Shell Share Discussion Threads

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 22:20

It's actually slander to infer Seplat has problem with theft or corruption just because it happens elsewhere. You don't need to 'say it', inferring your lack of surprise is enough.

There is no evidence, no facts, no basis to imply any such thing.

And I think Dukedosh has held Seplat longer than I have.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 21:41

@Dukedosh.

Only lost smalls Mart Resources side, so dont feel pain as much as yourself - sorry to hear vut I'm sure I'm experiencing similar elsewhere Oilie side.

Concur with what a dishonest bunch they were. As are both the "indigenous Nigerian Oil companies" looking to snaffle the company on the cheap. ie Mart's indigenous partners!

"along with their partners in crime MWO+G, Suncrest, et al. Nigeria will always be the cesspit of cesspits for business, as far I can see. What you see is rarely what you get. All imo, of course."

Ah so you concur with me..

Watch out for Whiskey smearing you with claims of prejudice though, rather than actually providing any "facts and evidence" himself!!

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 21:35

I'm not ranting at all.

I'm disputing your erroneous claim that my comment was based on prejudice and not cold hard facts!

And note I did NOT claim that Seplat actually experienced theft but that it wouldnt surprise me given how prevalent it was in the industry across the board.

All backed up with facts.

If you make false accusations don't be surprised when someone calls you up on it!!

p.s I've also lived in Nigeria, so seen evidence of it first hand. Have you?

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 21:29

I didn't dispute theft was quite a problem.

In fact I pointed out Seplat bought assets BECAUSE other companies had a problem with theft. Seplat had a plan to stop the theft and that has rather been successful. No more bunkering.

But still on you rant.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 21:11

Here's more evidence (or what you'd call prejudice) for you...

Nigeria oil theft: The crude cost
Posted by Segun Osuntokun on 31.01.2014

"There is pervasive fraud and corruption in Nigeria’s oil industry enabling theft that is causing Nigeria’s economy substantial damage."


"Pervasive" - suggest you look up the definition!

"No one knows how much crude oil theft is really costing the country"

"But the theft is so serious, pervasive and sophisticated that it is causing grave damage to Nigeria’s economy."

"It is estimated that between 100,000 to 350,000 barrels per day, out of Nigeria’s daily production of approximately two million barrels, are being stolen."

WHOA!!!!! How much.

So Mart clearly gets hit to a greater degree....but 100-350,000bopd!
350,000bopd or 17.5%!

It's widespread. Fact.

Facts as I said.

Suggest you look up that word as well!

Zero prejudice, just cold hearted facts.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 21:03

Shell? Mart?
How many others.

Where's the prejudice?

Read your quote - you clearly don't understand what it says...

forming a prejudgment before becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case

My judgement about Nigerian Oil market is based POST facts, not pre facts. It is based on knowledge of actual theft, widespread, hence there is reason to make the statement I did.

It isn't unreasonable, based on the facts, for any rational individual to conclude such theft isn't specific to just Shell,or Mart, but is experienced by a plethora of other companies experiencing similar.

Yet all you can do is shout prejudice. No facts. No evidence

English isn't your first language is it clearly because if it was you'd understand what the sentence you quoted actually meant!!!

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 20:46

Mart may be losing 17-21% oil to bunkering theft. But not all companies are.

Oh dear. More prejudice.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 18:58

It isn't prejudice at all.

My comments were based on factual evidence.

Prejudice is, as you scribble, "forming a prejudgment before becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case
I make my claim based on FACTS that theft is prevalent in Nigeria to extent that 17-21% of daily production is stolen by light fingered Nigerians.

Ergo I make my claim POST becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case, where the relevant facts are "Nigerian Oil theft is rampant, many companies are subject to it,hence I wont invest in the region any longer!"

Facts, facts.

Prejudice would have been to claim that theft by light fingered Nigerians of Oil without any evidence to back that claim up!!! Which is exactly your quote.

I have given you plenty of facts

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 18:46

No it's prejudice:

"Prejudice is prejudgment, or forming an opinion before becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case."

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 18:18

.WhiskeyInTheJar 26 Oct'15 - 18:10 - 4346 of 4346 0 0

I know about the problem with oil theft in Nigeria. It's pretty much why Shell sold onshore assets I believe.

Great so why accuse me of prejudice when I am merely highlighting facts you already know!!!

