Camkids Share Discussion Threads

[chevalierdaven] 12/1/2015 12:05

You can also add all the similar shoes/garment/apparel Fujian province companies listed in Germany (as weak if not weaker standards than good old AIM) and in Singapore and other places..... GoldRooster AG GO8, FastCasualwear AG FCA, Ming Le Sport AG ML2, Van Camel AG VC8.....
Worth following the constant flow of frauds on those too.
On the Nasdaq worth following also but they are in other businesses (fertilizer, microchips),and the frauds are quite sophisticated sometimes. But the "patsy" is always the same: the gullible greedy small retail investor.

[topvest] 12/1/2015 08:16

Well I’ve learnt a lesson on these Chinese AIM stocks, so thought I would post a warning as far as I see it. There are 3 companies that are ALL very similar. I’m sure there are more than this on AIM but these are the 3 I have come across, and unfortunately lost money on two being Naibu and Camkids because I didn’t spot the “gifted” shares stunt and chose to ignore the warnings until it was too late. I have to say that all the warnings on this Billboard were spot-on.

I haven’t lost much, and done well on Prosperity Minerals and Fortune Oil to nearly balance these two out, but I think of myself as a relatively experienced investor and so I am not pleased with myself for making this error of judgment and will learn by mistake. I will never invest in a Chinese AIM company again.

Naibu, Camkids and China ChainTek (which I don’t know as well, but looks similar). The remarkable similarities are:

- All are connected to the sports shoe market in Fujian Province and listed at a similar time.
- All listed at a very low valuation, fantastic financials and using “lower quality” NOMADs.
- On each listing the Founder inexplicably “gifted” shares to mysterious locked-in holder’s pre-IPO. There is no mention of who these parties are or really why it was done.
- These holders then sold ALL of their shares at the earliest opportunity after good results reported and after the 12 month lock-in.
- Then after about 12-18 months each Company started to make excuses and reduce their cash dividend despite having enormous cash piles.
- The Founder then takes a scrip dividend to regain control of the company as the company valuation is so low that even a pathetic dividend enables him to do this.
- Next step is probably a de-listing. It’s very clear who is winning and who is losing. I’m amazed that the LSE haven’t launched some kind of investigation into what is potentially happening here.

Please help others and add to my list of companies that you think might be up to the same trick, so that investors in these companies are warned of the risks involved. Of course, they could be genuine companies with shareholders’ interests at stake, but I very much doubt it to be honest.

[topvest] 12/1/2015 08:12

Well I’ve learnt a lesson on these Chinese AIM stocks, so thought I would post a warning as far as I see it. There are 3 companies that are ALL very similar. I’m sure there are more than this on AIM but these are the 3 I have come across, and unfortunately lost money on two being Naibu and Camkids because I didn’t spot the “gifted” shares stunt and chose to ignore the warnings until it was too late. I have to say that all the warnings on this Billboard were spot-on.

I haven’t lost much, and done well on Prosperity Minerals and Fortune Oil to nearly balance these two out, but I think of myself as a relatively experienced investor and so I am not pleased with myself for making this error of judgment and will learn by my mistake. I will never invest in a Chinese AIM company again.

Naibu, Camkids and China ChainTek (which I don’t know as well, but looks similar). The remarkable similarities are:

- All are connected to the sports shoe market in Fujian Province and listed at a similar time.
- All listed at a very low valuation, fantastic financials and using “lower quality” NOMADs.
- On each listing the Founder inexplicably “gifted” shares to mysterious locked-in holder’s pre-IPO. There is no mention of who these parties are or really why it was done.
- These holders then sold ALL of their shares at the earliest opportunity after good results reported and after the 12 month lock-in.
- Then after about 12-18 months each Company started to make excuses and reduce their cash dividend despite having enormous cash piles.
- The Founder then takes a scrip dividend to regain control of the company as the company valuation is so low that even a pathetic dividend enables him to do this.
- Next step is probably a de-listing. It’s very clear who is winning and who is losing. I’m amazed that the LSE haven’t launched some kind of investigation into what is potentially happening here.

Please help others and add to my list of companies that you think might be up to the same trick, so that investors in these companies are warned of the risks involved. Of course, they could be genuine companies with shareholders’ interests at stake, but I very much doubt it to be honest.

[deanroberthunt] 09/1/2015 13:12

as sure as eggs is eggs

[trentendboy] 09/1/2015 09:42

This will follow the way of Naibu - you all know it really.

