Cable & Wireless Share Discussion Threads

[rogermauricesmith] 08/5/2012 07:52

Deutsche Bank AG
Deutsche Bank is CW's own broker and its US share clearing house as far as I can make out. It has built up a 4% stake in CW whilst the share price has been going down.
In the middle of this it has been doing the same trick as UBS i.e. selling huge numbers of shares short and then buying them back in the same day.
The 4% Deutsche has somehow managed to acquire will be declared today by Deutsche one assumes (CW has already declared it).
This is very strange. Is CW buying its own shares?
What is going on?

[mikepompeyfan] 08/5/2012 07:48

No, l think Orbis should stop messing around potentially ruining things for the majority who would prefer the deal to go through. (I have no holding).

[careful] 08/5/2012 07:39

mike thinks marc is a loozer cause he cant spell.

[mikepompeyfan] 08/5/2012 07:08

loose   [loos] Show IPA adjective, loos·er, loos·est, adverb, verb loosed, loos·ing.
adjective
1.
free or released from fastening or attachment: a loose end.
2.
free from anything that binds or restrains; unfettered: loose cats prowling around in alleyways at night.
3.
uncombined, as a chemical element.
4.
not bound together: to wear one's hair loose.
5.
not put up in a package or other container: loose mushrooms.



lose   [looz] Show IPA verb, lost, los·ing.
verb (used with object)
1.
to come to be without (something in one's possession or care), through accident, theft, etc., so that there is little or no prospect of recovery: I'm sure I've merely misplaced my hat, not lost it.
2.
to fail inadvertently to retain (something) in such a way that it cannot be immediately recovered: I just lost a dime under this sofa.
3.
to suffer the deprivation of: to lose one's job; to lose one's life.
4.
to be bereaved of by death: to lose a sister.
5.
to fail to keep, preserve, or maintain: to lose one's balance; to lose one's figure.

[mark1000] 08/5/2012 01:34

Orbis having nothing to loose by playing this game if they have any sense they will be adding more shares at 32p to make a certain profit not in their interest ultimately to turn down the deal. They hope to attract counter bidders but if no counter bidders they will ultimately accept 38p there is no alternative as they have to do the best for their investors rather massage their own egos.

[pennypunter] 07/5/2012 22:41

VOD is not able to "cut a deal" with Orbis i.e. give them more than other holders. Orbis gets the same deal as everyone else. If they hold out for more and become minorities then VOD is under no obligation whatsoever and Orbis then have a major problem under IAS39 to ascertain "fair value" for their minority holding.

[the stinger] 07/5/2012 17:08

MikeStamp - It seems difficult for BOIX to move on,,,,especially if he's sold out. Probably the old dilemma of 'Should I of held on'. Happens to us all I suppose. Saying that there may be a chance to buy back in cheaper in the coming days?. As you say...who knows.

The bigger picture is that VOD will complete the deal.

[mikestamp] 07/5/2012 16:53

You might as well Boix, because you have no idea what's going on just like everyone else on here.

[boix] 07/5/2012 15:26

I give up.
Loose your money by all means
Regards

[the stinger] 07/5/2012 13:10

It's II's making easy money prior to the effective date hairy,,,and scaring PI's out at the same time.

[thehairydagger] 07/5/2012 12:25

Vod knew orbis and others would cause problems and thats why the 50% rule was added, why the share price is this low baffles me, thats why i've bought more and will be buying more.

[the stinger] 07/5/2012 12:05

Have a read below hairydagger - Effective date estimated for August

Just wish i had the spare funds,,,,,no brainer or what!


'Upon the Scheme becoming effective, it will be binding on all CWW Shareholders, irrespective of whether or not they attended or voted at the Court Meeting or the General Meeting'.

Further details of the Scheme, including an indicative timetable for its implementation, will be set out in the Scheme Document, which is expected to be despatched to CWW Shareholders as soon as reasonably practicable.

