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[neo26] 27/3/2019 18:52

The police case should be closed now, so the police files will be new evidence.If they will go for review.Chl requested comparative licenses for similar periods, roi objected, now we know why because lots of licenses were unclean and unclear. Roi will have all docs which they analysed, problem is they may have cleaned them.

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 18:42

What I don't get is how the ROI got away without filing a defence in the first place;
Del Trotters ICSID.

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 18:39

Neo

Lets wait and see what DQ says. Agree they were too respectful.

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 18:35

CC are a top firm; but should immediately raised their concern regarding the Minnotte case; they shouldn't have engaged at all with the Tribunal.

If the shoe was on the other foot; the ROI wouldn't of entertained the Minnotte case; they would not of complied; but did so because it was 'favourable' for them.

[wulber] 27/3/2019 18:29

I think gents, we all had too much confidence in ICSID including CHL and CC which we now know is as bent as a toilet u-bend!As said earlier by a poster, CHL will be desparately looking for options to keep the fight going, albeit not with ICSID, but the longer we wait, the more hope l have (if they can get funding) to take this to the wall.We have nothing more to lose after-all.Apart from my experience with Oxus and Parisian courts, l'm not sure what other avenues there are, but l'm certainly no expert.CC are top of their game being a magic circle law firm so l bow to their initiative and advice to CHL.Lets wait and see.Just pre-empting the next news that spring up on my PC..... admin or fight on!

[neo26] 27/3/2019 17:54

JackAnd with annulment being final what can we do about that?I think cc were too respectful of icsid.

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 16:35

triple post

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 16:35

Triple Post

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 16:35

Neo

I bet a breakdown comes nowhere near $9m; CHL should have got a breakdown and challenged it.

[jack1236] 27/3/2019 16:32

Andy

Exactly, in the Annulment there 'huge contradictions'; in the Award the Tribunal couldn't say for certain it was Ridlatama that were responsible for the 'forged licenses; but it was likely.

The Ad Hoc Committee says that the Tribunal found for cartain that it was Ridlatama.

There are lots of things we could do, set up a website with the facts; start a petition, email companies wanting to do business in Indonesia, speak to the British - Indonesia Association etc. We can be a real pain.

[neo26] 27/3/2019 16:29

There was no consequences of readmitting statements they threw out themselves.According to icsid, chl did no fraud but ridlatama and insider in govt. Govt got away with it and chl been punished, where is the justice?Imho the large legal bill of 9m was forced on us so it limits our avenues.Icsid know what they have done..Imho

[rutter] 27/3/2019 16:29

Question. Did any of CHL's cash end up in ROI coffers for licenses

[andy] 27/3/2019 16:06

neo,


Yes ICSID have thoroughly discredited themselves with these decisions, all political, they have just ridden roughshod over their own rules to arrive at a decision they wanted to make.


They are a disgrace in my opinion, no UK based company should ever go down the ICSID route again, IMO, go through Paris instead.

[neo26] 27/3/2019 16:02

Andy, it was jack who directed me to the article.Very interesting Curtis roi legal team didnt respond, while CC were very critical of icsid.

[andy] 27/3/2019 15:53

wulber,


Yes we should have asked them if their signatures were genuine when we signed the deal!


And, of course, they would have answered honestly!


So it has to be our fault.......

[rutter] 27/3/2019 15:52

you can bet your bottom dollar ( if you have any left) that all major parties are working full time to find a way forward.Forget ICSID . Other avenues will be pursued. The longer we wait, the more optimistic I will become that they are going to have another stab.I'm not tearing up my betting slip just yet

[wulber] 27/3/2019 15:46

Yep, CHL 100% to blame according to ICSID!Just hope CC can see a plausible avenue.I just wonder what timescale before we see our fate.

[andy] 27/3/2019 15:26

Neo,

Thanks fotr posting that, it sums uo the decision succinctly.


" The BIT legal system should balance the rights and obligations of investors and states and not apportion all of the consequences of third-party fraud to the investor and none to the state, especially after a valuable mineral resource has been de-risked for the benefit of the state.”



The "investors" being referred to above are CHL and Planet Mining.

[neo26] 27/3/2019 15:14

Clifford Chance partner Audley Sheppard QC, one of the lead counsel acting for Churchill in its annulment bid, says the outcome is “disappointing”, but that the investors “understand the deference given to the procedural decisions of the arbitral tribunal.” “However, it was hoped that the annulment committee would have taken the opportunity to engage more fully with the issues of state responsibility where the state itself was complicit in dishonesty.”

“The investors' failing was that when they bought their investment, they didn't notice that certain documents had been forged, notably with the assistance of local government officials. Indeed, the forgery was not raised until the hearing on jurisdiction, a year after the claim was filed. The BIT legal system should balance the rights and obligations of investors and states and not apportion all of the consequences of third-party fraud to the investor and none to the state, especially after a valuable mineral resource has been de-risked for the benefit of the state.”

[neo26] 27/3/2019 14:55

Sadly for me, i cant put anymore in.The hole is already too deep i dont think chl will come out of it.Imho

[rutter] 27/3/2019 13:41

Andy I would be interested in placing or rights issue

[neo26] 27/3/2019 12:41

Yes they are the no longer will be allowed in isa.