Orchid Developments Share Discussion Threads

[markt] 01/12/2012 19:43

the GM
4.2ME income to end June
1.1ME hired services costs

(are there any other costs except loan costs ?, insurance ?, water ?, management ?, maintenance ?

Net = 3.1ME
If double for 1 year = 6.2ME

If yield were to be 8% before tax

then I make the value or sale price to be 77.5ME

at 7% sale price = 88.6ME


the claimed value is 137ME
the amount of debt is around 90ME-100ME I think, +/- X

If my calculations are correct...then imo...infers that
- selling the GM would NOT pay off the debt.
- selling the GM would NOT produce any profit for OCH or shareholders
- the claimed 137ME value in the accounts is ..imo...complete rubbish.

(and everyone knew, hence the 2p share price while the claimed NAV was over 0.7 E)

(the GM is approx. 80% occupied, if OCH could fill the remaining 20% it would increase the value, much more than 20%. But it is not expected to happen in 2013, % increase has been difficult and slow. 4% has been in negiotation for 1-2 years, still).

[markt] 01/12/2012 19:35

I see the info is only till end of June !

So, any apartment sales and current cash position etc NOW

appears imo to be SECRET, well wrt to PIs anyway !

[markt] 01/12/2012 19:34

claimed €71.4M at end of JUne.
94M shares
= 0.75 E/share

if offer happens and fully subscribed, and then issue a few more shares, to go to 250M....or underscribed and then issue more to dirs. to raise cash

then 71.4M/250 = 0.28E /share

(noting that the mkt does not believe the claimed NAV)
----

So

imo the NAV will be divided by approx. 3 if the share issue happens.

(if I had known this big dilution was coming I would never have bought any OCH !)

[markt] 01/12/2012 19:10

moved to Markt thread

[markt] 01/12/2012 18:53

?

This thread is supposed to be for discussing the financial numbers of OCH....especially those given in the offer document.

My post 9 "is" short.
(my post 8 was long, but replying to Greedfear)

---

Anyway, have you got on comments on the financial numbers given in the offer document ?

Markt (market in German)

[tax dodge] 01/12/2012 18:34

Mark please you said short messages. A deal is a deal

[markt] 01/12/2012 18:31

No one had a go at trying to turn the handle on the numbers given in the offer document ?

[markt] 01/12/2012 17:29

"You thinks it's realistic to think that you can get almost 50% of shareholders other than directors to vote?"

The dirs. only have 30% at the moment.
At OCH the block of shares held by IIs is unusually high.
the IIs have imo a massive % of OCH if you add them up

and could easily decide to remove the dirs. imo.

but
if the EGM resolutions are approved, (I hope not)
then the dirs. will have approx. 40-64%...and can go to 73% 1 or 2 days later
(shares to cancel a debt or lend money to the company, eg. to pay Dec loan installment)

and will in practice control the company

then they can not be removed....or can they ?
for a vote for a director, or 2, ...are they allowed to vote ?

Anyway, its 'now or never'
if the EGM approves the resolutions...then the 2 dirs. have control of OCH....
and we then have to wait to see if they ever decide to give any money back to shareholders !!
(I think it will be nothing....or peanuts....
the dirs. want it all...they go from 26% in Feb 2012 to 73% in Dec 2012-Jan 2012.....just in return mostly for their salaries...and a claimed bonus...
----

The IIs may not be as much asleep as we think.
For example, they, imo, forced the dirs. to take their bonus as shares AND NOT as cash. And at 20p and NOT at the market price.
Maybe there is hope after all, a small glimmer.
As you say, a lot depends on what the IIs do or do not do. But we can also try to motivate/influence them.

---

If you wanted, you could try to contact 1 or 2 IIs and try to influence them.
..before the EGM

[markt] 01/12/2012 17:07

moved to Markt thread

[markt] 01/12/2012 16:51

"timtim5449 1 Dec'12 - 16:26 - 8900 of 8902 0 0

We dont have much option we have to go with what the IIs want I suppose, I would imgin they have the final say in this".


You have no interest to contact the IIs by e-mail or to telephone them ?

If a few people do it....maybe we can alter their opinion or action/vote.
If we dont try .......

[markt] 01/12/2012 16:50

moved to Markt thread

[markt] 01/12/2012 16:30

"timtim5449 1 Dec'12 - 08:25 - 8894 of 8900 0 0

So whats the majority on here going to be doing??? ( I am I allowed to ask that) any answers please!!"

BTW
I have created a new thread.....ONLY for posting how you intend to vote for the 2 resolutions for the EGM.

