Lloyds Banking Share Discussion Threads

[diku] 11/12/2020 09:10

Trying to copy what others are doing is no guide to a guaranteed success...

[extrovert] 11/12/2020 09:08

Australian Prime Minister saying Britain should be careful what they wish for when opting for an Australian type deal intimating that it could be a lot worse than the deal they already have.

[renewed1] 11/12/2020 09:08

Dividends back on....forget brexit....should be over 40p with 2p next year and possibly 3p following.

[informant] 11/12/2020 09:07

Now it’s impossible for Boris to agree a deal. Let the EU sink. We will not agree to their outrageous demands

[alex1621] 11/12/2020 09:02

I'd guess to holders, any other approach would be an administrative nightmare.

[edward hopper] 11/12/2020 09:01

If a 2020 divi is paid out, will it be paid to shareholders who were registered at the record date in 2020, or will it go to the current shareholders? I can?t find any mention of that in the statement.

Lordbung It will be current shareholders ,thats how the cookie crumbles.

[maxk] 11/12/2020 08:54

Well, it's made it's point!


Made ours too .. now it's impossible for Doris to pull a fast one :-)

[grahamite2] 11/12/2020 08:52

Has the EU deliberately sabotaged the talks?

No country in the world gives up up its marine resources. No country promises to follow another's rules in perpetuity. It is hard to avoid the conclusion that Brussels is making these demands *precisely because* they are palpably unreasonable. It wants to make a point. (Daniel Hannan)

[crazi] 11/12/2020 08:38

Then divi's Frozen again for 2021 - until the PRA say so otherwise!

I also can't find any info on who qualifies for 2020 but I expect they will provide a date during end year results to give people a chance at that stage to buy and qualify. That's what Santander did anyway...

[lordbung] 11/12/2020 08:36

If a 2020 divi is paid out, will it be paid to shareholders who were registered at the record date in 2020, or will it go to the current shareholders? I can?t find any mention of that in the statement.

[maxk] 11/12/2020 08:33

The vindictive EU harms itself by turning Brexit into a punishment

Leaving without a deal would at least force the UK to decide what to do with its new-found sovereignty


JEREMY WARNER
10 December 2020 • 9:30pm
Jeremy Warner






Can’t we do this amicably in a way that is least damaging to both of us, our bank accounts, and the children? How many times have divorce lawyers heard this plea, only for the supposedly injured party to say no, I’m taking this all the way, and if it ends up bankrupting us, you know who to blame?

Divorce is rarely entirely cordial, and at the very least, it is almost always costly. Often, it is vindictive. As a metaphor for Britain’s departure from the European Union, it has perhaps already been stretched to the point of virtual destruction. Yet as we approach Brexit’s final denouement, now very probably just days or even hours away, it is very hard to see things in any other light.

The unstoppable force of Brexit has met the immovable object of the European Union, and a nasty economic pile up is now in prospect. That this is going to be damaging to both parties – certainly in the short run, and arguably longer term too – shouldn’t by now be in any doubt. All trade is economically beneficial, even when it results in a deficit. Anything that puts barriers in the way, as the EU now seems intent on doing in some shape or form, is by definition bound to be bad for both parties.

That it will be worse for us than it is for them is a matter of widely held belief on the Continent. Yet it is also another example of false comfort being drawn from aggregate thinking.

If the EU is viewed as a single country, then it is entirely true that it is not as dependent on us for its output as we are on them. But for certain country-specific and politically influential sectors, the end of tariff and quota free trade with the UK threatens to be extremely painful, piling the agony on an already Covid poleaxed economy.

Volkswagen and BMW are not going to thank Angela Merkel for putting principled defence of the “integrity of Europe’s single market” ahead of ease of doing business with their largest export market. On the whole, Germans do admittedly continue to have a high degree of commitment to the machinery of the EU; they have after all done very well out of it. But there is only so long you can subvert the national interest to that of the EU bureaucracy, only so long that you can keep saying “ask not what Brussels can do for you, only what you can do for Brussels”.