So very pointless quoting articles saying other companies experience theft.

Because you accused me of making comment based on prejudice - I made them based on fact! As I illustrated. So there was every point of highlighting them

You are jumping to conclusions because Seplat operate in same country they have the same problems. That's your prejudice right there.

I never said they definitely did - I said given so many others do experience such theft, it therefore wouldn't be surprising if they did as well.

That's not prejudice that's just being forewarned having been subject to such theft several times already in Nigeria and is a conclusion any rational person would draw given the propensity of theft in the country!

Can you not see the difference?

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 18:10

I know about the problem with oil theft in Nigeria. It's pretty much why Shell sold onshore assets I believe.

But it's also why Seplat buys onshore assets. That's the whole point. That's their business model. They get them cheap because of theft, then they stop the theft. Bingo.

So very pointless quoting articles saying other companies experience theft. I know that. Seplat doesn't. No Oil theft:

Seplat Sees No Oil Theft in Nigeria, Where Shell Lost $1 Billion



You are jumping to conclusions because Seplat operate in same country they have the same problems. That's your prejudice right there.

I also know about the wider problems with the Nigerian economy and Nigerian oil industry. But guess what? Everyone does. It's in the price. That's why the yield on Seplat is nearly 10%.

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 17:11

I'm not trying to convince you to buy Seplat, you brought up Nigeria.

But you keep repeating the same misinformation and prejudice. Seplat are NOT losing production to theft. Not.

And if shareholders are being scammed by management, it's an odd sort of scam because management would be scamming themselves. The CEO owns nearly 20% of shares himself and they are delivering a healthy dividend to shareholders so very odd scam.

You never really know what goes on in companies, it's always a risk. I take every investment with pinch of salt, but I'm quite happy with a pinch of Seplat.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 15:53

@Whiskey,

As ianood says - Seplat is a Nigerian Oil company! Take their comment with a pinch of salt.

Not only is there Afren - bust. Mart Resources loses 17-21% of daily production to "theft" as another example. Check out the price chart. painful.Subject to selling itself to a "local Nigerian buyer" so the bid has been chopped once already for 80c to 35c or whatever it was. Yet another Nigerian scam!

Nigeria is bargepole territory. Two small losses.That's enough for me - no interest in Seplat,no LekOil, Nigerians are, shall we say, very light fingered. I say that having had a parent live there for 5 years as well :)

[ianood] 26/10/2015 14:33

WITJ- not being cynical but that, "Seplat Sees No Oil Theft in Nigeria" statement is from a Nigerian Oil Co! I remember AFR too well!

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 14:13

Doesn't justify theft, but I'm told that Shell didn't treat Nigeria very well either. So when they had an oil spill they just set fire to it leaving the land permanently unusable.

I own Seplat who have been buying up on shore Nigeria assets from likes of Shell. They don't have the oil theft problem Shell had.

Seplat Sees No Oil Theft in Nigeria, Where Shell Lost $1 Billion


Share price is beaten down like most oiliers, but dividend is bigger than Shell and they have a gas growth story.

Not sure how much gas Shell has in Nigeria, but gas prices have been increased substantially in Nigeria to encourage companies to develop them.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 13:46

Yeah Brazil/Ozstralia relatively safe,certainly not subject to the rampant thievery that goes on in high cost Nigeria.

Certainly paid top whack though. Busy week for Oil majors...:)

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 13:43

Yes, interesting I think that rationale of BG deal isn't just about the LNG.

[fangorn2] 26/10/2015 13:33

Agree Whiskey, and those that do are in war zones, or unstable countries run by despots!

[whiskeyinthejar] 26/10/2015 13:25

'Shell has few growth options with strong economics except the low-cost Brazilian oil it is acquiring from BG (BG.) '



But to be fair, IMHO there aren't that many huge undeveloped assets that can break even below $30-$35 per barrel.

[grupo guitarlumber] 25/10/2015 16:42

On Thursday, October 29, 2015 at 07.00 GMT (08.00 CET and 03.00 EDT) Royal Dutch Shell plc will release its third quarter results and third quarter interim dividend announcement for 2015.

These announcements will be available on

[diku] 24/10/2015 21:59

Does anybody know what was the price of Oil at the time of the BG deal announcement compared to price of Oil today?...did RDSB price BG on the basis of higher Oil price?...