Panther Securities Share Discussion Threads

[debsdowner] 27/1/2021 14:53

Panther is to announce whether it will pay a dividend in February and its increasingly unlikely now imo so no yield.

The High Street is looking like a ghost town and no one wants office space meaning less commercial interest in the business.

The banks must be very worried now about commercial property and any refinance may come at punitive rates.

[debsdowner] 19/1/2021 14:56

nick,

You make some valid comments everything needs reassessing with low interest rates but bear in mind higher yield higher risk. In the meantime HSBC just announced the closure of 82 branches further decimating the High Street and putting more downward pressure on commercial property.



There are few buyers for commercial property at the moment.

[nickrl] 19/1/2021 13:40

debsdowner HMSO are very exposed to retail and thats where the can pay but wont brigade reside so once moratorium is off they will see some recovery. I thought many propcos were overvalued for same reasons as you but have decided that the vast liquidity and declining interest rates means rational investing is being usurped by the wall of money looking for yield now. Doesn't mean im going to jump on the boat but im having reassess entry points at a higher level than i would have pre covid.

[debsdowner] 19/1/2021 12:16

No news yet on financing and in the meanwhile property stocks like Hamerson are only obtaining less that 50% of their rents. Commercial property is way overvalued which places this stock at high risk due to the high debt.

[russman] 22/12/2020 19:10

Maybe unethical but legal asset stripping.

[hennessy trades] 22/12/2020 11:27

Whiskt Green's conduct was unpalatable for some I found it wholly acceptable and would have done the same thing in the circumstances. I guess I am greedy. I dont see what being Jewish has to do with it. In any case I'm not Jewish.

[debsdowner] 22/12/2020 11:14

HT

Green was the ugly and greedy face of capitalism you seem to have no knowledge of his taking a 1.2 billion dividend out of BHS that money could have been used to invest money in the business, instead part of it went on 2 luxury yachts.

Such was his greed calls have been made numerous times to strip him of his knighthood and you supporting him shows your lack of insight into his conduct.

I maintain my comments above PG was wholly responsible for the demise of BHS and also Arcadia he has not invested in either company his greed has put thousands of employees
on the dole and also put small manufacturers at risk of going broke through loss of payments.

Perloff supporting PG is akin to the support of greedy behaviour and I would advise people to avoid this company.

Even a fellow Jew has condemned Philp Greens greed

[russman] 20/12/2020 21:25

Great traders take large calculated risks.
Returns are more volatile in the short term.
Has Perloff still got his timing.

[hennessy trades] 20/12/2020 19:05

Nothing wrong with supporting Green he was a incredibly hard worker and great Trader. What I would be interested in knowing is the actual long term rent and service charge arrears position of companies like Panther and LAP etc, including void costs and rent concessions compared to rents reserved.

[debsdowner] 20/12/2020 18:23

Further lockdowns now will affect commercial property which is well overvalued and needs to plummet as shoppers go online and office workers work from home.

Perrloff was also a supporter of Philip Green the face of capitalism and greed so I have no sympathy for Perloff company falling the way it has. He refers to Green in his historic rámblings !

[hennessy trades] 01/12/2020 20:11

The revaluation will undoubtedly affect borrowing terms negatively. Valuers are more fearful of being sued by banks than at any time in history.

[debsdowner] 01/12/2020 11:21

Directors not buying but maybe they cannot due while refinancing has concluded.

However the High Street is being decimated and as such there is a surplus of commercial property and asset prices will fall further leaving refinancing at less attractive terms.

[hennessy trades] 25/11/2020 17:46

Year end 20 will be interesting. Revaluation on the horizon?

[ntv] 25/11/2020 17:38

Haven't visited lately
From memory there is a deal to cut interest costs already in place
I think it kicks in in Dec 21 from memory
Glad i sold near the recent top

[russman] 22/11/2020 08:28

perloff has stashed away some development sites over the years. Takes years to pull the jigsaw pieces together. in at cost or NRV.

[debsdowner] 20/11/2020 10:55

No point buying in until they have refinanced and there is clarity on interest charges.

With bricks and mortar stores closing almost daily the banks may want a higher interest rate.

[topvest] 09/11/2020 19:50

Perloff will keep it listed in my view. He's old and rich enough. This is his shop window on the world and he loves it!

I agree that he has made some mistakes on the shop front, but he certainly buys cheap so there is normally a margin of safety.

Debt wise I think they will be fine.

I'm on the sidelines at the moment, but will probably buy back in at some point once we get a tad more clarity.

[hennessy trades] 09/11/2020 18:13

Yes albeit a non exec. I'm thinking about young blood to take the company forward although as you say going private might be the way.

[trcml] 09/11/2020 16:40

Bryan Galan is still on the board - property man through and through!

[hennessy trades] 09/11/2020 11:47

Would be an option to take private whikst the shares are so low. It's going to need some cash injection to convert the sites at the end of their life so I can see long term planning situations and sales of non income producing sites to reduce debt. Mr Perloff is so key to the whole operation. I dont think there are any property men on the board anymore. Companies house shows two other directors listed but they are shown as leaving a long time ago to either retire or set up their own ventures.

[hybrasil] 09/11/2020 10:54

I think their debt level is a concern.
Interest only 3 times covered.
I have always enjoyed mr perloffs ramblings but I think he never saw this massive shift to an online life.
No bricks and mortar store can compete.
He ll probably take it private

[russman] 26/10/2020 05:07

Had a look around some of PNS local retail properties.
The high st was pretty bleak with increasing vacancies.
Some adjoining development potential but retail will be a drag.

[topvest] 25/10/2020 18:30

I sold out but I am still watching a re-entry. I hope Panther will survive and prosper, but now is not the right time for a re-entry in my view. Of course, Mr Perloff is getting on a bit and so there is the retirement risk out there as well. I guess he could work on for a decade or two, as he doesn’t seem the retiring type, but he’s so fundamental to Panther.

[debsdowner] 25/10/2020 17:25

The Beales in Southport wont make a hotel site its not big enough, he has made a mistake with the purchase of Wayfarers. It could be a white Elephant for years. The remaining tenants apart from a barbers at the front will probably leave now leaving the arcade empty.

I think Panther have another shopping centre it purchased a few years ago I suspect that is a white elephant as well.

There will be more write-downs imo I would await final results before I took a stake and see how bad things have become.