Iofina Share Discussion Threads

[gadolinium] 31/10/2013 18:06

Hi crosseyed,
no need to apologise here, we welcome questions!

Yes, US-8496815 is the one referred to in the half year RNS.

Gd

[crosseyed] 31/10/2013 17:43

gadolimium,

Thanks for putting me right and the references to your prior posts. In my own defense, IOF only came to my attention a short while ago so I am still in a learning stage.

In the RNS on 25/09/2013 of the Half-Year Results, one of the highlights states...

Awarded US patent for IOsorb(TM) iodine extraction technology.

Is that the patent US-8496815 you refer to? And would that be sufficient to keep competitors at bay from copying IOF's low-cost processing methods?

c

[gadolinium] 31/10/2013 17:00

Further to my posts 9168 and 8806 on the grant progress for Iofina's US patent application US20120034152(Portable system for on-site iodine extaction from an aqueous solution). WET-POD system?

I notice the US patent office (PAIR site) issued an electronic acknowledgement of receipt for the fees payable on this application on 22.10.13. However, I was rather amused by an accompanying letter from Iofina's patent attorney that I reproduce below, note the last line, Ouch!

---------------------------

Dear Sir:

The examiner indicated that claims 1,3, 6-9. 11, 12, 15 and 16 are allowed over the prior art. This recognition of allowable subject matter is acknowledged and appreciated.
However, while the applicant(s) agree(s) that the claims are allowable, the applicant(s) do not concede that the claims are only allowable for the precise reasons stated by the Examiner.
Furthermore, the applicant(s) do not concede that the Examiner's statements are entirely accurate and precise.

Respectfully submitted,
Fay Sharpe LLP

---------------------------

I have not seen a date set yet for publication of the granted patent, but would expect the publication date and granted patent number to be notified shortly. Once published we should then see an RNS from the company. My best guess is publication and RNS at the end of November. I will continue to monitor. As usual you will all be the first to know. LOL

[gadolinium] 31/10/2013 16:54

Crosseyed,
WO2010056864A1 is the PCT filing, the corresponding US patent application is US 20100119438 This application is presently still under examination. The application was the subject of a final-rejection notice on 05.07.12, but the applicant issued a request for continued examination. The application is therefore still under examination on the grounds appealed. The most recent correspondence was a non-final rejection from the US patent examiner issued on 03.10.13, to which the applicant has not yet replied (they have three months to respond). Essentially the patent examiners objections continue to revolve around his objection of obviousness over the prior art.

In summary this is a patent application, NOT a patent. It may or may not be granted, but obviously is facing some difficulty in the face of the patent examiners objections. This application does not cover the Iosorb process, but is older technology.

Iofina's granted (30.07.13) patent US-8496815 covers their iodine recovery business model.

[bobsworth] 31/10/2013 16:48

If as the Janitor says the incoming brine is very soon then an RNS in just a few days time stating commissioned and in production would have been much better rec'd by the market. Nuff said!

[ansana] 31/10/2013 16:36

Remember the Janitor everyone, I thought he had retired but he just sent me this.... I asked him 3 things and having asked around he came back to me with this.

"Moving a plant to their IO2 location is going to be a great move for the
company. Consistent brine, high PPMs, leasing in place, contracts in place,
electricity on site, reduced labor costs, etc.

you musn't be worried about the timing of incoming brine. It could be as early as today (they are hoping it will be!). They anticipate it will be very soon. I think they are on the phone now.

Commissioning is the process of handing the plant over from the construction
team to the operations team"

[1madmarky] 31/10/2013 16:08

Agree Bob, the muted response is because they have not said in production.

[bobsworth] 31/10/2013 15:38

Although Iam fully convinced like the majority on this board, what's needed now to wake this unconvincing market up is the official IOF#2 production data. With summer long gone now, when they added the 8 additional bore holes, what are they waiting for? Especially now they have disclosed the good news that IOF#2 site could accommodate IOF#6!

Also the wording in this mornings RNS "IO#3 iodine extraction plant based on Iofina's WET(R) IOsorb(TM) technology, has now been fully commissioned and is ready to accept brine water upon final approval from the well operator" ,could be wrongly interpreted as possible further delay! Knowing how suspicious the market can be, it would have been much better to delay the RNS by a day or two and announced that the plant is fully commissioned and in production.

[crosseyed] 31/10/2013 15:31

Is this (one of) Iofina's patents, applied for by Thomas M Becker et al in Nov 2008?



c

PS Which also protects IOF from competitiors using their low-cost technology and therefore refutes the view that they need to be opaque about production figures, profitiability, etc.

[the fat controller] 31/10/2013 15:07

noli,
I agree. Hence my point about the PR and Nomad working harder to increase awareness. There was only a limited Ping in September, and a positively tiny Phut in October.

