Patisserie Share Discussion Threads

[topvest] 24/3/2019 18:13

Everyone who invested in this have learned a valuable life lesson. When something looks too good to be true it probably is (i.e Patval had double the relative profitability versus Greggs, Costa Coffee and Starbucks) despite only selling cake and a pot of tea, mostly to pensioners. Put it down to experience is what I would say, although I feel for those who lost a lot.

[topvest] 24/3/2019 18:09

AssetCo is another where GT are appealing have to pay over £21m.

[pugugly] 23/3/2019 11:47

the only case I am aware of where shareholders have recovered cash in the case of fraud was that of Izodia - formerly Infobank where some cash was recovered by in a case brought by the Serious Fraud Office and paid out to shareholders in Izodia at the aplicable date.

However may not be applicable here unless there is a pot of concealed funds yet to be revealed.

[masurenguy] 23/3/2019 11:36

Forget any ideas of suing anyone for compensation - you're just throwing more money away. What is more to the point is when criminal charges will be made and against whom!

[lefrene] 22/3/2019 17:28

It's no good suing an entity unless they have the money to pay you. Tesco despite it's 'clever' accounting did and does have access to very large sums, and the ability to raise cash against assets. CAKE appears to have a negative value circa £80 million, unless you plan to sue Mr Johnson for his stunning carelessness? He being the mercurial type, has quite likely taken appropriate steps to cover his backside. But good luck.

[sleepy] 22/3/2019 13:31

Dudishes - thank you. Do you know how a shareholder became eligible for a refund?

[dudishes] 21/3/2019 09:14

Forgot, Fine was £129M I believe.

[sleepy] 20/3/2019 12:05

Thank Gustav. Which Tesco shareholders benefited?

[gustavfenk] 19/3/2019 07:41

A precedent here would be the compensation scheme set up for shareholders after the Tesco accounting fraud scandal. The difference is that Tesco survived the scandal and actually had some money to compensate the shareholders, whereas PV is bust. However if the auditors could be held liable then there are some funds available that could be distributed.

[effortless cool] 19/3/2019 07:13

Sleepy,

I'm just the barrack room variety of lawyer, but I don't think it would make any difference. Anyone buying after the publication of the audited results should have been able to rely on the auditor's work, the same as anyone holding at the time of publication.

[sleepy] 18/3/2019 23:50

Perhaps a lawyer could respond but a case against the auditors might be more likely to succeed if taken by someone who held the shares at the time the auditors produced their last audit report?

[diku] 18/3/2019 23:15

If for example somebody bought shares in this company say around 425p just before suspension whilst underlining the fraud was going unknown to them...do they have a recourse against Directors and the auditors for a full refund?...

[konradpuss] 18/3/2019 11:47

Agreed. A branch or two in every major city. Not one on every high street.

[thegreatgeraldo] 18/3/2019 11:26

Have to assume that the original, long established PV had some juicy margins.... the idea just doesn't seem to have been suited to mass roll-out across the country..... that should have been obvious fairly early on, surely?

[sandy133] 18/3/2019 11:13

The big question here remains will KPMG have left sufficient cash for someone to take proceedings against GT?

These thing always cost lots of cash, KPMG did say that there might be case against the auditor but that they were prevented from doing anything by the conflict of interest.

Given what has come out I suspect that sadly the Auditors got it wrong very early on and never picked it up again.

Knowing Luke a bit I do not think he was involved save for if he was half the businessman he thought he was he should have worked out that this was not a profitable business.I will be very interested if the buyer can make it pay.

[konradpuss] 18/3/2019 10:51

I think the circa £2K per week could be mostly the double counting of the Groupon vouchers.

[lefrene] 18/3/2019 10:10

It probably hasn't made a true profit since flotation, but real money in the form of borrowings has plainly flowed through it, or perhaps around it on its way to elsewhere. The £94 million blackhole works out at roughly £2k per week per shop over 5 years. So was somebody managing to double account for weekly takings across the whole business? It will probably be something simple that was hiding in plain sight, as it appears to have gone on from the get-go. One looks forward to the next instalment, better than a who-dunnit.

[konradpuss] 17/3/2019 23:30

I am not sure the money was ever there.

Did the company net, net ever make any money?

[eeza] 17/3/2019 23:22

Will the truth ever see the light of day, though.

Vested interests are always the stumbling block. Money usually talks loudest.

[lefrene] 17/3/2019 23:10

eeza, how interesting, as LJ was supplying a lot of stuff to PV from his other businesses, could there possibly be any connection I wonder? No of course not, but I wonder if HMRC are going to check out the accounts of his other activities?

Where will the missing £millions have flown I wonder?

PS. Banks in Helsinki are quite used to persons of Russian appearance turning up with suitcases full of cash. No questions are asked :¬) Never mind those bank robbers cutting through that wall, this has the potential makings of a much better film! :¬)

[eeza] 17/3/2019 21:31

"Patisserie Valerie shareholders are threatening to take the collapsed chain’s administrators KPMG to court to get hold of a devastating report alleged to show how the company’s cash balances were artificially inflated.

Produced by forensic accountants at PwC, the document is alleged to detail a suspected fraud running to tens of millions of pounds.

It is claimed to reveal how suppliers provided fake invoices and multi-million pound cheques were submitted to bolster the company’s finances........."

[diku] 16/3/2019 23:19

Was the cake really a cake?...

[meijiman] 16/3/2019 12:12

Action should be taken against Grant Thornton senior people for their incompetence..agree with 3079

[tradejunkie2] 16/3/2019 11:53

Commiserations to shareholders.

Wonder how such a black hole occurred was it caused by aliens from space?

Kitty cat out.