[caradog] 09/1/2015 09:39

Growth, yes, but at what price? Neither turnover or forward orders have kept pace with rate of increase in number of outlets, so either the new stores or the existing ones are doing badly. Naibu warned of discounting by competitors and excess stock.
Yesterday we had retail analysts and journalists poring over Tesco and M&S figures, focusing on like-for-like sales, yet Camkids doesn't publish this key metric. Why not?
Nor does it provide a breakdown of children v. Teenage sales. These are two very different markets without obvious synergy. (How many teenagers like to wear the same clothes as 10-yr olds?).
The internet strategy is flawed to the point of being nonsensical as direct sales would compete directly with the exclusive distributors. Compare this with John Lewis who have a clear strategy of combining Internet retailing with a small number of directly-owned flagship stores. Camkids owned only 1 store, possibly 2 last time I checked, all the rest are subsidised indirect franchisees. No detailed figures for Internet sales either.
In the end, Naibu and Camkids are in the same space in the same market. If Naibu goes belly-up, it clearly increases the risk that Camkids will share the same fate.
You must ask yourself why Chinese companies come to Aim. Is it because UK private investors understand the Chinese market better than the Chinese themselves, or is it because because they are less knowledgable and are more easily parted from their money in a more lax regulatory environment?

[chevalierdaven] 09/1/2015 09:19

You can not say you were not given evidence of the fraud at NBU and CAMK. No hiding there.

[islam1] 09/1/2015 08:46

Andrew Hore's article seems to imply that advisors for Chinese companies must be cleaner than clean and be able to predict ever increasing progress year on year.

Yah! AIM is filled with crooks and little concern for the investors, and most of the companies are not Chinese. At least Camkids shows consistent growth and good financial management. Plus 16% dividend, and a PE of .0007..amazing

[philjeans] 09/1/2015 08:44

Nor I.

However, chalk and cheese spring to mind.

[caradog] 09/1/2015 07:47

Trading in Naibu suspended at request of non-execs, to clarify trading position.
I, for one, am not surprised.

[philjeans] 08/1/2015 16:37

Same again div worth about 16% currently - and they have promised to continue them, let alone increase the payments. Cash held far in excess of M/C still.

[philjeans] 08/1/2015 16:10

A few nibbling now for sure.

Update next month awaited.

[silkywhite] 08/1/2015 15:21

another tick-up and the spread narrows
A serious lurch upwards on the cards

[silkywhite] 08/1/2015 10:11

overhang cleared and we're off

[silkywhite] 07/1/2015 19:45

50,000 buy today

[silkywhite] 07/1/2015 14:27

This stock has been so unfairly treated. Its unjust to lump camk in with the other chinese stocks. The Camkids directors must be at a loss. They have done everything right so far growing the company and paying dividends.

[edmundshaw] 07/1/2015 11:14

Brilliant article.

I should point out also that some brokers do not allow take-up of the scrip dividend (too much paperwork I suppose, and they say you can just buy the shares - with an underlying presumption that a scrip alternative is the same rate as the cash). I myself am out of pocket because Halifax do not offer the scrip alternative. Not a nice feeling.

The thing about dividends is that they need to be consistent. Camkids should concentrate on at least maintaining the cash payout, never mind incremental rises (which can be tiny). The original cash payour may have been set a bit too high, on bad advice, but that is now history and cannot be reversed, so needs to be treated as spilk milk and not cried over.

I caompletely agree that a good year can add an exceptional dividend (like quite a few UK companies - typical in the insurance sector for example). Asian Citrus used to do this before they suffered their weather (+ management imo) problems over the last couple of years.

It would be a shame if the company continue to perform well and the dividend shenanigans affects the share price. Dividends represent a concrete return on investment so I think they are important (though the level less so), but it is after all a relative detail considering the upside potential from true business growth.

[silkywhite] 07/1/2015 10:48

AIM rocked by dividend culture clash
By Andrew Hore | Tue, 30th September 2014 - 09:03
Share this
AIM rocked by dividend culture clash
Children's clothing and footwear company Camkids (CAMK) has followed logistics business China Chaintek (CTEK) in cutting its dividend but dressing this up by offering a higher scrip dividend. Cutting the dividend is a symptom of the problem, which is that the cash dividend levels used to attract investors were too high in the first place.

The management of Chinese companies can't be expected to understand UK investors and even British company management teams will not necessarily comprehend that some shareholders are predominantly interested in growth and others want an income. Investors seeking income would generally prefer a predictable, and hopefully rising, dividend and not one which moves up and down each year - and they do not want additional shares.

A major Chinese shareholder tends to be happy to take shares rather than a cash dividend so they have a different mentality. This is why companies have advisers - they are not there just to sell shares. They should be advising their clients that a steady, progressive payout is better than a rollercoaster dividend. Whether the company listens or not is another matter.