Earn your corn, gentlemen!
TFC

[noli] 31/10/2013 15:00

For an rns of that magnitude the volume is shocking at approx 400k

[superg1] 31/10/2013 14:24

Putting it all into perspective we have the early production data from io1 and 2, which suggests 275 to 300ppm. The NW OK college did samples of 300 ppm.

50k bpd 300ppm 90% yields and 85% up time gives 660mt, for capex of $3m to $5m and opex in the $10 to $15 range, maybe lower at that site.


Sirrocco, $34m forecast spends this year, $15m forecast Q1 14.

$51m capex, intended production increase around 800mt, opex $34 to $38 per kg.


Sirocco shares are available if anyone wants some.

[superg1] 31/10/2013 14:16

Engelo

Yes I thought about that one this morning, commissioning is start up and brine processing, so maybe contradictions in the wording, which we don't need to worry about.

On other points

Re the considerations of io6, plants are made of many component parts and we know in the past they have had to wait for towers. Obviously all parts are needed for a plant, but towers are the big section, so maybe they plan to nick the io6 intended towers, for an additional plant at io2.

It seems to be a simple case of maths for them, as if the io2 extra brine works out at a higher production rate than io6, then best to get that one in first. It could be a combination of things due to using io2 staff, which gets opex down early on. It also buys time for further recruitment for the next plants. Reading between the lines, the main point seems to be that io2 is a lucrative site, and they want to process all the brine there.

Someone did say Titanium towers are on the way/ arrived. That won't be the io3 ones, so maybe those were intended for io6 and will now go to the io2 site.

[phoenix1234] 31/10/2013 12:33

Buy tip

www.shareprophets.advfn.com/views/2254/iofina-buy-at-180p-short-term-target-200p

[engelo] 31/10/2013 12:30

testuser: agree, an absolute milestone: mathematically there won't be any bigger iodine event, ever.

However the downbeat tone of the RNS (presumably deliberate) has muted the effect.
I feel pretty confident that I03 is already producing but the RNS says one more step of approval by the brine owner to come. This sounds absurd: so either IOF hiding a different problem or bad management.

The brine supply is connected at the beginning of the commissioning process but the RNS gives the impression to non specialists that it hasn't happened yet.

With the information that we have the news about I02 is a real positive, but to the mkt IOF have previous form in delays through moving I02, and have never come out with the good news (ie brine rates) that it was thoroughly justified.

[hew] 31/10/2013 12:19

Apart from the confirmation that the rollout is indeed doing that with continued progress on IO4-6, for me the main underlying strength of this morning's RNS lies in the doubling up of what seems likely to form a IO2/6 pairing.

There are the obvious benefits of lower Opex than from separated plants, but it confirms in all respects the business model. Ample brine from the well(s), the Oil Co. providing ample brine (not necessarily quite the same thing), high ppm at that location to exploit, and the whole IO2 operation running sweetly enough to "build on it". A happy ship. Perhaps the staff are bored that things just run - so give them enough for both hands to do!

[crazycoops] 31/10/2013 12:19

john10 - yes. The broad point is that global iodine demand exceeds current supply. US buyers would prefer to buy from a US supplier. Many purchasers are currently having to buy prill when what they really need is mud (Iofina can gain a competitive advantage here). However, the overriding point is that Iofina have ridiculously low opex compared to other producers which means they can gradually take control of the iodine market.

This said, it will be interesting to see IOF's inventory when full year results are published in April/May next year.

[bobbyshilling] 31/10/2013 12:17

I must say I am very impressed by IO3 photographs. For a company the size of IOF to build six plants like that in a year is a real achievement to my mind. I can forgive a delay or two! Good news it seems about IO2 brines. If Superg is correct with his figures (and I have no reason to doubt them), then we are in for some real big production from that plant and possibly IO6 at that location. Good news. It would be nice if the company published some up to date figures from IO2 shortly. They might have their reasons though for not doing so, as they might have been able to give us more info today. Pleased so far though.

[crapcrap] 31/10/2013 11:50

well it gives us newbies a chance to accumulate!

[freshvoice] 31/10/2013 11:25

Very disappointed that this news has not lifted the price. It really is a breakthrough to double the OK plants and potential production.

[scrutable] 31/10/2013 11:05

Obscured by all the snippets of information being collated on this b/b is the increasing awareness that ALL the plants will eventually produce at a level much higher than expectations six months ago and at even lower opex than previously allowed for. I seem to remember CF hinting at the last PI presentation of opex below $10. Am I remembering correctly? We can I believe already say that today with confidence of IO#2 and IO#3.

I don't think it will be long before 6-8 commissionings at 400-600mT will be ascribed to 2014 instead of the cautious 300 mT in current spread sheets.

[neddo] 31/10/2013 11:00

just how can iof still be under the so called radar, these other companies are not daft, they know the competition , doesn#t seem to be troubling them too much? with the good news this morning , just what does it take to send the share price up, ?