Close Brothers Share Discussion Threads

[neilyb675] 19/1/2024 11:36

598.50 - 599.50 (GBX) at 11:35:11
on Market (LSE)

[pj84] 18/1/2024 00:38

Some of the exaggerated compensation claims are based on the possibility that the whole agreement should be refunded including the capital instalments for the car.

This is one of the ombudsman cases against Black Horse Ltd. part of Lloyds bank.



"My final decision

372. For the reasons I’ve explained, I uphold Mrs Y’s complaint and direct Black Horse Limited to put things right in the way I’ve set out at paragraph 364 above.

373. Under the rules of the Financial Ombudsman Service, I am required to ask Mrs Y
either to accept or reject my decision before 10 February 2024.

374. Black Horse should calculate and pay the compensation within 28 days of the date which Mrs Y accepts my final decision."

and

364. And, having considered all the evidence and arguments about redress, my final
decision is that Black Horse should compensate Mrs Y by paying her:

⎯ the difference between (i) the payments she made from time to time under the
finance agreement (at the flat interest rate of 5.5%) and (ii) the payments she
would have made (including when she settled the loan early) had the finance
agreement been set up at the lowest (zero discretionary commission paying) flat
interest rate permitted (that is 2.49%); together with

⎯ interest on each overpayment payment at the rate of 8% simple per year
calculated from the date of the payment to the date of settlement in accordance
with my final decision."

[topvest] 17/1/2024 20:22

RBCs estimate is a positive if its that small. I would like to know what they have paid out in both motor finance commission payments and what proprtion are discretionary commission arrangements before I even consider buying back in. It's not a disclosed number. I should stick to my general rule of not investing directly in banks though...it nearly always ends in some form of pain!

[stoopid] 17/1/2024 15:34

Its over an 11% yield at current price.....

[brucie5] 17/1/2024 11:53

It's reduced to VOD levels of disbelief. However, as rule of thumb, beware of shares that fall more than 50% of peak. They can commonly fall to 25%, which in this case could leave room for further falls to £4. Does that sound ridiculous? Depends what happens to the dividend, which has been principal reason for holding.

[suetballs] 17/1/2024 10:38

Stoopid I agree. But confidence, credibility and perception is battered. I haven’t sold.
Suet

[stoopid] 17/1/2024 10:03

So, if RBC estimate the loss/write off/provisions for the car loan debacle to be up to 120m that's still £60/80m less than the provisions already in place for Novitas which although painful were easily absorbed and the dividend still rose. Also depends on what happens with winterflood. Profits have been poor and the last info was that CBG were going to sell it?

[cirlbunting1] 17/1/2024 10:02

2nd tranche added 6.03. 2 more to go.

[brucie5] 17/1/2024 09:28

I think you're brave to hold here in absence of definitive information about liability, which is probably going to be impossible if the previous banking loans scandal is indicative. How will this affect the dividend?

[dplewis1] 17/1/2024 08:58

Robert Sack .. nominative determinism

[albert arthur] 17/1/2024 08:21

CRO selling circa circa £30k at ATL

[pj84] 16/1/2024 00:55

If the RBC estimate of £20 to £120m is in the right ball park then the share price drop is overdone particularly given how it has consistently fallen over the past 2 years so I have decided to hold on for now.

"RBC added that Barclays could see a £30 to £150m profit hit, while merchant banking group Close Brothers could lose £20m to £120m.

Close Brothers clocked £2bn in motor loans as of the third quarter, making up around 20 per cent of its loan book. RBC noted that the firm’s typical customer was “below prime”."

[alex1621] 16/1/2024 00:10

RBC estimate a profit hit for CBG of between £20m and £120m. Source was City AM. Quite a wide range of profit impact. A lot depends on what the FCA propose.

[flyfisher] 15/1/2024 14:08

Some estimates of the scale of the issue.

Analysts at investment bank RBC estimated a downside impact of between some £2bn and £8bn for the motor finance sector.

They said the review could hit Lloyds Bank’s pretax profit by some £270m to £1.2bn, the largest absolute impact of banks in their coverage.
Analysts at Barclays also estimated a potential provision range for Lloyds of between £0.5bn and £1bn but said uncertainty was “high”.

[albert arthur] 15/1/2024 11:52

EventDateFirst quarter trading updateNovember 2023Annual General Meeting16 November 2023Final dividend payment24 November 2023Half year end31 January 2024Interim resultsMarch 2024Third quarter trading updateMay 2024Financial year end31 July 2024Preliminary resultsSeptember 2024

[flyfisher] 15/1/2024 10:53

Is there a trading update this week. It was 20th jan last year.

[suetballs] 15/1/2024 10:14

Yes - some form of update would have been helpful. Even if they only said they were working on it and hoped to give a further update in due course. Martin Lewis has certainly poured petrol on the bonfire - but then that's what he does!

Suet

[jonnybig] 15/1/2024 09:58

Surprised cbg didn't give some kind of update. Looking really bad here with no sign of support. Might have a dabble at sub 600p but only if the knife halts its relentless fall.

[suetballs] 15/1/2024 09:08

I'm ashamed to say I'm down 56% on this - I should have followed my gut and bailed a long time ago.
IMO the management are stale and I can but hope at this level someone makes a bid.
Suet

[pj84] 13/1/2024 17:42

My potential loss is similar although haven't yet decided whether this is a case of the first cut is the cheapest to take.

Like Topvest I hadn't really registered the contingent liability note. Note 15 to the accounts but I recall Terry Smith famously saying he always read the accounts from the back to the front for that very reason as anything of interest was usually buried in the notes, not what the directors were saying at the beginning of the accounts in there glowing reports.

The recent drop in the share price from around £8 to £6.60 represents a drop in value of around £210m and the share had been drifting down long before that so arguably a lot of any potential loss is already in the price.

No doubt a clearer provision will arise in the interim accounts.

[brucie5] 13/1/2024 13:46

I sold out end of the week after this latest fall. A shame and cost me a 21% loss. One of Roland Head's stable of quality dividend folio ideas, so if he's reading this board, can he please do an update!

[thebutler] 13/1/2024 12:42

Yes, almost certain to be a dividend cut. Don't own CBG but interested observer. The market cap has been bombed and now trades at a huge discount to NAV. Obviously needs some clarity here, there's panic and no sign of any support, but IMO once the bottom is hit (who knows what SP) this could be a great buy for a 1 to 2 year share price recovery.

[popit] 13/1/2024 05:03

This latest problem is very likely to bring a dividend cut

Maybe CBG will be worth a buy when the shares reach £5

[topvest] 12/1/2024 19:31

The cases are both linked in the FCA announcement yesterday, if that helps.