A prosperous Britain is as important to the future prosperity of Europe as it is to the UK itself. That Brussels should seek to undermine it in punishment for Brexit damages its own self interest as much as that of Britain.

To any rational, thinking person, it is completely ludicrous that free trade talks should founder on a principle as fungible and open to interpretation as maintenance of “level playing field” arrangements.

Europe has almost never operated a level playing field. The closest it ever came to it was when the bloc was just a handful of countries of broadly similar income and social security arrangements, and even back then, things were about as level as the Scottish highlands.

“You scratch my back and I’ll scratch yours” backroom deals and trade-offs have always offered a high degree of protection and competitive advantage for particular national interests.

In any case, any pretence at free and fair competition between comparable economies disappeared the moment the EU opened its doors to Europe’s outer reaches. Where were the level playing field constraints on German car manufacturers shifting production to low cost Eastern Europe, or indeed cheap Eastern European labour overwhelming the more prosperous European north? Levelling down, rather than up, became the unintended consequence of the day.

As it is, the UK has some of the most taxing environmental, animal welfare and labour market standards in Europe, with one of the highest minimum wages and now by far the most ambitious target for reducing greenhouse gases.

Perhaps Brussels is right to fear the creation of a low cost, low tax sweatshop on its own doorstep, but if that’s the view, it is almost wholly unsupported by the evidence. There is no majority political constituency in Britain for that kind of future. If it ever came to pass, it would ironically be made more likely by a no-deal outcome, with Europe’s supposed tariff protections arbitraged away by UK currency adjustment and tax breaks to attract international investment. If there was ever a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face, the EU is it.

As in all divorces, there is admittedly an element of six of one, half a dozen of the other in all this. On the EU’s current negotiating stance, Britain is faced with either the certainty of Europe’s external tariffs on day one of leaving the single market, or the prospect of them at some stage in the future if it materially diverges. For the life of me, I struggle to see why the latter course is so objectionable.

[utyinv] 11/12/2020 08:33

Looks like the decision by BoE to restrict banks from paying dividends has been lifted. Report from the Evening Standard:
Yesterday, the Bank helped the banking sector with an end to the ban on their paying dividends. As CMC’s Michael Hewson asked: “If a no deal is as damaging as Andrew Bailey says it could be, surely the Bank of England would have delayed any decision on this until next month?”
Why wasn’t this news published by the main media with the same fanfare as when they announced the ban? We are fed news that the ‘powers be’, want us to be aware of. Proves to me that much of the news is Government and establishment propaganda, as if we didn’t already know.

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 08:17

So continue Boycott on the goods and services of the EUSSR.Soon a time coming of greater consideration to other global suppliers anyway.No DealWTOLiberty

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 08:15

Marc Marcjf11 Dec 2020 8:11AMBrexit was always going to be a war without bullets.The Uk was always going to be punished to ensure no one else left. This is nothing to do with economics and everything to do with realpolitik. If you understand this you can see that talks were always doomed to fail and that the EU would always treat the UK as a rogue vassal province and deal with it in bad faith.The rest is just fluff and nonesense

[scruff1] 11/12/2020 08:03

For anyone interested. I was saying yesterday about a friend of mine who received four bottles of quality wine fromone of his investment co's. He tells me it was investec. Each of the areas where they have offices send the wine to the chosen investors. They then had a quiz about fine wines through Zoom. The Manchester group won the quiz. Pretty obvious outcome I guess being the most cultured of regions! Just need to sort THE manchester footy team out now.

