particular the Wayfarers Arcade in Southport which is near empty, it would be good to know what rents he is actually receiving for this multi million purchase !

As for hoping to rent out some of these properties I suspect the councils have limited need as a lot of their staff can work from home. Does he not realise the world has changed and that means retail as well !

In fact he has admitted he can manage with less staff that is proof of the pudding and eating !

The results are better than I was thinking but the interest cover has fallen sharply on rents !

As for the 300k concessions he has made this is really a paltry figure! He blames the council for not giving more but I suspect many a tennant in a worse state of health !

The shares are illiquid and when you consider the loss of market cap the last few years the dividend doesn't make up for that !

I would not recommend anyone buying the stock its still too risky, I am not as optimistic as he is on the future in rentals and conversions, I have seen large stores in various towns stay empty for years, in fact many of the previous BHS are still empty today. We have a Debenhmas in our town been empty now for over a year and no prospect at all for conversion or rental as its on the edge of town !

As for some comments by other posters that an illiquid stock proves good over time well it hasn't proved good here. Once the share goes x dividend the share price will probably fall back again !

His ramblings may amuse some but more fless onn the bone as to how some of his aquisitions were actually doing would be of more interest and the statement lacks detail !

All in all this company will never explode into growth it may plod along for years to come but still is risky, the high street has changed forever and a lot of peope are working from home and he doesnt seem to accept this ! Possibly he is now too old to remain the captain of this ship which is still burdened with a lot of debt and on that front the debt ceiling has been reduced !!!

TRCML spot on with your entire post its not just Skegness with a low rents there are many more stores or arcades which must be giving Perloff a headache !

[trcml] 28/5/2021 17:50

Somewhat economical the the truth about Skegness ex-beales. Yes the rent ends up at 150K but not for years, Meanwhile. no rent until December 2021.

[topvest] 26/5/2021 20:12

Yes, great to see Perloff is still holding his own. I am no longer a shareholder, but still read his Ramblings... top man! Sounds like he is passing some of his duties over to Simon Peters. Hopefully, he will still preside as Executive Chairman for many years to come. He is a legend!

[russman] 26/5/2021 18:32

pleasantly surprised. "Torrid" market is apt.

[nickrl] 26/5/2021 10:32

Chairmans ramblins as ever worth a read but at least with a small company like this you get grass roots detail about whats happening which is missing from the big boys so you get a good idea over the state of the business.

Shelling out £5m to vary a swap agreement was a big hit to the bottom line mind you but as you say given the portfolio they've done a lot better than I would have expected but impossible to trade this one.