Carnival Share Discussion Threads

[miata] 18/1/2012 13:53

The insurance claim against the stricken Costa Concordia could run to as high as $1 billion as it "bounces around the reinsurance industry for 10 years", underwriters claimed yesterday.

While it is too early to tell exactly how much of a bill insurance companies will cop to cover damage to the ship, personal injury and loss of life, analysts have estimated claims could reach anywhere from $500 million up to $1 billion.

A lot will come down to whether the ship, built for about $570 million, can be salvaged and repaired or is written off as a "total loss".

"Even if that's not the case, the claim will still bounce around the reinsurance industry for 10 years as insurers seek to recover their exposure," a Sydney underwriter said. "After that comes the recoveries." The recoveries are what money is recovered by the sale of salvaged and damaged parts of the 114,500-tonne ship with its 6000 sq m fitness centre, five jacuzzis, 13 bars and six Wartsila diesel engines. Recoveries can also be sought against any personal items found at the bottom of the Tyrrhenian Sea such as jewellery whose ownership cannot be confirmed.

Carnival did not take out insurance for loss of use of the ship. The company said it expects lose $85 million to $95 million in bookings.

[kibes] 18/1/2012 13:41

In my own dealings with insurance companies I am getting the feeling that they are using the small print to avoid paying out on claims in general. After AIG had to be bailed out by the Federal Reserve with billions of dollars it appears to me the industry as a whole is trying to recover its losses by disputing claims and particularly where relevant facts have not been declared beforehand. In this instance a highly dangerous deviation from the normal standard approved course for the vessel would appear to me to be a relevant fact. I don't think any insurer would be willing to provide cover for a vessel of this size which is just going to 'try its luck' sailing close to an unknown rocky shore. I bet they would insist a pilot with local knowledge was on board in that sort of situation.

[salpara111] 18/1/2012 13:33

As I understand it the ship was only 6 years old which is nothing in ship terms.

It will not be up to carnival but the insurance companies who will own it when they pay out to determine whether to try and refloat/refurb the ship....no different to when your car has a relatively minor accident and the insurance company declares it a write off, the car will be sold and depending on the level of damage either repaired and put back on the road or broken for parts.

[miata] 18/1/2012 13:08

"Airplanes sometimes fall out of the sky, but people still fly," said Petter Narvestad, an Oslo-based analyst at Fondsfinans ASA, who recommends buying Royal Caribbean shares and doesn't rate Carnival. "The effects of Concordia are short- term. There's no threat to the cruise liners or the cruise industry."

[spob] 18/1/2012 12:58

" A damage assessment review of the vessel is currently being undertaken to
determine how long it will be out of service. "


They are dreaming

That vessel is a total loss imho

[spob] 18/1/2012 12:47

If I were insuring carnival I certainly would not pay up in this case.

That's just my opinion though.

[miata] 18/1/2012 12:40

scotches

Re post 905

They don't fall off, in the main they jump.

[optimist] 18/1/2012 12:37

scotches

Re post 905

I think that topic should be discussed on a "right to die" thread

[miata] 18/1/2012 12:37

Interesting point. However he did not deliberately steer the vessel onto the rocks. He may well have recklessly endangered the ship and its passengers and may have been negligent but as the owners did all they could, except perhaps employing someone else, I would expect the insurance claims will be paid.

[salpara111] 18/1/2012 12:34

The insurance companies will pay out in the first instance but if the captain is convicted as appears likely they will doubtless seek to recover from Carnival however that will be very tricky as they would effectively have to prove that the company knew he was a risk prior to the accident.

[kibes] 18/1/2012 12:20

Will the insurance companies pay up I wonder? It is reported that the captain has already acknowledged that he was sailing an unapproved course much too close to shore and not following company procedures. It was strictly off his own bat. Do insurance companies pay up where someone deliberately steers a vessel onto the rocks? If not the cost to Carnival is going to be a lot more than they think.

[ny boy] 18/1/2012 08:52

Easy money after the recent fall, this is no BP senario!

[scotches] 18/1/2012 08:46

This is a rare accident - much more frequent is the surprising number of people who fall off these boats.

Forty-three people have vanished from Carnival cruises since 2000. Theirs is the worst record of all cruise companies. There have been 171 disappearances in total, across all cruise lines, since 2000.

[miata] 17/1/2012 17:25

Fairly calm reaction in the US, oscillating in a narrow range.

Hopefully the extraction of the 500,000 gallons of fuel oil will go to plan, but this could become difficult if the ship slides off the shelf into deep water. The process, involving engineers and divers, should take two to four weeks.

[jon827] 16/1/2012 17:35

"It's a very NICE!!!!!!" credit rating phil



gedit? Kazakhstan, Borat? Kazakhstan?

*i'll get me coat


:)

[melton john] 16/1/2012 17:11

According to press conference, programmed course was overridden with the approval of the captain to show off the ship.

It would appear that the water depth was checked by depth gauge which did not indicate outcrop, only the average depth.

Disgusting that all the reports talk of no emergency lighting etc down below.

[philanderer] 16/1/2012 16:56

Jon, S&P rate Italy the same as Kazakhstan as from last friday evening :-O

"Italy environment minister says the government is to declare state of emergency over Costa Concordia disaster"

[jon827] 16/1/2012 16:26

can Italy afford a crisis right now?

[hosede] 16/1/2012 12:34

I suspect it may be a bit late to short now, but anyone who was short on Friday has got a very lucky bonus - "it's an ill wind......

[alphahunter] 16/1/2012 12:15

MIATA, please put the assumptions as well. 25% Yield drop at Costa? They are having a laugh!

[macau] 16/1/2012 11:41

£10..are they having a laugh or what?!!