[boxerdogz] 11/12/2020 07:57

GBP dropping pre open USD
Oil up 0.6%

Lloyds today should end the day 4-5 % down in anticipation of No Deal Sunday

Monday major sell off

[scruff1] 11/12/2020 07:55

xxxxx
Thats the sorry thing - it could. Its crackers that they never intended to negotiate. The penny may just finally drop how ridiculous they have been. Micron stcking his oar inlast min. 'If you dont give us the status quo I'm going to put all my fishermen out of business and severely damage large parts of the EU economy. That will show them Brits' Smart. I can understand why he calls himself 'a different sort' of politiciam

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 07:26

Had over 4 years to sort. And don't expect a few dinners to sort. Shows how dull the EUSSR is.EUSSR is an increasingly irrelevant place in the Global consideration.No DealWTOLiberty

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 07:03

Brexiteers warn deal needs more than 24 hours' scrutiny as they prepare to sit through ChristmasUK ratification must take place by December 31 leading to fears the window for parliamentary scrutiny could be cut shortByLucy Fisher, DEPUTY POLITICAL EDITOR10 December 2020 • 7:34pm... Daily Telegraph

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 07:01

Brexit UK now two steps closer to joining trade bloc to overtake EUThe great Brexit trade news just keeps on coming?© Brexit Facts4EU.Org 2020Globe-trotting Trade Sec Truss secures two more significant post-Brexit dealsBrexit Britain just can't stop coming out with great trade news. Another £23 billion of trade with Singapore and Vietnam – sorted. Fresh on the heels of our report on Wednesday showing that the UK now has trading arrangements in place with more than 100 countries, the Secretary of State for the Dept for International Trade announced yesterday that she has signed a trade deal with Singapore and today she will be signing with Vietnam.Here is what International Trade Secretary, Liz Truss, had to say:"Both these agreements are vital for the UK's future as an independent trading nation. Not only do they lock in billions of pounds worth of trade, they also pave the way for new digital partnerships and joining the Trans-Pacific Partnership. This will play to the UK's strengths, as we become a hub for tech and digital trade with influence far beyond our shores, defining our role in the world for decades to come.?"This is an important part of our vision for a Global Britain that sits at the centre of a network of deals with dynamic nations across Asia Pacific and the Americas as a global hub for services and technology trade."- Liz Truss, UK International Trade Secretary, Singapore, 10 Dec 2020On the road to joining the most populous trading bloc in the WorldThe agreements with Singapore and Vietnam mark another step towards the UK joining the Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP). Both countries are members and both have said publicly that we would like the UK to join. This trading bloc already has 14% more consumers than the EU.BREXIT FACTS4EU.ORG SUMMARYThe CPTPP compared to the EU27The population of the CPTPP countries is 508 millionThe population of the EU27 is 445 millionWhen the UK joins the CPTPP, the combined population will rise to 575 millionThat will be 29% more than that of the EU27?© Brexit Facts4EU.Org - click to enlargeWhat is the CPTPP?The Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP) is a free trade agreement between 11 countries in the Asia-Pacific region: Australia, Brunei, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam. Seven of these countries are already parties to the agreement, with the others going through domestic ratification processes.Brexit Facts4EU.Org analysed the economic opportunity for the United Kingdom. Our research shows :-The 11 current signatories accounted for 12.9% of global GDP in 2019This would rise to 16.2% if the UK were to joinIf South Korea joins, the CPTPP would have 18.0% of global GDPThe EU27's share is 17.9% and fallingAs can be seen above, if the UK joins, the CPTPP will be snapping at the heels of the EU in terms of share of the global economy. A key factor to bear in mind is that many of the countries in the CPTPP have much higher growth rates than the EU27. In addition, several more countries are in the wings.The United Kingdom formally declared its interest in 2018, and this has already been welcomed by several members. The other countries which have made formal announcements include China, Colombia, Indonesia, Philippines, South Korea, Taiwan, and Thailand. If the UK and, say, South Korea joined, the CPTTP's combined economies would exceed those of the EU27.What's the current state of play for Brexit Britain's trading relationships?"In under two years we have agreed trade deals with 57 countries that account for £193bn of UK bilateral trade. This is unprecedented. No other country has ever negotiated so many trade deals simultaneously. The Government's ambition is to secure free trade agreements with countries that cover 80% of UK trade within three years."- Department for International Trade, 10 Dec 2020For more details see our article on Wednesday here.OBSERVATIONSThese two trade deals with Singapore and Vietnam are yet another blow to Remainers who for years have been talking down their own country.This latest news brings the number of UK trade deals to 57. Toghether with the continuation of trade arrangements with another 47 developing countries, this brings the overall tally of countries with whom trading arrangements are in place to 104.The persistent narrative from the Remain establishment over the last few years has been that somehow no-one would want to trade with the world's fifth-largest economy. Well, not only have countries around the world been lining up, a great number have been putting their signatures on official agreements.It is perfectly true that many of these deals roll over existing arrangements, but they also have improvements which are aligned to the UK's economic interests. And significantly these latest two deals make the accession of the UK to the Trans-Pacific trading bloc even more likely, as both the signatories are also members of that club.And Boris?Today we have nothing to add to the media speculation about the state of play in the UK-EU trade talks. Tomorrow we hope to publish a summary of where we are with the EU and what we believe needs to be done.In the meantime we thought we should report on yet more good news for Brexit Britain.[ Sources: UK Department for International Trade | CPTPP Commission | UN population data | IMF GDP data ] Politicians and journalists can contact us for details, as ever.Brexit Facts4EU.Org, Fri 11 Dec 2020