(please, no discussions or long posts (esp. me !)....just votes
and we can see how people intend to vote

(of course it is only a message board, we dont know if what people post is true etc etc....but I think it could be useful/interesting)

[timtim5449] 01/12/2012 16:26

We dont have much option we have to go with what the IIs want I suppose, I would imgin they have the final say in this. So we PIs are just a means to an ends for the BODs and company. It only comes good if we do give them more money and we get a decent return, so here hopping for that then on my part. Only have pennies left for this now anyway. Still praying. GL all and hope we can see this thing get turned around for us, and not get STUFFED any more.

[markt] 01/12/2012 16:24

I'm in !...and happy to follow your lead if you are willing to lead !

How or what to do from here....I dont know.....(paying to get a 'helper' or lawyer in the city was just 1 idea; ideally I was hoping that one of the big % holders in out mini-group would pop up say that their company lawyer or laywer son would do it on the cheap...)

(something has been sent to the SFO...but I doubt they could/would act before the EGM, and if the EGM vote is yes, then it to a large degree would validate the resolutions and make any legal process harder to proceed, but not impossible, if the offer doc. and resolutions are a misrepresentation in order to obtain personal benefit then imo it is illegal and the vote would not void that.
The AIM regulators look to be not interested, the offer doc. does not have to meet the rules for a prospectus since < 5M pnds and only to existing shareholders (so, they have been named as a complice !)


If we could get 5 or 10% of the votes, we need to see company articles, to call an EGM...I doubt that we could stop the existing EGM process...I dont know about company law, especially Cayman Is. company law !

(I gave a list of possible actions we could pursue or consider, press, TV, police, phone calls to the IIs (and Value Investments) etc. Someone submitting allegations at City of London police, worth doing imo. Anyone ?)

(If someone could phone Value Investments Ltd and ask them to add their votes to ours then we would have a decent block...that the bod would have to listen to our view I think, with 4-4.5% we have small voice)

[timtim5449] 01/12/2012 16:17

Ok,thanks.

[bumpkinroll] 01/12/2012 15:55

markt, thank you for your detailed views again. I think your prolific posting might be putting PI's off here. However, I fully understand your anger & views, especially, if you're retired & this is your main focus (I know I would be the same).

I'm up for contributing to the cost of a Lawyer, but, £1k will buy approx 2hrs of time (my old Lawyer charged £554 per hr) for a decent Lawyer. Investigating this alone, they will want to allocate at least 8hrs IMO, unless, we instruct them, based on an agreed stance, of the direction we want to go in on.

We need a show of hands as to who is still in to possible action here? Remember, markt is just airing his views & has made it clear he does not want to be alone in leading the charge. So, we just agree on what stance we take. But, we are running out of time & need to make our minds up quickly on this.

I personally will not be taking up the share offer, but, I do want to take action against the obvious manipulation here. markt is right on many points & for me, the key one is, how the hell are they going to do any better in shifting assets in the next 12 months when their track record in the last 12 has been appalling. Sorry to mention this again, but, the obvious lack of assets being placed into auction, even a single asset, just to test the waters, shouts volumes as to their intentions here.

Who's in?????

[markt] 01/12/2012 15:25

Resoln. 1 vote NO

Resoln 2. Vote NO

160k shares

[markt] 01/12/2012 15:25

ONLY to vote YES or NO to the resolutions in EGM

I have created this new thread, in case any people want to reveal how they currently intend to vote to resolutions 1 and 2 in the EGM, which I think is 14th Dec.


Warning
Any posts or claimed votes, no one knows if they are true...or that claimed number of shares is true.

But, I think that if posts come seasoned posters on OCH msg board then that gives some credence to their post.

New people may arrive and vote YES or NO to try to affect the vote.

more warnings to be added later.

[grannyboy] 01/12/2012 09:12

greadfear, OK! if i were invested here i certainly would'nt be putting anymore money in, buts thats OMO!..

[jack1236] 01/12/2012 09:01

The new Non Executive Chairman has an interesting history.

[greedfear] 01/12/2012 08:59

If that's you're neutral opinion, how about sharing your subjective one? :)

[grannyboy] 01/12/2012 08:30

You've got to ask yourself "DO I THROW GOOD MONEY AFTER BAD", and will they be able to sell any assets at a decent price?..

I should add i don't hold here, just giving a honest neutral opinion...

[timtim5449] 01/12/2012 08:25

So whats the majority on here going to be doing??? ( I am I allowed to ask that) any answers please!!

[grannyboy] 01/12/2012 08:18

A lot of bric-bats have been thrown at the BOD but i believe no matter who was/is in charge the situation/outcome would be the same, as the saying goes.."ITS THE ECONOMY STUPID"..

Now with the latest RNS they've got until May 2013 to sell that asset, I can't see much improvement between now and then in the worlds economy, can you?..

As to the BOD's wanting to get the share price lower so as for a low ball park T/O, that still doesn't take into account that if it was their intention, they'd still have the dire state of the economy to contend with,and that means them still having to find over 3.5mil euro's by May...OMO