Firstgroup Share Discussion Threads

[seccol] 26/6/2013 15:46

They will be lumped together,the contract notes show dates/prices paid.

[robertfaulkner] 26/6/2013 15:35

All my FGP shares are now lumped together in my Selftrade account, with a shown profit of £12200, maybe they will include the cost of the RI conversion later?

Has anyone else got their account, including all the FGP shares now lumped together, not showing the conversion cost?

[seccol] 26/6/2013 15:11

Depends if you sell what were the RI's,if you sell all by your figures you'd have a loss.
RI's only you have a profit...
All you have a loss.

[winston270] 26/6/2013 15:09

Robertfaulkner,

I don't think the statement below is strictly correct, it has diluted the shares a lot not a little, it hasn't been a free cash injection either as it will cost First Group millions in fee's. Additionally it has damaged First Group going back on previous announcements that they didn't need a cash call.....

'And remember a cash call RI although it dilutes the shares a little, it is a free, no interest cash injection into a company'

[robertfaulkner] 26/6/2013 15:06

How does Capital gains work with a RI, Selftrade showing my FGP 49800 new shares with a profit of £12200 this is because they haven't included the £26k I paid to convert the RI shares

I'm down around £14k overall

[seccol] 26/6/2013 15:04

Providing you stand on your head;-))

[winston270] 26/6/2013 15:04

Its got some life in it when it does move north

[miahkaysor] 26/6/2013 15:00

this will shoot up!!!!!

[robertfaulkner] 26/6/2013 14:55

Come on nearly blue, Only 0.12p down

[dr biotech] 26/6/2013 14:18

I doubt they would have sold short. Any sizeable short position has to be disclosed - given they were issuing new shares (which now make up 60% of the company) then we would have seen the RNS. It may be that they had agreements to sell on shares at discount to the share price on the day of the listing (ie Today) and that would explain the drop this morning.

Perhaps its my rose tinted specs, but I expect things to improve from here.

[batham1] 26/6/2013 14:01

New price is halfway between old price and RI price...is this a surprise?

[robertfaulkner] 26/6/2013 14:01

Mia, that's more like it, a bit of good old fashioned enthusiasm.

And remember a cash call RI although it dilutes the shares a little, it is a free, no interest cash injection into a company

[miahkaysor] 26/6/2013 13:50

can see ending in blue today.

[winston270] 26/6/2013 13:45

I'm thinking the share price will slowly move up from current low levels barring any more unexpected bad news of course. There is always a possibility we could see some takeover/merger speculation???

One catalysts that may get the share price really moving is some positive news coming from UK bus, where the recent fare initiatives are reaping rewards in terms of boost passenger journeys in conjunction with the network reviews recently being implement in Glasgow etc It's improved performance at the bigger subsidiaries in places such as Glasgow, Manchester, South & West Yorkshire that will help UK bus deliver an improved performance much quicker due to the scale of those op's......

Another possible positive would be that First Group has agreed with the Dft to extend the FGW franchise for a further 33 months on favourable terms rather than Directly Operated Railways taking it over until it's up for re-let as per the ECML. The cash flow would certainly help for another three years.......

[miata] 26/6/2013 13:20

Actually the underwriters will have sold short beforehand (which was one of the reasons behind the price drop) - they don't like risk.

[robertfaulkner] 26/6/2013 13:16

Thanks Anhar, very illuminating, any thoughts on FGP in month, will it be well up, moved nowhere or even lower. (from 93p now)

[anhar] 26/6/2013 10:48

...Still people getting out or the 12% of shares not taken up being sold by the underwriters, are they allowed to make a profit after being paid a fee to underwrite the shares (if they pay FGP 85p can they dump them for a 8p profit)

No, because the profit from any lapsed rights taken up and sold by underwriters has to be paid to those shareholders who allowed their rights to lapse. In this case 6p less costs.

So their reward is their fee, not any profit on lapsed rights sales. In fact they take some considerable risk that the share price falls below the rights price. In that case they would make a loss on selling any lapsed rights. And the number of lapsed rights is likely to be much greater in such a situation, compared with where the share price is above the rights price. Investors are hardly going to take up their rights if the ordinaries are cheaper.

So rights underwriting is not for the faint hearted though, like bookies laying off bets or insurers buying re-insurance, they may offer sub-underwriting of an issue to other people so as to spread the risks.

[slaterlpj] 26/6/2013 10:40

Well so much for any lapsed rights value, and so much for a RI at a "deep discount" to the share price pre-rights.

The share price is now at a VERY deep discount to the share price pre the RI. Shafted indeed.

[pyueck] 26/6/2013 10:09

rump placed at 91p. Shafted.

[careful] 26/6/2013 09:05

the share price implies that this company will never make 150m pre tax.
this should be a very easy target.

[miata] 26/6/2013 08:44

Watch the underwriters support the price.

[hassani2] 26/6/2013 08:29

The price obvious is going sub 85p

[miata] 26/6/2013 08:25

Temporary support level.
Time Price Quantity Type Bid Offer Buy/Sell
26/06/13 08:21 92.25 250,000 O 91.75 92.2 Buy
26/06/13 08:21 92.25 200,000 O 91.75 92.2 Buy

[careful] 26/6/2013 08:24

just to be contrary i have just bought at 92p.
it may work.
company has just raised 630m as is valued at a bit over 1bn.
this implies that before the announcement the company should have been valued at just 500m.
surely not.

it has to get down to work and it will take time and good management.
in the meantime the city traders will no doubt see it as fair game.

[y1phr] 26/6/2013 08:21

big spending cuts coming I am out.