Smith (ds) Share Discussion Threads

[tnt99] 11/4/2024 18:30

435 mondi bid ??!!

[tnt99] 10/4/2024 21:18

Incoming repost me thinks from mondi you know it makes sense

[buyzantium] 08/4/2024 20:47

LLB - Thank you. Most helpful.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 08/4/2024 18:11

#Buyzantium, AFAIAA, with an active W8-BEN in place some ISA providers deduct -15% (II/HL/AJB), some -30% (banks), holdings inside a SIPP are tax exempt, but the US do not recognise the ISA wrapper for tax free status..

IF IP have a dual listing on the NYSE/LSE then income will be taxed if income originates from the US parent (dividends in USD), IF IP list in London as a separate company for SMDS and run it stand alone if they win then GBP income would be tax free inside an ISA, and holders would not need a W8-BEN..

[buyzantium] 08/4/2024 17:43

I too continue to hold in an ISA. Reference my posting 4570 I am hoping that those with greater knowledge might clarify the taxsituation as to dividends in an ISA should IPC achieve a listing in the UK.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 08/4/2024 16:20

#Buyzantium, thanks for sharing that, a twist in the events, and the primary reason I did not want to hold their paper was due to the WHT of -30% US income..

[buyzantium] 08/4/2024 16:15

International Paper said last week that it would pursue a secondary listing of its shares in London if it succeeded in its bid for DS Smith.

[anhar] 08/4/2024 14:40

I continue to hold.

[jeffian] 07/4/2024 15:50

Aye, but they're not offering any of it to us! (At least, not yet).

[tnt99] 07/4/2024 09:35

Hopefully mondi increase their offerThey must know its worth it And after the sale of the Russian assets they have pleanty of cash

[grahamg8] 04/4/2024 18:12

Risk growing, reward shrinking. Sold the lot and sleep better tonight.

[1knocker] 04/4/2024 14:39

I put in a 405 limit order as soon as the counter bid was announced, to sell a third of my holding, which triggered today at 405.45.

It looks as though a deal will go through, and possibly at better than 415, but this is a crazy market and i am happy to have s decent price banked on a third and run the remaining two thirds.

[meanreverter] 04/4/2024 14:15

IP's bold statement regarding synergies seems aimed at its own shareholders to persuade them of the merits of its bid. The numbers are indeed persuasive, and I don't expect IP to get cold feet. Mondi can see this too, of course. At the present pre-market-opening price, IP's bid is worth just £4. So, at £4.08 now, London is expecting a positive response by IP's shareholders when New York opens.

[moorsie2] 04/4/2024 14:13

market is now expecting 415 to be the tops and Mondi missing out - hence the sell off from 415 his afternoon and Mondi rising.

A good swing to value and commodity stocks in April would see IP rise above the offer price so the value on offer being more than the indicated 415

[anhar] 04/4/2024 12:45

IP statement just issued



means that the PUSU deadline for both potential offers is now 23 April, though this can be extended by the Takeover Panel. I intend to sell in the market at some stage as I've said because I don't want either bidder's paper, but continue to hold for the time being in case of some positive developments as there's no rush.

Doing nothing is often the optimum strategy.

[ygor705] 04/4/2024 09:54

In my view, the Smith's Directors probably cut a sweet heart deal with Mondi that was not necessarily in the best interests of shareholders (as usual). The IP bid has likely caught them completely napping and sent shock waves around the Board Room. The most telling comment I've heard on this Board is that IP have to get this deal done for reasons of scale and capacity need. It will be slow going from here, but I agree that there could be much more to come.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 04/4/2024 09:07

#Peart, that is my view also, I am watching from the sidelines for now risk off, I do not want IP paper due to the US-WHT on the dividends, but will see where the MNDI bid goes, being exposed EURO dividends and an FX swap when it lands here in our UK accounts is not great, but way more palatable if buyers want hold or add..

[moorsie2] 04/4/2024 08:20

Smds board flirting with all the girls

[peart] 04/4/2024 07:49

Agreed Laurence. Either that or simply choosing to not expose their hand, thus forcing IP to consider paying more, as if Mondi walk away they don't want a competitor to get a great deal, they would want that competitor to pay more, as in they keep negotiating and force IP'S hand to put in a knock out bid, then they walk away. (thus weakening a competitor who has had to pay over the odds for an asset...)
All in the chances of a higher bid have just gone up imho.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 04/4/2024 07:06

Mondi deadline extended to 23rd to allow for continued discussions, so reading between the lines, more time to increase their offer in the light of the IP bid..?

[dexdringle] 01/4/2024 10:33

As a Mondi shareholder, I'm really hoping they get off the pot...

[moorsie2] 01/4/2024 09:30

Let's see what Thursday by 5pm brings.... Sh1t or get off the pot time for Mondi

[anhar] 31/3/2024 14:02

MC: ...My wife suggested that when I sell I no longer check SMDS share price but I said by doing that I fail to learn from the experience...

I agree with your wife, never look back in this situation, you'll learn nothing or even something misleading because as Binliner says, there's no right or wrong here with either an early sale of SMDS or hanging on for a higher price. More a question of your risk appetite, the "bird in the hand" argument.

Having been here many times in an all share bid where I don't want the bidder's paper, the only thing I've learned is as I said, there's no hurry so I always hang on for a while in case a higher bid arrives. If it doesn't you probably haven't lost anything by selling a bit later, particularly with an agreed bid where failure to complete is very unlikely.

[laurence llewelyn binliner] 30/3/2024 14:43

#MCunliffe1, stopping a 30% WHT inside an ISA from US income is a no-go for me, I have been there and spent 2 years looking for workarounds arguing with Smart Investor on this point, the only way you can recover it is to get a tax document from your provider then declare the dividends on your self assessment and get a credit against taxes paid which I will be trying to do next month..

It is a PITA to have to do it inside an ISA wrapper which the US do not recognise, I was only 2/10 years into my holding here and try to keep things as simple as I can now, that said I took 121 pence per share out on a total return measure which helped ease the pain.. :o)

We will see if MNDI want it more than IP soon enough..

[mcunliffe1] 30/3/2024 14:25

If IP end up paying the div there may be a withholding tax applied. My research tells me 15% of any such tax can be reclaimed through HMRC as we have an agreement with the US on double-taxation.

However, people on this (or maybe the TAX) thread have indicated some platforms/banks/brokers withhold 30%.

I'm disinclined to come back in if IP are running the show.