Lloyds Banking Share Discussion Threads

[alphorn] 24/6/2019 09:46

There are plenty of quotes about democracy.

This one is quite good - Two Cheers for Democracy: one because it admits variety and two because it permits criticism. Two cheers are quite enough: there is no occasion to give three.

I wonder how many of the countries 'freed' this century btw feel democratic today?

[maxk] 24/6/2019 09:46

Pointless.

[gotnorolex] 24/6/2019 09:46

I've just seen my preferred candidate for PM Hunt taking a photo-op on a fishing vessle's bridge! He sits hurriedly on the rib console, grabs the ship to shore PTT mic and promptly puts it to his ear pretending to eavesdrop on a coast guard conversation. If the cartoonists know better, I wonder what they will make of it! What a plonker!

[mr.elbee] 24/6/2019 09:45

No one said you were not leaving on WTO terms either. This is just silly Nick Clegg type sixth form stuff. You are a bright lad. Surely you can do better than just parrot the lies and distortion of deeply flawed individuals who run the media.?

and the Irish border issue was and is an entire stitch up since there is repeated visual and aural documented evidence from the EU, Eire and the UK that

THERE IS NO PROBLEM.

No the media is now basing itself on the basic stupidity and refusal to think logically that seems to be the mindset of the average remainer.

[alex1621] 24/6/2019 09:43

No one said that if you vote leave you are voting to do so on WTO terms, with no transition arrangements, and inevitable ongoing disputes with the EU, not to mention serious issues around the Irish border. No one on the Leave side, and no one on the Remain side.

[mr.elbee] 24/6/2019 09:43

"as no Brexit organisation campaigned for this"
Well they did because there was no mention whatever of transition, or a deal or any other mumbo jumbo.

Most ordinary bods that I talk to at Wetherspoons are quite clear about what they voted for,and in the case of certain workers in key EU affected professions,such as Fishing,know a damn sight more than the pathetic "cant be bothered to check out the facts"journos.
More patronising rubbish.Go and talk to some ordinary Brexit voters if you dare ,Alex.They'll very soon put you straight.Because you obviously aren't.

[maxk] 24/6/2019 09:38

alex.

When Call Me Dave sent out that expensive brochure to every household in britain. It spelled it out in clear english.

If you vote to leave, you leave everything..It was meant to scare, didnt work.

[maxk] 24/6/2019 09:31

Yep, #262431 spot on!

[alex1621] 24/6/2019 09:31

The problem I have with Brexit, is not the exit itself, but the attempt by Brexiteers to engineer it on WTO terms without a transition ... as no Brexit organisation campaigned for this then no one is entitled to make the claim that "this is what people voted for" ... so to exit on that basis is, in my view, undemocratic and unrepresentative of the vote. If people truly want that specific outcome, they have to vote for it in a final referendum.

[mr.elbee] 24/6/2019 09:29

very correct analysis

[shy tott] 24/6/2019 09:25

Careful, Redwood has very perceptive views and it's always interesting to read the clarity which which he expresses them. If anyone needs to read what he writes it's you (I don't say you should agree with his views and analysis, as I do, but just read them to broaden your horizons via his brilliant brain.)


Whether you believe in Brexit or not you should support it. It is anti democracy which is certain to destroy our great country, Brexit is meaningless compared to upholding democracy.
I can understand you not liking brxit, that's fine and it's up to you. But not liking democracy I shall never understand.

You reach the exact opposite conclusions to myself about who is dim. I'd say anyone not putting democracy above all else is dim to the point of insane.

[m4rtinu] 24/6/2019 09:18

Waldron - I wish this "Mean consensus" would follow their guidance and buy some shares! :)

[careful] 24/6/2019 09:14

You quote from the impartial 'brexit central' website.
very funny.
Why bother, when the CEO of Jaguar Land Rover and others have put a team on the problem and concluded WTO would be a disaster for his business.

[diku] 24/6/2019 09:11

Lloy on course to hit 55p some time this week?...

[careful] 24/6/2019 09:02

Brexit should not happen for the sake of the future of our country and the Union.

3 years ago today, 48% voted to remain.
today according to most polls it is about 56%.

This is gaining momentum, you will be given an opportunity to change your mind or to confirm your vote.


