Phoenix Share Discussion Threads

[rcturner2] 23/6/2014 06:46

Silky, your posts don't seem to make much sense. Are you trolling or are you genuinely interested in Phoenix?

[silkywhite] 22/6/2014 17:08

hvs
I don't think this stock is as risky as you are making out. Read jonwig's post and then DYOR. Good luck.

[hvs] 22/6/2014 16:46

lol !!!!!!

May I remind it was U who said "Thinking of buying " but then it needs a brain to think.

[jonwig] 22/6/2014 14:35

silky - "DYOR" indeed!

I don't know of any high-yielding instruments that PHNX is holding! Indeed, gilts are a big part of its capital backing.

The two reasons why PHNX can pay these dividends are (a) pretty high gearing (which, though reduced, is part-reason for the low rating) and, (b) its ability to extract cashflows from its policies.

Originally, PHNX was designed to be a consolidator of such policies, but that was proving difficult thanks to the debt. There's a good chance they can now follow up this strategy, which *ought* to help with a re-rating.

And, btw, no share is "buy and forget".

[silkywhite] 22/6/2014 13:03

Thanks hvs thats what I thought as well.
It WILL tank big-time because the value of all these high yielding instruments PHNX hold will plunge through the floor.

[silkywhite] 22/6/2014 08:23

great yield here. Thinking of buying but is this a buy and forget share or will it tank if the eurozone crisis resurfaces. OK I know it will probably tank along with everything else but is it a fundamentally sound company?

[mister md] 20/6/2014 20:42

similar odd closing prices at HSD and CLIG

[lonrho] 20/6/2014 16:44

what happened in auction about £4 million traded at about 10p below price 5 minutes earlier.

[chizgreen68] 19/6/2014 10:52

me too. I have to resist buying too many, it looks such an attractive investment

[scottishfield] 19/6/2014 10:51

little top up here this morning, while the opportunity is here.

[philo124] 18/6/2014 22:39

De Naga amigos.

[scottishfield] 18/6/2014 22:31

yes, tks Phil

[lynton3] 18/6/2014 22:08

Many thanks Phil!

[philo124] 18/6/2014 16:35

6.75% yield based on share price of 800p. Improvement in credit rating; move towards more long term bond financing. 2014E MCEV/share 45% cf. Friends 25%. At 800p would be at 30& discount. Hope that helps.

[philo124] 18/6/2014 14:35

Greetings from Malaga here lunch is slowly moving along.
Just checked and still have note. 6.75% yield confident on making cash generation forecasts, discount to peers, discount to something else; will try to post later.

[hvs] 18/6/2014 13:44

Date Company Name Broker Rec. Price Old target price New target price Notes
18 Jun 14 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 800.00 800.00 Reiterates
17 Apr 14 Phoenix Group... Berenberg Hold 639.25 750.00 750.00 Reiterates
31 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 800.00 Reiterates
28 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Deutsche Bank Hold 639.25 775.00 775.00 Reiterates
26 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 865.00 Reiterates
24 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 865.00 Reiterates
20 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 865.00 Reiterates
20 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... Barclays Capital Underweight 639.25 613.00 571.00 Reiterates
05 Mar 14 Phoenix Group... JP Morgan Cazenove Overweight 639.25 915.00 915.00 Resumes
07 Jan 14 Phoenix Group... JP Morgan Cazenove Overweight 639.25 - - Resumes
16 Dec 13 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 865.00 Reiterates
11 Dec 13 Phoenix Group... Canaccord Genuity Buy 639.25 865.00 865.00

[lynton3] 18/6/2014 09:42

Phil - I hold quite a few of these, and can't understand why they have not recovered from the Budget hit (I also hold Friends/Resolution which has come back quite nicely). Do you have a link to the Canaccord re-iteration, or can you provide anymore detail on their rating?

Thanks

[scottishfield] 18/6/2014 08:22

great, tks Philo

[philo124] 18/6/2014 08:07

Crossed into SIPP. Canaccord 800p target re-iteration after meeting with them ; fwiw.

[ursus] 13/6/2014 12:02

When he sold 22m in November last (after the end of the Swiss Re talks), he undertook not to sell the remaining 13m for about 120 days I think. That expired in Apr14 and he left the board (not before time) at the agm.

[gary1966] 13/6/2014 11:52

Ursus,

Is there anything in the public domain that suggests he is going to sell?

How many shares does he own?

TIA

Gary

[ursus] 13/6/2014 11:39

There is another factor - the presumably impending sale of his remaining shares by the dear departed non-exec, Mr Dale

[m1das_touch] 13/6/2014 10:20

Gary1966 - I think they're mainly unloved because of the regulatory uncertainty surrounding life & pension funds etc. But as the IC article makes clear, Phoenix is likely to be little impacted by the FCA review.

Likewise I'm happy to hold and take the chunky dividend. I even hold some in my spread-bet account. So with financing costs of 3% and a historic dividend yield of 8.4%, it's equivalent to a dividend yield net of financing of around 26%! (i.e. based on the 20% margin I'm required to put down) This finances all of my non-yielding spread-bets and ties up very little capital. Makes sense to me :)

[gary1966] 13/6/2014 09:14

Not sure why this is a little unloved at the moment but happy to take the dividend in the meantime.