Vodafone reserves the right to elect to implement the acquisition of the CWW Shares by way of a takeover offer as an alternative to the Scheme. In such event, the acquisition will be implemented on substantially the same terms as those which would apply to the Scheme (subject to appropriate amendments, including an acceptance condition set at 90 per cent. of the shares to which such offer relates or such lesser percentage, being more than 50 per cent., as Vodafone may decide).

[thehairydagger] 07/5/2012 11:49

sting, that's the way i see it also.

[the stinger] 07/5/2012 11:33

VOD will go for takeover rules and gain the 50% vote required,, they already have a guaranteed 20%...and probably more than 40% now.. Orbis should cut a deal with VOD and put the matter to bed,, they have no real say in the matter now and reality will hit soon... Unless TATA re enter that is?, they are probably waiting to see. All in all 38p is safe money here in a few months and I cannot believe the current share price Bargain!

[the stinger] 07/5/2012 11:33

VOD will go for takeover rules and gain the 50% vote required,, they already have a guaranteed 20%...and probably more than 40% now.. Orbis should cut a deal with VOD and put the matter to bed,, they have no real say in the matter now and reality will hit soon... Unless TATA re enter that is?, they are probably waiting to see. All in all 38p is safe money here in a few months and I cannot believe the current share price Bargain!

[weatherman] 07/5/2012 10:29

Orbis could organise with a venture capital group to maximimse break up value ?

[careful] 07/5/2012 10:22

It seems ironic that the prospect of a falling market this summer makes 38p look generous.

[plastow] 07/5/2012 10:17

BOIX i think there was a bigger risk holding cw when there was no bid and with rumours that vod were not even going to bid .
i feel more confident scalping profit and re purchasing again ,if vod pull out there out for six mounths which i just cant see the logic ,,
Orbis my stay as holders in a swap for vod shares ,which gives vod full control,
Are people going to vote NO and just watch this drift to 10p mmm NOT ,,i think vod are playing a real good blinder here which in a few weeks 38p will look a good offer,,

[boix] 06/5/2012 19:43

Vod can't improve the bid unless there is a counter bid - fact.
That's the gamble - will tata or anyone else make an offer?
That's the risk.
In my view there will be no counter bid and this will drag out until nov.
The market seems to agree with me but good luck to you all but realise there is a LOT of risk in holding.

[diku] 06/5/2012 13:21

Call & Put postions are differnt to Long & Short CFD's.....most PI's tend to deal with CFD's Long or Short....only the so called professional/Intitutional traders tend to be into Call & Put positions of shares or Indexes as they are based of a strike price on a future specific date...

[the stinger] 06/5/2012 12:49

RMS - agreed and would not be surprised if TATA re-enter bidding at 40pish..especially if they get Orbis on side.

[diku] 06/5/2012 12:48

7kiwi...below from your earlier post could you please explain how you make money in either way as a long & a short position would just cross out each other hence a flat position....even a stop loss would trigger a flat position...I am lost!....


YOu can open mirroring spreadbet positions. Say long at 33p with a stop loss at 31p and short at 33p with a stop loss at 35p. Then if the share price moves out of the 31-35p boundaqry, you make money either way.

[rogermauricesmith] 06/5/2012 12:31

Boix
Even though I don't agree with your view, but you have inadvertently succinctly summarised the situation in a few words.
Put that way it is very unlikely that the long-term institutional shareholders are going to agree to sell for 38p. Certainly not the 75% Vodafone needs. So Vodafone is obviously going to somehow sweeten the bid to get them on side.
Vodafone is surely not going to let go of this for just a hundred and fifty million pounds and that is all it is going to take to get this past everyone.
You talk as though the heavens will have to fall before Vodafone makes any gesture to get its bid through. I can't believe that - mind you I still can't believe there won't be a counter bid.

[az209] 06/5/2012 11:45

It's amazing isn't it that some people that have sold just have to hang about to give curent holders the benefit of their wisdom. Are they looking for comments to justify their actions ?

If so well done to all those that sold out !

There now, happy ?