More recently Chinese companies, such as Camkids and China Chaintek, have floated on the back of the fact that they can generate cash and pay dividends. Their brokers have sold the shares to investors on the back of apparently attractive yields. So, it was in the interests of the brokers that the yields were high and their analysts initially predicted that the dividends would be edged up.

Both Camkids and China Chaintek were both growing companies when they floated and that growth requires funding. The advisers should have made sure that there was enough cash being kept in the business so that expected and additional growth opportunities are covered. They will surely have advised the companies on the appropriate level of dividend.
Laughable dividend announcements

The initial problem of too high a dividend has then been compounded by the laughable dividend announcements which believe that the scrip dividend is the main dividend and the cash dividend is just a potential alternative kindly offered by the company.

To quote China Chaintek; "the company will pay an interim scrip dividend of 2 pence or a cash alternative of 1 pence". I may be old fashioned, but to me the cash dividend is the dividend and then shareholders can be offered an alternative of taking the dividend in shares.

Yet again, this is the advisers' fault not the company's. Even if the company thought that this was an acceptable wording then they should have been advised against it. More likely, though, the advisers thought that this was a good way of announcing a cut in the dividend as an unchanged dividend and save face.

On top of this, the amount of cash involved is pretty small with the main Chinese shareholders tending to take their dividend in shares anyway.

China Chaintek, which is advised by Daniel Stewart and previously had ZAI Corporate Finance as nominated adviser, halved its cash dividend to 1p a share, while maintaining the scrip dividend. Based on the take-up of the scrip dividend when the final dividend was paid, and assuming no additional scrip dividend take-up, this will save around £110,000. Halving the final dividend will save a further £220,000.
Cash generation

China Chaintek had more than £40 million in the bank at the end of June 2014 and it has been generating cash, although it does require around £60 million to complete the construction of a new facility by 2016. Additional cash will also be required to open regional centres to satisfy e-commerce demand. Previously, Daniel Stewart forecasts suggested that continued cash generation meant that there would be cash left after investing in the new facility.

Similarly, Camkids, which is advised by Allenby, says that it is paying an increased scrip dividend of 2.4p a share or 2p a share cash dividend. The cash saving for Camkids on cutting its interim dividend by 0.3p a share is £231,000 - if everybody took cash. The main 66.9% shareholder took shares last time and, although he says he will not increase his percentage shareholding he is likely to take most of the dividend in shares again, this suggests that in reality less than £80,000 would be saved by Camkids.

Camkids had net cash of £48.6 million at the end June 2014, which, at the equivalent to 64p a share, is higher than the share price. Admittedly this is a high point for cash and it is likely to be much lower at the year-end. At the end of 2013, net cash was just over £30 million and Allenby reckons that it should be more than £40 million at the end of this year. Allenby also forecasts cash that is the equivalent of more than £50 million by the end of 2015. It should be noted that RMB/£ exchange rate movements will affect these figures to some degree but the underlying cash figure is expected to increase.
Forward planning needed

It is always right for a company to cut its dividend if it needs to conserve its cash. Both Camkids and China Chaintek do have investment programmes and new opportunities have come along, but the dividend reductions should not have been needed. There should have been enough forward planning to cover these additional opportunities and the dividend should have been set accordingly. A special dividend could be paid if the company had more cash than it required.

Admittedly, these dividends may have helped to sell the shares but they have not helped to hold up the share price. This will have disappointed the management teams and there is a suspicion that this could be why they may not be keen to continue to pay the previous level of cash dividend. However, much of the share price weakness has been due to stock overhangs - something that the adviser needs to manage.

If these companies increase the cash dividend next year there will be no confidence that it will not be cut again the following year, thereby negating the attraction to investors seeking a steady income stream.

It is very easy to attack Chinese companies when things go wrong, and there are additional pitfalls to investing in any non-UK company, but in reality it is the advisers' promises that attract the companies to AIM. If their advice is poor then it is the company and the investor that lose out.

[silkywhite] 07/1/2015 10:45

www.mbnews.it/2014/12/fitfoodness-camkids-expo-2015-i-corretti-stili-di-vita-si-imparano-a-scuola/

camkids expo 2015

its all going to start kicking off here soon

[silkywhite] 07/1/2015 10:24

buyers coming in now, this is the most undervalued stock anywhere

[philjeans] 06/1/2015 17:04

All agreed silky - just anti-Chinese sentiment holding back buyers.

But you pushed them up 1p today - so keep it up my son!

[silkywhite] 06/1/2015 15:04

another chinese stock tnci have just bought out shareholders at 20p when the shares were just 4.5p

camk may well do the same seeing the rediculous valuation in the aim market today

[silkywhite] 06/1/2015 15:02

great chart