[xxxxxy] 11/12/2020 06:58

Remain economic forecasts left in shredsBy JOHNREDWOOD | Published: DECEMBER 11, 2020The Treasury and other pro Remain economic institutions told us before the vote that if we voted to leave the following would happen. There would be a big loss of jobs. House prices would tumble. There would be a large loss of output. The pound would fall. This would happen as a result of the vote – they did not say it would only happen after we had left. When their forecasts proved to be wildly wrong., they then shifted their ground and said some of these same effects on a smaller scale would happen after we have left.So what did happen and what will happen next year?Employment surged from 2016 to early 2020, with employment rising from 74% to 76.5% of the potential workforce, with continuing inward migration increasing the size of the workforce at the same time. The CV 19 hit still leaves it higher than in 2016 prior to the vote.House prices continued to rise in cash terms throughout the period post the vote.GPD growth remained satisfactory from mid 2016 until the CV 19 disaster this yearThe pound fell from $1.42 to $1.31 shortly after the vote, but went back up to $1.42 by April 2018. It has fluctuated since and is currently at $1.33.What will happen after we have left the single market and customs union?According to official forecasts from forecasters known for their belief in the advantages of the single market, the UK economy will experience the sharpest rate of improvement in 2021 it has seen for decades. The CBI thinks we will grow a lively 6% in 2021 and a further 5.2% in 2022. Oxford Economics thinks we will grow by more than 10% next year and outgrow other European economies and the USA by a large margin.So our first year as an independent nation will likely see a great growth rate, contrary to expectations. Of course the pandemic has a lot to do with this, but it just shows how wrong the pessimistic forecasts of the Remain forecasters proved to be. They themselves are now forecasting a much better outcome in 2021.

[k38] 11/12/2020 02:58

FDA YET TO DECIDE WHETHER TO APPROVE PFIZER BIONTECH VACCINECOMES AFTER SIX DIE IN PFIZER VACCINE TRIALS, FOUR HAD PLACEBO.andUK WARNS PEOPLE WITH ALLERGIES AGAINST USING PFIZER JAB

[huffy44] 11/12/2020 00:27

The Oven ready deal I believe only referred to the Withdrawal Agreement not the Trade agreements that are being discussed now.

The Australia trade deal is just WTO terms Is it not? I feel the change of wording comes down to the fact it is better now to say we are going for an Australian trade agreement rather than say NO Deal. So I think that is why it was referred to being just semantics when questioned on it.

No Deal was all but done Wednesday night I feel. So we are likely heading for Australian style or if the EU want to horse trade on the fishing and are prepared to drop their controlling demands we may just get Canadian, that’s the best we can hope for I feel.