This thing will die out gradually.
the secret of the whole thing is that we did well out of the EU. without ever being fully in.
Kept our own currency, control 99% of our £800bn spending budget.

All but the very dimmest now understand these facts.

[bbalanjones] 24/6/2019 08:56

The world is moving on - If this can happen so Brexit can be abolished.

[careful] 24/6/2019 08:47

Why bother to re circulate Redwoods verbose opinions.
we can get that sort of second hand stuff anywhere.
Very few read such guff, it is too long.

Redwood always starts with an incorrect fact then builds a long piece after wards.


This time he starts with the growth of the populist movements in the EU.

In the recent eu. elections for about 470 EU. mp's the status quo was strengthened and the populist parties attained disappointing results.

That is why they feel strong enough to be tougher on the UK. and not renegotiate a deal that had been agreed by both parties.

Many commentators believe that the reason the EU. was strengthened was the mess that Brexit has caused in the UK.

If the EU. continue doing the right thing there will be no brexit at all.
Redwood seems unable to grasp that fact.

[bbalanjones] 24/6/2019 08:41

The pretender "King of the Turkeys",being truly caught with his baggy Y-Fronts awry, screams "I was a Great Mayor of London", at which point 15 other Turkeys shout "All YOU did was delegate and leave it to competent Birds"

[xxxxxy] 24/6/2019 08:31

“We don’t believe you” briefing to foreign press in London

By JOHNREDWOOD | Published: JUNE 24, 2019

“We don’t believe you” thunder the people as the EU tells them that their international rules based system is right for people’s lifestyles and aspirations. Populist movements around the EU are voting into office new parties that challenge the EU orthodoxy on austerity, the Euro, climate change, international relations, migration, control of the media and much else. Today there is a row over who should lead the EU as President of the Commission, given the very fractured party base within the new European Parliament.



There is a feeling amongst many voters that the EU does not advance living standards quickly enough. Its insistence on austerity economics through the Maastricht controls coupled with the statement there is no alternative produces the reply “We don’t believe you”



Its failure to control its external borders is allied to a foreign policy that supported Middle Eastern wars that displaced more people. The Dublin Agreement is breaking down, where the original member state offering asylum or a place for an economic migrant is meant to be responsible for housing and looking after them. The issue of migration reveals a growing gap between what the elite think and what the populists want.



The EU dislikes the social media which carries growing criticism of its policies as well as fake news and cyber attacks. The populists are suspicious of the extent to which the EU wants to regulate and control the media, and are scornful of any traditional media who just accept EU spin.



This gulf is not unique to the EU. Similar feelings in the USA led to the defeat of Mrs Clinton and to victory of Trumpism. The UK avoided the collapse of the major parties experienced on the continent in the 2017 General election, thanks to their joint support for Brexit which saved Conservative and Labour.When these parties delayed or deviated from Brexit they collapsed in the European election. In Brazil there has been a populist tide as well.



In the EU it is remarkable how most of the great centre left and centre right parties of the twentieth century have allowed themselves to be wiped out or blown away by new challengers owing to their rigid adherence to the EU and Euro policy mix. French politics is now a contest between En Marche and National Rally, with the Republicans and Socialists also rans. In Italy Lega and Cinque Stelle dominate. Even in Germany, the one big winner from the Euro and EU policy, the SPD and CDU command less than half the vote between them these days.



What has led to this huge destruction? The collapse of living standards at the end of the last decade and the slow growth since has not helped. The mass migrations were unpopular, brought on by backing Middle Eastern wars which displaced many people from their homes. The insistence on the Maastricht criteria and the austerity policies of tax rises and spending cuts have jarred over such a long time period. Ask Gilet Jaune protesters what they want and they will probably say tax cuts. The concentration on dear energy and restrictions on personal mobility to tackle global warming have also caused issues with the populists, visible in the Gilets Jaunes attack on speed cameras and demand for cheaper vehicle fuel.



Throughout the continent many voters disagree with the priorities of European government as well as with its policies.

[maxk] 23/6/2019 23:57

Front pages, shock horror!

[maxk] 23/6/2019 23:45

If we leave, the end is nigh...

[grahamite2] 23/6/2019 23:43

Free = not subject to alien overlords.

[minerve 2] 23/6/2019 23:26

Will his GF be free though?

What do you mean by free?

Please explain.